Dominicans Losing Their Beaches

Robert

Stay Frosty!
Jan 2, 1999
20,574
341
83
dr1.com
Below is a short documentary sent to me made by a young film maker.
This is the pilot in the hope to get funding to make a full blown version.

Take a look and let the debating begin.

Note: If you don't have the ability to debate, keep out of this thread, it will just mean the loss of your account for being an idiot :)

Go take a look...

Pt1
LOF Documentary 1 of 2 on Vimeo

Pt2
LOF Documentary 2 of 2 on Vimeo
 

RacerX

Banned
Nov 22, 2009
3,390
376
0
There is another filmmaker who made a similar documentary on the diminished access to the beaches in Jamaica by the locals. Female author, whos name I cant remember right now...
 

CFA123

Silver
May 29, 2004
3,512
413
83
Comments on the film itself & techniques.

On the plus side, it's nicely filmed, edited, and narrated.

On the negative side, I find the film to be unbalanced and one-sided... which is a shame. Some commentary on the other side of the issue addressed would allow the viewer to decide who is in the right. As it is, most claims are highly suspect & self serving of the chosen viewpoint of the producer.
Examples:
  • People in the film who say they or their family 'worked the land' for years & feel it was stolen. is there another side that says they were squatters? is there an attorney who can state whether they legitimately have a claim?
  • People claim the towns are now dead after the arrival of the AI hotels. Were the towns really 'alive' before? or only appeared so because there was nothing nearby to compare them to? they take the time to contrast how hotels in Brazil coexist with local populations... why not also show how locals in other countries have built businesses the tourists actually want to see? (or maybe that wouldn't benefit the filmmakers point of view).
  • Boat captain who says he gets no business from the AI's. Why don't we see his 40' cruiser or 30' twin engine fishing boat sitting at the dock so we can truly sympathize that the AI's are unfairly monopolizing the business he'd have otherwise. Or is he expecting to attract tourists with a 12' wooden boat with no life preservers, an engine that won't start on hot days, and a captain who's asleep under a tree somewhere when a client actually does arrive.
  • People who claim it's brought no benefits to the local areas. Surely there are people who are thriving because of it... interview of few of them for contrast. The taxi drivers, transportation companies, Presidente brewers, agricultural beneficiaries, realtors, attorneys & other professionals, etc. Let the viewer see how some have capitalized while others have failed to.

It could be much more meaningful if it attempted to resolve whether many of these issues are real or not. As it is, while the proclamations of many interviewed are poignant, they could also simply be self serving and/or ignorant.
 

CFA123

Silver
May 29, 2004
3,512
413
83
Comments on the issue itself of beach access.

Miguel Seguin (in part 2) "Tourist spaces should be designed for the enjoyment of tourists... and the leisure of locals". I couldn't say it better. Keep the beaches public.


As an aside, I find it somewhat disingenuous that it's stated 10 out of 10 AI visitors will return and 10 out of 10 said 'because we leave our wallets at home'. Again, shading reality to benefit the desire of the filmaker.
 

Berzin

Banned
Nov 17, 2004
5,898
550
113
Comments on the film itself & techniques.

On the plus side, it's nicely filmed, edited, and narrated.

On the negative side, I find the film to be unbalanced and one-sided... which is a shame. Some commentary on the other side of the issue addressed would allow the viewer to decide who is in the right. As it is, most claims are highly suspect & self serving of the chosen viewpoint of the producer.

I think we need to get off the "fair and balanced" kick. Real life isn't objective, and I don't understand why it's such a bone of contention. The point is to present the material and to give us the viewer an opportunity to ask questions and do further research, not to take a side and then man up with the pitchforks and truncheons.


Case in point-I vividly recall a video shown on DR1 where the military were removing people from a piece of land and firing their weapons and the brouhaha that ensued. Turns out the dispossessed were on the land illegally.

It certainly wasn't pretty to watch, but without and understanding of what lead to the incident, one could easily come to the conclusion that the military actions was heartless and cruel.

This bit of video I'm speaking of was included in this doc with no underlying narrative, and thus gave me insight into the mindset of the filmmaker. But I always know better than to take what I see at face value.

The doc gives a good idea of what each side's agenda is. The party lines towed by big business and the outlying indigenous population that populate the surrounding areas of these gigantic AI's are what one would expect them to take.

As I'm a fan of documentary films I applaud the effort made and appreciate the time it took to get it done. It has opened my eyes to this issue and has lead me to ask questions of both sides.

This is what marks the quality of a good documentary film, and I believe in this regard the filmmaker has succeeded.

I hope he receives the funding to continue.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Bronxboy

cobraboy

Pro-Bono Demolition Hobbyist
Jul 24, 2004
40,964
936
113
Beyond the documentary, it's clear the DR Constitution is being violated everywhere regarding the beaches and the 60m provision.

And it seems to be ignored by the gubmint.
 

jrhartley

Gold
Sep 10, 2008
8,190
580
0
64
have those flats in cabaret been washed away yet ? they were sand bagging as they built them .......
 

CFA123

Silver
May 29, 2004
3,512
413
83
I think we need to get off the "fair and balanced" kick. Real life isn't objective, and I don't understand why it's such a bone of contention. The point is to present the material and to give us the viewer an opportunity to ask questions and do further research, not to take a side and then man up with the pitchforks and truncheons. .

Berzin, if there's not some balance it's just propaganda. The masses are too easily swayed and either incapable or too lazy to do further research. Hell, too many just absorb as fact whatever they see in print or on film, or in chain emails for that matter.

If you want an example, look at the damage done by Breitbart's recent use of part of a video clip (Sherrod) and all the damage done by supposedly educated people who didn't even go so far as to view the whole video. Just one example of mass histeria created by slanted 'journalism' presenting just one side of the issue as fact without context.

The whole thing has the feel of a Michael Moore production - while entertaining, it's just propaganda unless there's some balance.

And for those venturing to comment here, I wonder how many will have actually watched the entire video before jumping in ;)
 

cobraboy

Pro-Bono Demolition Hobbyist
Jul 24, 2004
40,964
936
113
And for those venturing to comment here, I wonder how many will have actually watched the entire video before jumping in ;)
I did.

But I'm a Big Picture guy.

And as I offer my guests when they question what they see here compared to what the law is: Does a law even exist if it's not enforced?
 

mido

Bronze
May 18, 2002
1,522
14
38
Beyond the documentary, it's clear the DR Constitution is being violated everywhere regarding the beaches and the 60m provision.

And it seems to be ignored by the gubmint.

As far a I understand the Constutions has been change regarding beach access. Property owners can now close the beach off.
 

greydread

Platinum
Jan 3, 2007
17,477
488
83
I think that the comparisons made to Ipanema brought the problem into perspective. It appears that there were three separate issues attributed to the proliferation of AI's in the DR. Beach access for locals, improper eviction of locals and the monopoly of related service industries (restaraunts, entertainment, boat tours, etc.) by the corporate owners of the resorts. I think the documentary would have been more effective if each issue was explored in greater depth as a single issue. Beach accessibility for locals shouldn't even be a problem as it appears to be prohibited by law.

Boca Chica was mentioned as a problem area and this doesn't connect with the reality that there are many residents at the beach on any sunny day there, some enjoying the beach, some selling goods and services independently and some employed by the hotels and restaraunts. Bavaro beaches are a different story. To me the AI's there are like very comfortable prisons. There are walls everywhere blocking beach access and visibility and that is depressing to look at.

It's strange that 50 years after revolutions in Cuba, South and Central America our "profit 1st" mentality doesn't give us credit for having learned much.
 

DR Mpe

Banned
Mar 31, 2003
1,191
36
48
Keep it clean

Well, when I was young we had a program called "Keep the nature clean". We learned that the nature can take care of wood, but not glass and plastic. I saw the beaches this weekend and hey, we have some lack of common sense here. This by the way happens EVERY sunday, when dominicans visit their beloved beaches. Monday is not a good day to go to the beach.

About the video. Well blame somebody else, no somos responsable. Whats new? Well if it was a student project I guess it was ok for giving 1 part the opportunity to express its opinion.
 

Dj_iET

New member
Sep 8, 2008
23
0
0
www.myspace.com
when i went to Punta Cana they claimed that locals were allowed on the beach.. yeah right there were security guards with huge assualt rifles and shot guns.. and you could only be a employee to be allowed on the premises and on the beaches there wasnt a local in sight.. I mean i guess the tourist will not mind and its probably for security but its not right... cause the local beaches were not as maintained as the tourist beaches
 

ray718

New member
May 28, 2010
88
12
0
48
I agree with many on the board that the film was one sided. It would have been interesting to view the opinions of the other side. Interviews with hotel owners and tourist would have been interesting. But, those who have traveled to d.r. And stayed at a.i. Are truely missing the real dominican republic. Being dominican, i have done both, and can attest to the separation of the local population with tourism in general. The few tourist that venture out the resort area become surprised at the difference in prices on such things a food, soveniers, variety of drinks on the island, and true friendliness of the dominican people. The anger in the film by locals generates from the fact hotels due change the natural environment of the area, and impact the lives of the locals, who truely see no profit from the hotels. The government gets all the taxes, and we all know how great the d.r.government is with money.
 

Hillbilly

Moderator
Jan 1, 2002
18,948
514
113
Perception and reality being what they are, the clips might be one sided, but they are one-sided in a way that could well harm DR tourism without any saving grace for it.

Say, for the sake of argument, that there was a major film documenting the DR's allowing beaches to be privitized for Hotels, and denying citizens their constitutional right to go to the beach>? And suppose tourism dropped 5% or even 10%. Who would get hurt>?

Yes, the lowest paid workers, the menial taskers, the beach vendors, the very people that the film maker supposedly is trying to defend!....This is pretty Catch 22....

HB
 

Berzin

Banned
Nov 17, 2004
5,898
550
113
Berzin, if there's not some balance it's just propaganda. The masses are too easily swayed and either incapable or too lazy to do further research. Hell, too many just absorb as fact whatever they see in print or on film, or in chain emails for that matter.

If you want an example, look at the damage done by Breitbart's recent use of part of a video clip (Sherrod) and all the damage done by supposedly educated people who didn't even go so far as to view the whole video. Just one example of mass histeria created by slanted 'journalism' presenting just one side of the issue as fact without context.

The whole thing has the feel of a Michael Moore production - while entertaining, it's just propaganda unless there's some balance.

You missed the point of what I said. Documentaries are, to me, vehicles in which to ask questions and further research a particular subject.

The mass hysteria brought on by whatever people see in the news is not so much the fault of the propagator of a media presentation, but of what the population watching deems to be an outrage once filtered through their collective personal bias. Whatever cements a persons' personal/political agenda, that is pretty much how information gets filtered in each individual brain.

People who respond viscerally to media-as-information are knee-jerk reactionary by nature. The type of information they are fed is either internalized or marginalized depending on their pre-determined bias.

That is life. For those who care to put more thought into what they see and read, this is definitely a step in the right direction.

If the corporation in question acquired the beachfront property in the DR they way it was portrayed, then it is not propaganda. It is truth and must be spoken. Juxtapose that with the very real portrayal (however fleeting) of surly Dominicans overcharging gringos and then calling them cheap because they refuse to spend money in places where the will be ripped off. That is also a reality.

Or how the two Dominican Judges, refused entry onto a private beach owned by an AI, were easily placated with a free weekend stay. Where does this leave the common man if the Dominican judiciary are bought off so easily? Is this not too part of the problem, moreso than the big, bad capitalists who own the AIs?

There are many issues on both sides that need addressing. The documentary, though a bit slanted to the left, left me asking questions of all three sides-the AIs, the indigenous population who live within reach of these resorts, and the Dominican political/judiciary system.

I nor you can help the knee-jerk reactions folks have, nor can we control how people internalize information and filter it.

All I know is, for me, this documentary did it's job. We need to see more efforts of this type.

I agree with you that the masses are too easily swayed. My argument is, an attempt at presenting unbiased media coverage isn't going to change this for the reasons I previously mentioned. For the most part people will be biased regardless of how their media is fed to them. That's just how it is.
 

Robert

Stay Frosty!
Jan 2, 1999
20,574
341
83
dr1.com
The person who made the short doc realizes it's a little one sided.

They hope with funding they can make a full length documentary that is more balanced.

I'm hoping she will post in this thread :)
 

rice&beans

Silver
May 16, 2010
4,293
374
83
But I'm Dominican.....What do you mean I can't go to the Beach??.........

Berzin;[LIST=1 said:
[*]You missed the point of what I said. Documentaries are, to me, vehicles in which to ask questions and further research a particular subject.

[*]The mass hysteria brought on by whatever people see in the news is not so much the fault of the propagator of a media presentation, but of what the population watching deems to be an outrage once filtered through their collective personal bias. Whatever cements a persons' personal/political agenda, that is pretty much how information gets filtered in each individual brain.

[*]People who respond viscerally to media-as-information are knee-jerk reactionary by nature. The type of information they are fed is either internalized or marginalized depending on their pre-determined bias.

[*]That is life. For those who care to put more thought into what they see and read, this is definitely a step in the right direction.

[*]If the corporation in question acquired the beachfront property in the DR they way it was portrayed, then it is not propaganda. It is truth and must be spoken. Juxtapose that with the very real portrayal (however fleeting) of surly Dominicans overcharging gringos and then calling them cheap because they refuse to spend money in places where the will be ripped off. That is also a reality.

[*]Or how the two Dominican Judges, refused entry onto a private beach owned by an AI, were easily placated with a free weekend stay. Where does this leave the common man if the Dominican judiciary are bought off so easily? Is this not too part of the problem, moreso than the big, bad capitalists who own the AIs?

[*]There are many issues on both sides that need addressing. The documentary, though a bit slanted to the left, left me asking questions of all three sides-the AIs, the indigenous population who live within reach of these resorts, and the Dominican political/judiciary system.

[*]I nor you can help the knee-jerk reactions folks have, nor can we control how people internalize information and filter it.

[*]All I know is, for me, this documentary did it's job. We need to see more efforts of this type.

[*]I agree with you that the masses are too easily swayed. My argument is, an attempt at presenting unbiased media coverage isn't going to change this for the reasons I previously mentioned. For the most part people will be biased regardless of how their media is fed to them. That's just how it is.

[*]Or person in question...(Wayne Fuller)...Doesn't sound like propaganda, it looks like the people were just brushed aside...(sounds like Gulf & Western and Wayne Fuller were not very friendly, I can understand the bitterness, when they talk about the early years and how it all started...........there is always alot of pain before progress...(percieved at the time).....but 45 years later!!.........it's troubling......I've heard the rumblings for years....but no one ever does anything, too nervous about upsetting the tourist......(can't blame the powers that be).......but to #$*% on your own people, that's not right either....While it's always great to have another side to the story..........let us focus on THIS FIRST......If someone wants to make a documentary rebutting this........go for it.........I'm glad the past is coming to life, I think this was positive, who knows?..this could spawn compromises on both sides....(AI owners & Gubmint)........stranger things have happened.............;)



[*]A potential competitor to Gulf & Western's large seaside resort at La Romana, M. Wayne Fuller, ran into a steady series of obstacles in the early 1970s from the Tourism Office in importing supplies and obtaining tax concessions supposedly available to foreign enterprises. In April, 1975, a government decree was signed expropriating Fuller's beach-land property-for use as a public park-helped along possibly by the fact that the president of another G & W subsidiary was an advisor to the Dominican Republic Park Commission. This decree was rescinded when Fuller mobilized his forces, including various army officers and Balaguer himself. In brief, foreign interests are exceedingly powerful as they curry and buy favor and mobilize their elite cadres, with whom they jointly dominate and loot this small dependency.


[*]Got this info from.....The Washington connection and third world Facism, by Noam Chomsky and Edward S. Herman......1979
[/LIST]885535]
 
Last edited:

rice&beans

Silver
May 16, 2010
4,293
374
83
Message?....information?....call it what you want........

Great job!!...very informative.......will solutions come??...it's a start.......:cheeky::cheeky: