The fleecing has already begun

ExtremeR

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One of the reasons why the Haitian rebuilding cannot be left to Haitians alone, the corruption is huge over there, even huger than in the DR. The individualism shown by them is outstanding, when Dominicans and USA hospitals are tending their injured they are charging to help their own while getting free medicines and payroll being paid by aid donations. Those clinics owners should be prosecuted and be putted next to the Americans children traffickers in jail. What a shame.

Thanks for the link Chip.
 

M.A.R.

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Feb 18, 2006
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One of the reasons why the Haitian rebuilding cannot be left to Haitians alone, the corruption is huge over there, even huger than in the DR. The individualism shown by them is outstanding, when Dominicans and USA hospitals are tending their injured they are charging to help their own while getting free medicines and payroll being paid by aid donations. Those clinics owners should be prosecuted and be putted next to the Americans children traffickers in jail. What a shame.

Thanks for the link Chip.

Geeez someone has to step and teach some of these people some ethics.......otherwise this country will only sink deeper.......I agree put them in the same cell as the children traffickers.:mad:
 

InsanelyOne

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Oct 21, 2008
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Geeez someone has to step and teach some of these people some ethics.......otherwise this country will only sink deeper.......I agree put them in the same cell as the children traffickers.:mad:

Show me a dirt poor developing country with ethics.... they don't exist. It's human nature to take what one can get when one has nothing.

It won't change.
 

Chip

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Jul 25, 2007
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It's human nature to take what one can get when one has nothing.

I think we can rule out that the owners of these clinics and hsopitals have "nothing".

What we have here has nothing to do with poverty and everything to do with a basic lack of respect of one's fellow man - period.
 

cobraboy

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Jul 24, 2004
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Show me a dirt poor developing country with ethics.... they don't exist. It's human nature to take what one can get when one has nothing.

It won't change.
Which is why patronage works so well as a political system in the DR.
 

BushBaby

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I think we can rule out that the owners of these clinics and hsopitals have "nothing".

What we have here has nothing to do with poverty and everything to do with a basic lack of respect of one's fellow man - period.
I am sorry Chip - I searched that report & the ancillaries & could find NO suggestion that "The Owners of the Hospitals" were the ones putting the charges on to medications (& possibly treatment).

I will gladly accept that (because they are the owners & therefore responsible) that the owners should be held to account & ensure the hospital staff does not partake in such monstrous behaviour PLUS I would condemn the owners if they were responsible for such flagrant 'profiteering'.

As the sources were 'unable to identify' which hospitals were carrying out these charges & who had instituted them, maybe we should wait for that information before 'slagging off the owners' just for the sake of it. One thing is for certain, this will not be the ONLY rumor about 'fleecing' &/or corruption to come out of Haiti over the next year or so!! :rolleyes: :cry:~ Grahame.
 
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Pobre Haitianos, the country should be divided into zones administrated by different countries with el Gobierno Dominicano participating in the coordination efforts. Pobrecitos que mal los tratan, they are treated better in DR. No wonder Sonia Pierre doesn't want to be Haitian.
 
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woofsback

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well said

the country should be divided into zones administrated by different countries

from what i've seen and heard so far, this statement makes the most sense and probably offers the best lifeline to haitia....
only thing i would add would be that each participating country would have to abide by the agreed upon rules of governing and it be equal accross the country.
i feel this would give the country a stonger stucture where the inhabitants can establish strong roots from which to build thier lives.
having the country seperated into small sections...the efforts could be directed better, the gangs can be better controlled until the polce or military can get a grip on the troubles...and a one year project wou;dn't be enuf so they better be in it for the long haul..
 

el santi

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the country should be divided into zones administrated by different countries


Makes me wonder, who would like to live in the particular zone administered by the corrupt Dominican government?
 

Fernandez

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No matter how you slice it, the Haitian condition is a cultural one- more akin to tribal management than national/institutional political structures that are evident elsewhere. Unfortunately, it is hard to understand and explain unless one has experienced the depth and degree of rampant corruption and despair that exists, and the lack of alternatives that would provide for a long term solution to the problems that have for years existed there. It has been a failed nation state for decades, the source of and continuing supply of little more than a decayed human condition. This earthquake has added immeasurably to the misery and despair; and while aid will be diverted and stolen, some will reach the needy and make a difference- hopefully.
 

TOOBER_SDQ

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Nov 19, 2008
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Pobre Haitianos, the country should be divided into zones administrated by different countries ..............

No disrespect intended, but that?s a horrible idea and would be a very hasty solution. Remember, Haiti is a sovereign nation. We have a right to offer money and aid, but have absolutely zero right to divide them up and administer their country.

The idea of cutting up pieces and doling them out is reminiscent of post war Germany (Berlin Wall), in the sense that it seemed like a good idea at the time for the people, security etc.... Well it wasn?t a good idea.

This idea also has a stink of Imperialism. Okay, let?s help them recover from this recent disaster with $upport. After that, let them fix their country on their own. It?s their right.

Imperialists in the past chose to cut up and territories as they saw fit, and sometimes with good intentions and with what they thought was in the best interest of the inhabitants. Example - Almost every country in West Africa. It rarely works out well, with the exception of Ghana.

You can?t change them. They need the change to come from within, and that will probably not happen in our lifetimes sorry to say.
 

Chip

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Jul 25, 2007
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I am sorry Chip - I searched that report & the ancillaries & could find NO suggestion that "The Owners of the Hospitals" were the ones putting the charges on to medications (& possibly treatment).

I will gladly accept that (because they are the owners & therefore responsible) that the owners should be held to account & ensure the hospital staff does not partake in such monstrous behaviour PLUS I would condemn the owners if they were responsible for such flagrant 'profiteering'.

As the sources were 'unable to identify' which hospitals were carrying out these charges & who had instituted them, maybe we should wait for that information before 'slagging off the owners' just for the sake of it. One thing is for certain, this will not be the ONLY rumor about 'fleecing' &/or corruption to come out of Haiti over the next year or so!! :rolleyes: :cry:~ Grahame.

I didn't know you worked for the UN, jeje? At any rate, you've almost convinced me that stealing from poor people is ok. :)
 
?

? bient?t

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I didn't know you worked for the UN, jeje? At any rate, you've almost convinced me that stealing from poor people is ok. :)

What? Next time you want to post something like this, run it by Padrino Papabear in Jarabacoa first; I'm sure he's fair and balanced, and won't let you post stuff like this.
 

BushBaby

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I didn't know you worked for the UN, jeje? At any rate, you've almost convinced me that stealing from poor people is ok. :)

What ARE you jabbering on about Chip? Your response makes absolutely no sense when set against my post!!

Whatever juice you are on today may I suggest you change it to another? This one is obviously making you hallucinate! :rolleyes: :ermm: ~ Grahame.
 

RacerX

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Nov 22, 2009
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No disrespect intended, but that?s a horrible idea and would be a very hasty solution. Remember, Haiti is a sovereign nation. We have a right to offer money and aid, but have absolutely zero right to divide them up and administer their country.

The idea of cutting up pieces and doling them out is reminiscent of post war Germany (Berlin Wall), in the sense that it seemed like a good idea at the time for the people, security etc.... Well it wasn?t a good idea.

This idea also has a stink of Imperialism. Okay, let?s help them recover from this recent disaster with $upport. After that, let them fix their country on their own. It?s their right.

Imperialists in the past chose to cut up and territories as they saw fit, and sometimes with good intentions and with what they thought was in the best interest of the inhabitants. Example - Almost every country in West Africa. It rarely works out well, with the exception of Ghana.

You can?t change them. They need the change to come from within, and that will probably not happen in our lifetimes sorry to say.

The road to hell is paved with good intentions. They didnt cut up those territorities with good intentions. They did it to take advantage of cultural familial and tribal differences. This would unification and coordination against colonialist difficult because they imperials could always stoke the fires of minor differences to the oppressed people at bay, all the time. That was the reason for the caste system in India and here in the Spanish speaking Americas. If you consistently create dissencion and diversions then it is easier to walk away with the goods, literally. There is no reason why the countries in South America, the Caribe nor Africa have to be so poor when they are chock full of natural resources while most European countries dont have any but have an incredibly high GDP. Someone is playing slight of hand or 3 Card Monte real good, dont you think?
 
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Chip

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Looks like the local Haitians aren't the only ones scalping.

I'm here in PAP and just got finished volunteering at a local clinic and had one of the volunteer medical teams from Oregon tell me the WHO has started to charge them for medicine they previously were giving to NGO's. The worse of it is they tell me the WHO is selling medicine which was donated to them.

These people have worked and volunteered all over the world and say the WHO is replete with corruption and even pay their middle of the road functionaries US250 an hour.

This is a stark contrast to these numerous medical teams that come here from all over, religious and non religious alike on their own dime. Not only that, some are spending considerable amounts of vacation time or missing work to do this. Cheers to them.
 

Chip

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The director of the disaster relief coordination for the Quisqueya Christiqan school told me the WHO is charging non registered NGO's for medicine that was donated to them. I believe I had it backwards.

Nonetheless, it is a shame because there are many, many groups that came here right after the tragedy who are now having to pay for the medicine they donate to the Haitians in addition to covering all the other costs in order to be able to do such a valuable job.
 

pedrochemical

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The director of the disaster relief coordination for the Quisqueya Christiqan school told me the WHO is charging non registered NGO's for medicine that was donated to them. I believe I had it backwards.

Nonetheless, it is a shame because there are many, many groups that came here right after the tragedy who are now having to pay for the medicine they donate to the Haitians in addition to covering all the other costs in order to be able to do such a valuable job.


It is a shame - but "non-registered NGOs" is basically every Tom Dick and Harriet that fancies having a go. Some good, some bad.
I can understand that when somebody turns up out of the blue asking for supplies for free that it would be a legitimate concern about what was happening to these supplies - whether they were being used for their intended purpose or not.
Get registered and you get free supplies? Seems sensible to me.

After all we see what happens when people just pile in there and start helping themselves - they end up in jail for offenses such as child trafficking.