Dominican Players

Mcinbrass

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Jan 2, 2002
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I read often DR1 news trumpeting the achievements of dominican baseball players in the Major Leagues. But when you look at the final 4 teams this year, the top(so-called) dominican players are not present. Sosa, Martinez, A-Rod, Tejada, Guerrero, Soriano, Mondesi are all sitting home. Which brings me to my next point.

It is my contention that while these players put up big numbers, they dont do enough of the little things that help the TEAM be successful. Things like bunting, or hitting behind runners, Good defense. They also don't perforn well under pressure.

Theres an old saying "You dont get off of the island by bunting"

Id like to hear the groups thoughts on this.
 

Criss Colon

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Jan 2, 2002
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One Player Does Not A Team Make!

Lots of great players,Dominican and otherwise,are stuck on bad teams.I think that your post is way out of line.Dominicans are great under pressure.Look at where they come from.Life here is good training for dealing with pressure.I want to "Explode" every day! CRISCO
 

Musicqueen

Miami Nice!
Jan 31, 2002
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How about the other way around?...I think Dominican players do more than they are required to do...(at least some of them) and sometimes it's the rest of the team that doesn't perform to their highest potential...
I agree with Mr. Colon on this..."Lots of great players,Dominican and otherwise, are stuck on bad teams"...
 

JOHNNY HONDA

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Sep 25, 2002
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YO WISH I COULD BE STUCK WITH THE CONTRACTS THEY GOT!!!!
HOWEVER YOU ARE 100% RIGHT CRISCO 1 PLAYER DOES NOT A TEAM MAKE AND THE AVERAGE PLAYER FROM THE D.R. DOES CARRY MORE THAN HIS WEIGHT WITNESS THE PEDRO MARTINEZ,SAMMY SOSA,JOSE VIDREO,GUERERO ETC. ETC. WHO ARE PLAYING THEIR HEARTS OUT EVEN THOUGH THEY KNOW THE TEAMS THEY PLAY FOR HAVE NO CHANCE OF WINNING THE PENNANT LET ALONE THE WORLD SERIES AS IN EVERYTHING IN LIFE HE WHO SPENDS THE MOST MONEY WINS
 

Mcinbrass

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Jan 2, 2002
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Well...

...Soriano, Mondesi, Martinez, Sosa and A-Rod are all on Big Market teams with unlimited resources. Yet the players failed to get it done. Its funny the Yankees won BEFORE they got these two and Sosa, A-rod and Martinez have never won a thing.
 

jose?to

The thread finally snapped...
Jun 19, 2002
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Man-oh-man, what is this? An attempt to get something started?

Only 8 teams out of thirty make it to the playoffs. These players are great, and would be welcomed on any team--winners and losers--if the price was right, provided that they (the players) were available.
All four of the remaining teams have Dominicans on their payroll; some are on the playoff rosters, while others aren't.

Unless this is an attempt to start some discord, then explain why the Mariners, with the great Ichiro, are not on the playoffs.
Why the blatant attempt at creating discord?
Ernie Banks never played for a World Series winner; neither did Juan Marichal. Nolan Ryan was a non-factor for the Miracle Mets of 1969. C'mon, 'pardner', accept the fact that this current crop of Dominican players is very talented.
 

Golo100

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Jan 5, 2002
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Wrong!!!

It is not a matter of Dominicans failing to get their teams to the semifinals. What about Randy Johnson and Curt Schilling sitting at home?

Besides, did you know that we still have Cristian Guzman, David Ortiz, Ramon Ortiz, Albert Pujols and a few others still playing?

TW
 

x_man

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Jan 1, 2002
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I'm not a BB fan but I like Barry Bonds he can hang with the best the DR has to offer!
Any objections?
X.
 

trina

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Jan 3, 2002
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MacInbrass, what are you talking about???

...Soriano, Mondesi, Martinez, Sosa and A-Rod are all on Big Market teams with unlimited resources. Yet the players failed to get it done.

Sure, their teams may not be playing in the playoffs...as CC said, one man does not make a team. But to say these players failed to get it done, what in h*e*double-hockey-sticks are you talking about? Dominican players were at the top of nearly all individual stats lists!

Face the facts:

American League:
Batting Avg:
(1) Manny Ramirez
Home Runs:
(1) Alex Rodriguez
RBI's:
(1) Alex Rodriguez
Runs:
(1) Alfonso Soriano
(2) Alex Rodriguez
Hits:
(1) Alfonso Soriano
(3) Miguel Tejada
Stolen Bases:
(1) Alfonso Soriano
ERA:
(1) Pedro Martinez
Strikeouts:
(1) Pedro Martinez

National League:
Home Runs:
(1) Sammy Sosa
RBI's:
(2) Albert Pujols
Runs:
(1) Sammy Sosa
(2) Albert Pujols
Hits:
(1) Vladimir Guerrero
Stolen Bases:
(1) Luis Castillo


In addition to Golo's list, Manny Aybar and Felix Rodriguez are also Dominicans who are still in the running. You can take the
best player in the world, but throw him on a team with a bad pitching staff, and that player still has zero chance of making the finals.

PS
Johnny Honda, your comments are bang-on, except that Jose Vidro is not Dominican. He is from Puerto Rico.
 
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x_man

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Jan 1, 2002
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Quote:
Holman soon will open a new factory - at the site of a former bar and brothel - that will make more than 300 bats a day.

I rather would have liked him to restored the b&b.

X.
 

Mcinbrass

Bronze
Jan 2, 2002
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Of course they failed..

...because if you ask any fan, the measure of success in sports is winning. Ill give you an example. Bill Russell. He never put up the kind of numbers Wilt Chamberlain did but he won 10 years in a row!

Fans don't care about numbers, all they care about is winning. Players care about numbers, on the field and in their pockets. Unfortunately I havent seen enough proof that dominican players care enough about the fans to do the little things which make up a winning team. Ever see a dominican player walk?

Name me the most prolific winning dominican player, then tell me why?

All these numbers, no winners.

Theres an old saying "You can't walk off the island"
 

jose?to

The thread finally snapped...
Jun 19, 2002
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Once a year the Sporting News asks baseball GMs to pick one player that they would build a franchise around. They do not all agree, but the past couple of years Dominicans have been at or near the top of the list. From Vlad to Pedro, and from Sammy to A-Rod. Case closed.
Please do not believe the hype when you hear, "you can't walk off the island." That's just a clich?, and an attempt to romanticize baseball even more.
Larry Walker has not even played in the WS, but he is still a great player. To come up with more names would just trivialize the whole thing, but it would definitely debunk your argument with regards to Dominican players not performing under pressure.
I can't believe I'm glorifying your rhetoric with responses.
 

Golo100

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Jan 5, 2002
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Is "walking" the strategy for winning?

Mcinbrass: If walking was the criteria for producing wins there would be no reason for "bunting" or even hitting the ball. Hey!!!Why don't we all just sit there and take pitches?

Players take a "walk" because the pitcher is off the mark. This is not a voluntary thing. Intentional walks are a strategy of the defense, not the offensive side. The bat in baseball was design for hitting a round white ball as far as you can, so you can run the bases and get home...understand that? Also, modern baseball is now geared towards hitting for power. Even stolen bases are a lost art.

You should also take a look at CNNSI's or ESPN's statistics and check who the leaders of "walks" are. Surprise, surprise!!!Dominicans are all over. Ever heard of Sammy Sosa's taking 100 walks for two consecutive years? Yet, he was not trying to do that. He swung most times and even stroke out 140 times. Vladimir Guerrero is one of the hardest outs in baseball, so is Luis Castillo and Manny Ramirez. All of them with batting averages exceeding .300.

You better check your stats my friend. Dominicans are so influential in baseball that you will find them in both positive and negative categories because they are just there.....we are the majority of the non-americans and as the top minority are the best producers this year all around. No team in baseball won its division, got to the playoffs or will get to the World Series without a Dominican player in its roster. Can you say the same thing about Canadians, Cubans, Puerto Ricans,Venezuelans, Panamanians and orientals?

And the parade is not over. With the recent talent being developed here I see Dominican players dominating MLB in the future. Didn't they now?

TW
 

trina

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Jan 3, 2002
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All these numbers, no winners.

Obviously, you are not taking into consideration all of our Dominican MVP winners, Golden Glove winners, Cy Young winners...shall I go on???

The players are obviously impressing the people that count, that's why they receive these sweet $200 million+ contracts.
 

Mcinbrass

Bronze
Jan 2, 2002
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Keep on...

...naming Dominican players with stats and numbers. Start naming winners. My point is that these players are so intent on numbers that they forget the simple fundamentals of the game. These same fundamentals when executed by the TEAM, lead to a winning program.

Funny how the Yankees won almost every year until Soriano got there.

What is your explanation for the fact that these great players with awsome numbers aren't part of a winning program. Not one of them. Must be a reason. I just gave you a few. Id like to hear your thoughts and try to leave the macho dominican pride shit out of it.
 

Golo100

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Jan 5, 2002
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Just some history for you Mcinbrass!!!

Remember the Big Red Machine at Cincinnati? Remember the MVP of the World series? What was his name again?????Oh, yes, Jose Rijo. A Dominican.

Who was that miracle little guy who won a World Series for the Atlanta Braves who later became the poor man's legend. Remember a little guy by the name of Cabrera?

How did Arizona get to be champions last year? Guess this one yourself. Tell me what Dominican pitcher was most influential in this.

Who has been the spark of the Atlanta Braves for the last two years. Recognize a tiny little guy name Furcal? Or are the Braves losers too? Who just won the first game for the Annaheim Angels?Recognize Ramon Ortiz? Who got the Twins there? Recognize David Ortiz and Cristian Guzman?

Who got the Marlins to the World Series and eventually the World Championship? Remember a guy named Moises Alou?

Maybe perhaps what you should do is name who the real winners are and their nationality and I will find for you 10 times as many losers from the same nationality. Your rationale is totally OFF BASE.

TW
 

jose?to

The thread finally snapped...
Jun 19, 2002
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I doubt Soriano, or any player for that matter, can make a decision NOT to bunt or steal when the manager has asked them to. Like someone here said, base stealing is a lost art; the game has evolved and MLB has recognized that people want to see the long ball. It is as if you are implying that Dominican ballplayers DO NOT want to win.
Mcinbrass, do you have a favorite player, or team? If you do, then guess what? Based on your logic, they have also failed. Unless, of course, that your favorite team is ALWAYS the winning team, in which case you are NOT a fan. And whichever team ends up triumphant, Dominicans in its roster you will find.
There goes your logic.
 

Mcinbrass

Bronze
Jan 2, 2002
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The Mets...

...are my favorite team and as an example the dominican players we have stink. Timo Perez cant take a walk if his life depended on it and Armando Benitez loads the bases every time out. Cant stand pressure, always fails. Sometimes I think the big lug is going to cry.

The players TW mentioned are/were only small cogs in winning programs. Im surprised he didnt mention Alfedo Griffin being the reason Anaheim is winning. He was also a winner a few places. But the major stars I hear about every day in DR1 news aren't winning. Pujols is the next to be eliminated, watch how he melts in this series.