Black in Latin America- Ep. 1- Haiti & the Dominican Republic- An Island Divided

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Dark_Scorpion

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Despite all that, I think America IS a melting pot. At the end of the day, they all are Americans.

America is a melting pot.......but White people sit on top of that pot, and the richest of these Whites will not mix with people outside their sociial/racial class. If you don't believe that, watch the movie below. It shows you who the richest Americans are, and how they run the USA:

The One Percent - YouTube
 

Dark_Scorpion

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1USD = 40RD once again in 2013 how is that working for them?

Not good. And a book I recently read indicates that things are unlikely to get better......any time in the foreseeable future. The DR is in a lot of trouble. Not as much trouble as Syria or Libya, but a lot of trouble nonetheless.
 

Dark_Scorpion

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My wife's entire family has a distinct Spanish heritage. Many in Santiago and environs do. There are folks in the mountains around San Jose de las Matas and Janico (to name two I'm very familiar with) with blue eyes.

16% of Dominicans are "Caucasian." I'd say most have a direct heritage from Spain. Additionally, around 75% MOL are "mixed" which implies that many also have lineage to Spain.

I read about these Dominicans; they're the people that run the DR.
 

Dark_Scorpion

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Certainly they can call themselves whatever they want.

But it shows a desire to NOT jump into the melting pot, a desire for separation.

That does nothing for cultural peace and harmony, and a common goal for the future. Isn't that what the "melting pot" was supposed to be all about?

No Cobraboy, you are mistaken. The melting pot was never about peace and harmony, it was about control. Let me enlighten you on American history. Historically, Whites in America have done everything in their power to keep their country White, or as White as possible. Early in America's history, Whites were alarmed at the possibility of a combined Native American/Black revolt in which they would be crushed. To ensure this didn't happen, Whites did a few things. First, they created an immigration policy where they accepted mass immigration from Europe. This occurred during the 19th century. Second, Whites in America restricted immigration from non-Europeans, and ended the slave trade.

Third, Whites played Native Americans against Blacks, encouraging Native Americans to own slaves, which many did. As I've said before, the richest and most powerful White families in America do not participate in the melting pot. They do not marry outside their race or social circle. That practice is reserved for non-Whites and lower class Whites. By the way, a book I read on the DR has recently revealed that, since the 1980s, the U.S. has been restricting the immigration of Dominicans into the USA as well. That was just something I thought I'd throw in.
 

Dark_Scorpion

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not true, Snake. my buddy is a very dark skinned guy from Barbados who lives in Ottawa. he went to a disco in Santiago, and the bouncer, who is shades darker than he is, looked him up and down, and simply said "NO". I know that it is going to be instinctive for some guys here to think that this guy has hood rat qualities and demeanour, which caused the bouncer to be skeptical, but nothing could be farther from the truth. this is a guy brimful of class, and style. actually, one quality he displays is a tendency to overt materialism, and he always dresses in the kind of expensive clothes i would never even think of buying. the bouncer dispatched him, for the simple reason that his pigment was not acceptable. let's not put any spin on it; the DR is a pigmentocracy.

You're right, the DR certainly is, and the Whites/Spaniards are on top of that pigmentocracy, as is the case in Brazil with the White Brazilians. Many of the fools on this thread want us to believe in a "color blind" society, a racial democracy. This is a fantasy, a pipe dream that doesn't exist. I will make this simple for everyone reading this that believes in this fairy tale. In the USA, White Americans run the show. In Brazil, White Brazilians run the show. Here in the DR, it is the Dominicans of Spanish descent that run the show. At the bottom of that "show" are Blacks. Everyone else, mixed, indio, whatever, are somewhere in between. That is how the system works, and that is how it has worked for centuries.
 

Dark_Scorpion

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If you were to just skim through any history book of the island, you will notice that the Dominicans are not the belligerent ones that felt the need to control their neighbors. All the wars we have fought against Haiti were reactionary to their aggression, not vice versa. Every single one. Had they never attempted to invade, there would had never been a war against them. Plus, every war was always in defense of our territorial and cultural integrity, which is why in every war against the Haitians, Dominicans desisted once the Haitians crossed onto their side of the island. If we truly wanted to get rid of them, we could had invaded their country as they did to us, but we didn't in the past and it will never occur in the future.

Dominicans have never cared what Haitians did or how they lived on their side. Its their country and they can do what the they want over there. The problem is that we were not really given the same courtesy for many years. There was always a foreign power that wanted to stick their noses where it was never invited and that caused many of the problems.

Learn the history before assuming things about this island. Or better yet, whatever you are assuming, the complete opposite is probably true.

Why didn't Dominicans invade the Haitian side? I always wondered about that. You know......I've heard a certain rumor that the waters off Haiti have more oil than Venezuela, it is probably just a rumor though. If I were the Dominicans back in those days, and I had the power, I would have considered an invasion of Haiti. Look at it this way, if the DR invaded Haiti and won, they would achieve three things. First, they wouldn't have to worry about Haiti invading anymore. Second, they would have the entire island to themselves. Third, any resources off the Haitian coast would belong to the DR.

I think most of history's greatest conquerors(Alexander, Napoleon, Hannibal, etc), would have gone on the offensive and invaded Haiti. I would have done it. I just believe problems should be solved permanently. And a successful Dominican invasion of Haiti would make the DR better off. But you Dominicans didn't do it and it is water under the bridge. Even if you wanted to do it today, the USA would never allow it, Both the USA and international community would respond...........unpleasantly.
 

Dark_Scorpion

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The ugliest scene I ever saw was when my ex Dominican wife and son were two black Dominicans in a store in an all white suburban neighborhood in the USA. I look mixed with the classic Puerto Rico complexion. An old, angry white lady looked at them and called them the N word and went on a rant about black people. I eventually would tell her to go to hell and she would shut up. While she was going on a rant about them being N%$@#@s who cut her in line, my ex wife and son spoke spanish to me about the lady and the lady said ok you are N^&$s who speak spanish. My ex wife had only been here for three weeks. She immediately learned that she is a N%$#@ in the USA. She quickly learned that she is black here and called back to the DR and schooled her family on the USA putting people as black but in the DR they say Brown or even white in a lot of cases or mixed. She knew she was black by the USA standards and that never left her head. My son bonds with black people and just like he is Dominican he says black because the whites in school would fight the blacks and his skin was black. He does not like Haitians but does bond with all blacks except for Haitians due to his negative experiences in a racist school system in the USA.

Yikes! That is one cruel way for Dominicans to learn where they rank in American society. Yes, you are quite correct, there are plenty of red necks in the USA who will be happy to inform any visiting Dominicans of exactly what they think of them. Unfortunately, many Dominicans who visit the USA for the first time may be given a rude awakening.

Also, as I said previously, the American government over the last couple of decade has changed its immigration policy towards Dominicans. Not only is the USA restricting the number of Dominicans they allow into the country, they are also deporting many as well. This information comes from a recent book I read on the DR. If I were Dominicans, I would not settle down in the USA. I would go there, milk that fat cow for as much as I can, and then bring that money back home to the DR to start a business here. I read about this Dominican guy that did it. He runs a hotel somewhere on the island. He made his money in the USA but he got tired of the racist BS and relocated to the DR and opened a hotel. Very smart man.
 

Dark_Scorpion

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All it is is that the Spanish handled their colonies by mixing everything up into one culture and being prideful. The English were more arrogant, harsh, mean and racist. They were all about being racist and putting people with a drop or two of non british blood at the bottom of everything. They killed off the indians instead of mixing them into society like the Spanish did. The english were harsh on the indians in india and any colony they had. Now in America they take that same old school British attitude and try to say everyone who is not full blooded european, white, straight and male has something wrong with them. Just like the English took the scottish and irish in europe and put them beneath them in their system. America is very racist because their roots are from England. The Spanish former colonies are more prideful and less racist than the English because their ways are from Spain.

The Spanish were no kinder than the British; they just used different methods to achieve the same ends, which is power and control. Creating a racial caste system is just as bad as separating a group based on a drop of non-British blood. As I've said, the Spaniards kept their own bloodlines pure, the racial mixing was for the under class. How do I know this? Because I've read history. There was a dictator of Paraguay, his name was Jose Gaspar Rodrigo de Francia. During his reign in Paraguay, he passed a law banning the Spanish from marrying each other. The Spanish were forced to intermarry with the Amerindians, Blacks, and Mestizos.

The reason Francia passed laws forcing the Spanish to mix is because he knew it would weaken them. He knew he could break their control of Paraguay. Racial mixing doesn't make people stronger, it makes them weaker. This is why the Japanese have traditionally been so hostile to interracial unions, because they have sense enough to know it threatens the integrity of their people and island, and to be honest, I don't blame the Japanese, because I know from studying history that racial mixing has been used as a weapon.
 

ExtremeR

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Umm, your Dominican friend reminds me alot of AA's drinking Colt 45 and molt liquor, at 10 in the morning. I personally saw this with my own eyes, as I clerked in the local neighborhood "Bodega" while I went to school in the States.

What JMB773 forgot to tell you is that it was a Sunday and the Dominican was on his way to the beach at 10:00 AM when he "catched" him drinking beer...
 

Dark_Scorpion

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What's so funny? Trujillo DID declare war on Germany...

I find it hilarious that Trujillo would even think of the DR fighting Germany. OMG.......it took a coalition of some of the most powerful nations in the world to stop Germany, it took them four years to do it. And Russia alone lost at least 10 million men in their attempt to stop the German push into Russia, the very idea that Trujillo would think the DR could stand against Germany at that time is very comical.

I'll put it like this......German technology during World War 2 would be sufficient to crush the Dominican Republic today, in 2013, let alone back then. Germany was so advanced militarily during WW2 that even the u.S. was amazed by what they found. I've heard that some of the technology uncovered in Germany after WW2 is still classified today. Trujillo's declaration of war on Germany was more ceremonial than anything else, the Germans could have eviscerated the entire island of Hispaniola with less than 1/10 of their navy/airforce.
 

the gorgon

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I find it hilarious that Trujillo would even think of the DR fighting Germany. OMG.......it took a coalition of some of the most powerful nations in the world to stop Germany, it took them four years to do it. And Russia alone lost at least 10 million men in their attempt to stop the German push into Russia, the very idea that Trujillo would think the DR could stand against Germany at that time is very comical.

I'll put it like this......German technology during World War 2 would be sufficient to crush the Dominican Republic today, in 2013, let alone back then. Germany was so advanced militarily during WW2 that even the u.S. was amazed by what they found. I've heard that some of the technology uncovered in Germany after WW2 is still classified today. Trujillo's declaration of war on Germany was more ceremonial than anything else, the Germans could have eviscerated the entire island of Hispaniola with less than 1/10 of their navy/airforce.

of course it was symbolic, or, as you put it, ceremonial. he never as much as threw a rock, afterwards.
 

cobraboy

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No Cobraboy, you are mistaken. The melting pot was never about peace and harmony, it was about control. Let me enlighten you on American history. Historically, Whites in America have done everything in their power to keep their country White, or as White as possible. Early in America's history, Whites were alarmed at the possibility of a combined Native American/Black revolt in which they would be crushed. To ensure this didn't happen, Whites did a few things. First, they created an immigration policy where they accepted mass immigration from Europe. This occurred during the 19th century. Second, Whites in America restricted immigration from non-Europeans, and ended the slave trade.

Third, Whites played Native Americans against Blacks, encouraging Native Americans to own slaves, which many did. As I've said before, the richest and most powerful White families in America do not participate in the melting pot. They do not marry outside their race or social circle. That practice is reserved for non-Whites and lower class Whites. By the way, a book I read on the DR has recently revealed that, since the 1980s, the U.S. has been restricting the immigration of Dominicans into the USA as well. That was just something I thought I'd throw in.
A culture doesn't have to inter-marry to create a "melting pot."

Culture isn't necessarily about bloodlines.

The US does not "restrict" Dominicans. They "restrict" fraud.
 

Naked_Snake

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The Haitian elite had no trouble embracing their blackness so it wasn't a problem there.

The Haitian elite might pay lip service to "blackness", but one would have to be very naive to ignore the strained relationship they have had with the black masses there. One only need to see the fact that they had a very brutal civil war just before the Napoleonic expedition of 1802 (War of Knives, 1799-1800) or the fact that just after Dessalines was assassinated in 1806 the country would be divided between a mulatto republic in the south led by Alexandre Petion and a black kingdom in the north led by Henri Christophe. And even today one could say that the only thing between them and getting their knives slit is the UN constabulary forces currently stationed there.
 

the gorgon

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The Haitian elite might pay lip service to "blackness", but one would have to be very naive to ignore the strained relationship they have had with the black masses there. One only need to see the fact that they had a very brutal civil war just before the Napoleonic expedition of 1802 (War of Knives, 1799-1800) or the fact that just after Dessalines was assassinated in 1806 the country would be divided between a mulatto republic in the south led by Alexandre Petion and a black kingdom in the north led by Henri Christophe. And even today one could say that the only thing between them and getting their knives slit is the UN constabulary forces currently stationed there.

that, my friend, is the truth.
 

NALs

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JMB773 said:
Vacanodr if you look a the woman who represents the DR in the Miss Universe contest she is ALWAYS super white.
<iframe width="480" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/s7Scud0-9SM?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

:rolleyes:
 

NALs

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Jan 20, 2003
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Also, as I said previously, the American government over the last couple of decade has changed its immigration policy towards Dominicans. Not only is the USA restricting the number of Dominicans they allow into the country, they are also deporting many as well. This information comes from a recent book I read on the DR.
The opposite is true. Immigration restrictions have been eased and many more Dominicans are getting visas for even up to 10 years. This is a response to a study the US Embassy did and discovered that the fraud rate that was expected for Dominicans was exaggerated. Also, Dominican emigration to the US has been continually decreasing for quite a few years.

This was even proven here on DR1, so do a search and you will find the thread.

Its incredible how a thread based on a video filled with misleading information about the DR, is also revealing all sorts of other misinformation that has been spread about Dominicans.

Also, citing books without mentioning their title and author is not really proper, to say the least.
 
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