Page 1 of 12 12311 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 114

Thread: Charlie Rose - Update on Haiti

  1. #1
    Poll's Forum Moderator
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    8,340
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default Charlie Rose - Update on Haiti

    I don't know if this has been posted here, but in case it hasn't here it is.

    Charlie Rose - Update on Haiti

  2. #2
    Platinum
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    30,629
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    But I bet they had held some amazing Committee meetings and have passed and printed (quadriplicate) some awesome resolutions.

    Delivered, of course, in the air conditioned comfort of brand new Prados.

  3. #3
    Silver
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    3,378
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by cobraboy View Post
    But I bet they had held some amazing Committee meetings and have passed and printed (quadriplicate) some awesome resolutions.

    Delivered, of course, in the air conditioned comfort of brand new Prados.
    You are obviously jealous.

  4. #4
    Silver
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    3,378
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by cobraboy View Post
    But I bet they had held some amazing Committee meetings and have passed and printed (quadriplicate) some awesome resolutions.

    Delivered, of course, in the air conditioned comfort of brand new Prados.

    Dude!
    That interview was a reporter and an academic talking about the state of play 6 months after the earthquake.
    Your comment mentions "they".
    Who?
    Charlie Rose?
    The reporter?
    The Academic?

    What is your obsession with criticising something that, not only do you know nothing about, you do not even care enough about the subject to watch the video clip.

    You are better than this normally.

    The offer is still open.
    If you want to put your money where your mouth is then come here and do some good. We can point you in the right direction - you would run screaming, traumatised like most people maybe but at least you would have learned something.

  5. #5
    Bronze
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    1,341
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    More to the point, the interview underscores once again how dire the situation in Haiti really is and the intractable challenges that must be dealt with as we move forward. It underscored the urgency that still exists there, particularly at the onset of the hurricane season, and the real need for competent leadership. Bill Clinton, as much as I respect and admire his intelligence and his sincere desire to make the rebuilding effort work properly, cannot be THE leader of this effort. 'Governement by NGO', as mountainannie aptly describes the situation, cannot fill the leadership void. Somehow the government of Haiti or some Haitian leader has got to step up to the plate! It appears to me that November elections in Haiti will be impossible and may exascerbate the problems. The picture that has been painted by the Charlie Rose interview and the reporting leading up to it is quite disturbing and discouraging. Instead of DR1 forum members bickering, I would like to engage in a real discussion with suggestions as to how we can meet the challenges.

  6. #6
    Platinum
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    30,629
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by pedrochemical View Post
    What is your obsession with criticising something that, not only do you know nothing about, you do not even care enough about the subject to watch the video clip.

    You are better than this normally.

    The offer is still open.
    If you want to put your money where your mouth is then come here and do some good. We can point you in the right direction - you would run screaming, traumatised like most people maybe but at least you would have learned something.
    http://www.dr1.com/forums/general-st...day-haiti.html

    Just sayin'...

  7. #7
    Silver
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    3,378
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Ron,
    It is worse than that!
    There are 42 official political parties in Haiti clamoring for power.(Registered with the CEP)
    There are not 42 different points of view so we see that the elections are not about cohesive groups of people presenting solutions to problems.

    Registering people to vote is going to be impossible - many of them are dead and many of them live in camps that are appearing and disappearing every day.

    There are no natural presidential candidates.

    Whoever wins power will have the support and respect of a tiny minority.
    Whoever else is elected will split into convenient factions to protect themselves politically from everybody else.

    There are no fundamental political ideologies in Haiti - for example 'left' and 'right'.

    Political groups form coalitions of pure convenience with whomever else feels threatened by whatever tenuous political coalitions have been formed previously.
    That is the 'political' reality in Haiti.

    But all of the above is irrelevant!!

    Nobody is rebuilding Haiti. As I pointed out to a friend as we sat in a bar in Petionville this week. If you look down the street, I asked, can you point out one single difference between now and before the quake? One single thing that has changed? The answer is no.
    Sure, there are buildings down in some places and people are living in tents but those tents will become sured up by wood, tin and eventually blocks. They will become permanent. The 'Bidonvilles' will grow up in these new areas.

    Eventually my friend pointed out one difference. The incredible amount of new vehicles with identifying stickers on them, used by the thousands of NGOs that are in Haiti. Good on these people for being there and doing something, but to think that anything is going to change in Haiti is a joke.

    We will have a few riots later this year, at which point people will stop investing their money there. They will get scared and run away - it happens most years.
    This is a shame as the only thing that ever does any good in Haiti is when petty capitalists employ people who previously did not have a job.
    Any project that cannot sustain itself financially - ie turn a profit - is doomed to failure. And it is doomed to be a failure for Haiti.
    Each time we have manifestations, people think "sod that! I am keeping my money in Miami" and investment in Haitians is withdrawn.

    Now do not get me wrong - Thanks to DINEPRA more people than ever before in Haitian history have access to clean (ish) water. Habitat for humanity (who built 10,000 new homes in New Orleans after Katrina) are actually building stuff. Health care is available to many who previously would not have had access. Sean Penn looks as though he is serious - at leat he seems to have a pair.
    But all this, again, is a red herring.

    Nobody gives a shxt about Haiti.
    Nobody gives a shxt about Haitians.
    Nothing is being rebuilt.
    The usual suspects are going make out like bandits and the rest of the country is going to live in the pxss and the mud like always.

    And tourist day trips to Ounaminthe are worse than useless - but if that salves the conscience then go for it!

    The shame of it is that things were getting better last year.
    Since relative peace broke out in 2006 (And yes, thanks largely to the efforts of MINUSTAH) new businesses were popping up everywhere. Haitian expats were coming back from Miami and creating businesses and wealth, employing people, building new offices, malls etc. that has stopped and it will be a long time before people feel confident enough to restart this necessary process.

    So the situation is dire. People will die. People will continue to live in misery and poverty and nothing effective will be done by anybody with power because if you have power you need to spend 48hrs per day protecting that power.

    And that really is the most positive thing I can say even when I muster all of my NALSian spin.

    But really, you should come visit - Haiti is lovely this time of year.

  8. #8
    Platinum
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    30,629
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Then screw the do-gooder NGO's and the "esteemed international community" aka the UN. Screw the luxury SUV's, cruise ship hotels, fat salaries, meetings and all that window dressing.

    Pull all US and allied troops from Iraq. Send them to Haiti. Enforce country-wide martial law.

    Let the US military be responsible for contracting to build the roads, schools, hospitals, remove the rubbish and debris (think about the awesome artificial reefs they'd make, the fish they'd attract; protect them by the Navy for 2-3 years and there'd be FISH resources!)...at the point of a gun.

    Tell the Haitians "you do not get your country back until you prove you can handle it. We are, as a hemisphere TIRED of you dragging everyone else with your bull****." Make the "leaders" become apprentices, the Haitians become the labor. The educated class has to work shoulder to shoulder with folks whose JOB is production, not committees, memos, bureaucracy, resolutions and other bull****.

    Install, by fiat, a working infrastructure. Turn it over to the locals piece by piece as they EARN it.

    Install capital punishment for corruption with public executions, make a few examples live on TV.

    You want no results? Continue with the feckless bureaucrats and tree-killers, the NGO's, and all their meetings and inaction.

    You want results? First of all there needs to be the WILL for results. Then put people whose LIVES and CAREERS revolve around results and NOT politics.

    Quote Originally Posted by CB's Law of Rhetorical Economics
    The reason "talk is cheap" is because the supply exceeds the demand.
    A Hummer full of US Military officers and soldiers can get more done in a single day that a gaggle of paper-pushing UN and NGO bureaucrats can get done in six months.

    I know, I know, not PC. But which is more important? PC or results? I'm not sure you can have both in a crisis.

  9. #9
    Bronze
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    1,341
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    WOW! You're right Pedro. Your assessment is much worse than I thought! I had already suspected that holding an election in Haiti in November is a pipedream, BUT, your prognosis for future progress is bleak, indeed. I was planning to visit Haiti in the next six months when I return to the DR, but I'm almost convinced that another six months is not nearly enough time to even begin an assessment for future involvement. Everyone says that the rebuilding of Haiti is going to take a long time. It appears that that is more than an understatement. It is just terribly depressing. I pray for the poor people who are the ultimate victims of all this, and whose only crime is to have been born in Haiti.

  10. #10
    Bronze
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    1,352
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by pedrochemical View Post

    The offer is still open.
    If you want to put your money where your mouth is then come here and do some good. We can point you in the right direction - you would run screaming, traumatised like most people maybe but at least you would have learned something.
    Pedro, i believe some of us would like to know what good we can do beside toss cash at the situation. And what could we learn about coming there?


    As for tourist day trips to Ounaminthe, CB's post put a much more human touch on the Haitian crisis than debating what is and isn't being done for the people.

    So please tell us Pedro's solution is to the Haiti tragedy. I like CB's way of thinking.

Page 1 of 12 12311 ... LastLast

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •