Be the first in the Dominican Republic to build an electron propulsion prototype

Jim Hinsch

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Be the first in the Dominican Republic to build a working prototype of an electron-propulsion anti-gravity device. I built mine in 5 minutes using 3 toothpicks, a piece of foil, and a piece of wire.

<a href="http://www.mastercomputergroup.com/collage.jpg"><img src="http://www.mastercomputergroup.com/collage_small.jpg" alt="Anti-Gravity"></a>

Also see http://jnaudin.free.fr/html/lfreplog.htm for video.

As fars as I can tell, nobody in the Dominican Republic has built such a device.
 

mondongo

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Interesting post, Jim. Definitely piqued my curiosity. Will check it out....BTW....word of WARNING: DO NOT TRY THIS AT HOME!!!!

The voltage going to the unit can be as high as 30,000 Volts!!! This can kill you if it is of low enough impedance (high current capacity). I repeat DO NOT TRY THIS unless you are very knowledgeable.
 

Jim Hinsch

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Anti-gravity - good for a student

I figured this little project would be perfect for a science teacher or someone like Hillbilly that does some mentoring on occasion at the schools.

They can explain the concepts behind electricity, this particular experiment, let the students build their own using the same or any design they like, and the teacher can be in charge of and control the power source when it comes to "first flight".

Few experiements can demonstrate so many concepts with so few materials. 3 tooth picks, a piece of foil, and a piece of wire. The teacher could include additional construction materials like glue, tape, balsa wood, popsicle sticks, straws, paper, pins, etc.

For me, this is truly neat, new, and has so much potential for design improvement. I went the other route, and took the design to it's simplest form.

Done properly, it will not damage your monitor. Yes, it is extremely high voltage and it can kill you if you get shocked. The supervisor can handle the application of power to the devices.

It's also a good project for a group effort. A group can discuss and design for a week, then build a big one together using very inexpensive stuff, even scraps.

This is electron-propulsion and it works. Truly amazing.
 
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Hillbilly

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Interesting...where can I see the plans for one of these. They make great kites here so this will be really cool
Hb
 

mondongo

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The basis of this experiment violates some proven laws of physics: namely conservation of mementum. What these people claim is that they have discovered a new physical phenomenon: "electrogravity"...or the interaction of static electric fields and gravitational fields. According to NASA, there is no proof that this exists. The current explanation centers around the theory of "ionic wind". None of the proponents have as of yet has demonstrated that it is NOT ionic wind.

There is really nothing here to demonstrate...the claims of this "wierd science" have not been proven..
 

Jim Hinsch

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The thing does fly. It is weird stuff. I don't know that I'd call it electrogravity, myself. I like ion propulsion better. Standing next to the thing, it throws off a good breeze and you can smell ozone it's making. The way it takes off is unusual. It kind of rocks back and forth, then floats up, but not like it was sitting over a fan or anything.

It works in oil, it works in a sealed plastic bag. I've got to try that to see what I feel, because when this think is floating, you can feel the "exhuaust" of the surrounding airIonic wind is collecting ions from the wind and putting them to work, like a windmill does except no. There is no wind in this experiement.

http://foldedspace.com/corporate.html:

Gravitec has been dedicated to the research and development of a new propulsion technology known as "Electric Field Propulsion". Simply stated, Field propulsion is the single most revolutionary propulsion break through in history.
The basis for this claim comes from the apparent ability of the underlying phenomenon to generate a propulsive force without the need to exhaust a gas or other fluid in the opposite direction to achieve thrust. Field Propulsion appears to simply need a non-uniform electric field around a mass to generate a propulsive force.

This means that field propulsion does not require fuel in the same way jets or rockets do today. It only requires electric power to convert it into a propulsive force.

See http://jnaudin.free.fr/html/lifters.htm for an explanation of the technology.

The Lifter is not a simple ionic wind device as Seversky's Ionocraft or as the Hagen's Flying apparatus. The Lifter uses a special asymmetrical capacitor geometry to produce an asymmetrical flow of EM energy around itself. The Biefeld-Brown Effect has been tested successfully in vacuum at 10e-5 torr by the Purdue University - Energy Conversion Lab with accurate and deep measurements in Sep 2000. These tests have fully demonstrated that the ionic wind is not the source of the main thrust....

More than 100 Lifter replications have been done successfully by many experimenters and physicists Worldwide ( see The Worldwide Lifters replications logbook ). Jim Hinsch, #104: http://jnaudin.free.fr/html/lfreplog.htm

Press Release: http://technology.nasa.gov/scripts/nls_ax.dll/twDispTOPSItem(111;TOP8-80;0;1)

Nasa demos the affect:
<IMG SRC="http://jnaudin.free.fr/images/nasartan.gif">

http://jnaudin.free.fr/html/2dacap.htm
On November 13, 2001, the NASA patent US 6,317,310 " Apparatus and Method for generating a thrust using a two dimensional asymmetrical capacitor module " has been granted.

Go back and look at the links. It's a demonstration of the Biefeld-Brown affect. The same affect that causes a downed high-voltage power line to dance around on the ground.

High voltage causes the space between the top wire an the foil base to become charged, much like a capacitor. This device is essentially a leaky capacitor. The difference in surface areas between the two sides of the capacitor causes most of the leakage to occur at the surface of the aluminum foil, which leak off horizontally. The resut is ions moving downward to restablish the charge. Evey action has an equal and opposite reaction. The reaction to ions flowing downward is thrust upward.


Hillbilly: The instructions can be found at http://jnaudin.free.fr/html/lftbld.htm but they aren't hard and fast. My design used fewer materials and was a bit easier, but is more fragile. See lifter demo #100, done by a 13 year old student :

I am a 13 year old student in Mr. Demperio's Physics class. Mr. D believes I am the youngest experimenter to build a lifter 1.
--------------------------------
After several attempts I had success with my first lifter flight on Friday 10/5/02 at 9 am. I used 1mm X 4mm balsa for the frame and the emitter wire is .002
stainless steel wire at 3.5cm from the foil collector.
My power supply is an old monitor that Mr.D set up for me. I followed Mr. Demperio's instructions but decided to replace the foam frame with balsa cut from a large sheet so I wouldn't be copying the ones he built. I am also working on a square one that is larger.
<IMG SRC="http://jnaudin.free.fr/images/djclift1.jpg">
--------------------------------

Outdoors test, angled for forward propulsion:
<IMG SRC="http://www.americanantigravity.com/graphics/russell/Russell-1.jpg">
 
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Tom F.

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When I lived in the DR I read one or two books a week and one of them was about Tesla. He used to run a million+ volts of electricity through his own body at very low amperage. I can't remember what he was trying to prove. The amps is what hurts or kills you.
 

Jim Hinsch

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Correct. Both volts and amps (aka, watts=volts x amps) count.

For anybody that thinks Mondongo's warning is to be taken lightly, " I don't recomend experimenting with them unless you have hi-voltage experience, a second person near by AND excellent emergency medical services in your communinity! SERIOUSLY! One moment I was adjusting a voltage, the next (20 minutes later) I was looking at the EEG machine at the hospital! (Stated from MY personal point of view. It was very very frightening and painful!) Sincerely, Richard Diehl, Video Design Engineer".

http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/F_safety.html#SAFETY_003

I've got a stun gun that operates on a single 9-volt battery and it makes one heck of an intimidating set of arcs across it's probes when turned on. It

My first attempt at this experiment, in less than 1/4 second of power being applied, arched down into my oriental rug (a cheap one) to make contact with dry concrete! In that split second, it left a 1cm hole bored clear through to the ground, about 1/3 inch deep. Just one split-second snap of the arc. One "snap" of an arc hitting you in the finger could easily amputate it or in the arm, obliterate a major artery. That's if you heart doesn't stop.

The lines in the photo on the original post hanging off each corner of the device are threads, used as tethers to keep the thing from floating off to the ceiling, or into the observer, or causing the wires to get crossed or ripped off.

In Dominican schools, there is very little in the way of supplies for awe inspiring experiements. This one causes jaws to drop and costs almost nothing to run. Mostly, it will make wanna-be scientists out of previously disinterested students.

Scientists today don't even know how electricity works. They have models that work good for predicting behaviour but the true mechanism is not "flowing electrons". So while it is not perfectly clear, ALL of theprinciples in play with this particular experiment, it does demonstrate several known concepts used by designers (Biefeld-Brown Effect for example).

More important: This is a chance for a slice of fame (puts the Dominican Republic on the map of where this technology has been duplicated). In fact, I think it would be a first for anywhere in the Caribbean.

<IMG SRC="http://jnaudin.free.fr/images/lftwrld.gif">

It demonstrates:

Theory. All experiments do not have to prove laws. The theories involved in this experiment include: http://jnaudin.free.fr/html/lftheory.htm, http://www.chrisgupta.com/images/brown/BROWN8.gif, http://www.chrisgupta.com/images/brown/BROWN9.gif.

You don't always have to have a profound understanding of the most advanced concepts to invent and discover.

You don't always need expensive and elaborate equipment to discover new technologies

As a creative exercise, students could come up with theoritecal design improvements as a group, and discuss or explain why they think their idea would be an improvement, and think how fantastic it would be to win this contest: http://jnaudin.free.fr/html/lifters.htm

The cost is pretty much 0 to enter and participate, except for time.

Being poor, under educated, or both does not mean you can't do something great, as is shown by what inventors of 200 years ago accomplished.
 
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mondongo

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Tom F. said:
When I lived in the DR I read one or two books a week and one of them was about Tesla. He used to run a million+ volts of electricity through his own body at very low amperage. I can't remember what he was trying to prove. The amps is what hurts or kills you.

This only proves that a little knowledge is a dangerous thing.
 

mondongo

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Jim Hinsch said:

http://jnaudin.free.fr/html/2dacap.htm
On November 13, 2001, the NASA patent US 6,317,310 " Apparatus and Method for generating a thrust using a two dimensional asymmetrical capacitor module " has been granted.

Jim, I don't mean to keep harping on this....BUT..I read that patent...boy what a friggin' joke...the pattent basically re-states Coulombs force law...it has NOTHING to do with the dubious claims of the Biefeld-Brown effect that all these references rely on....

BTW the Biefeld-Brown effect IS IN FACT a claim of a discovery of "electrogravity"..all the supporters claim that it is NOT ionic propulsion....ionic prpopulsion is an already available and often used propulsion technology.

Edited to add: I am now convinced that these jnaudin.free.fr are a bunch of scammers. Afted reading the NASA site, I notice that they make no claim of electrogravity or of Biefeld-Brown. They are just patenting a particular configuration of an asymmetrical capacitor that could lead to more efficient electro-mechanical energy conversion....all LEGIT......

Summary:....these Lifter guys are smoking good weed!!!
 
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Golo100

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Jim

You should join forces with Evgeny Podkletnov, the Russian scientist who conducted an experiment this way:

"Podkletnov claimed that a device built around a superconductor and a magnet could shield an object from gravity. The trick, he said, was to make a superconducting disc about a foot in diameter, chill it, levitate it over magnets?a nifty property of superconductors is that they repel magnetic fields?and set it revolving like a compact disc. Podkletnov said an object placed above that contraption lost 0.3 percent of its weight. The object itself didn't change. Rather, gravity's effect on it lessened."

"After Podkletnov published his article, it took NASA until 1999 to figure out how to make a large, thin superconducting disc. Ceramic high-temperature superconductors are brittle as cheap china, and the discs kept shattering. Once they solved that problem, NASA paid Columbus, Ohio-based SCI Engineered Materials $650,000 to build the entire apparatus. But Podkletnov had called for a disc with two layers, one superconducting and one not, and SCI didn't solve that engineering challenge until last year. Then they hit another roadblock. The disc wouldn't spin. SCI engineers stuck a rotor through the disc's center to turn it mechanically, but Podkletnov specified 5,000 revolutions per minute. SCI's device barely pulls 30 rpm"

"This summer Nick Cook, a writer for Jane's Defence Weekly, reported that aerospace giant Boeing was pursuing antigravity research. Boeing denied it. "We are aware of Podkletnov's work on 'anti-gravity' devices and would be interested in seeing further development work being done," said a company statement. "However, Boeing is not funding any activities in this area at this time." Note Boeing's use of the Clintonian present tense. They never contacted Jane's to ask for a correction, Cook says. Meanwhile, British aerospace company BAE Systems says it's keeping an eye on the research, and that it had once funded its own antigravity project, Greenglow."

Now Jim, whoever solves this puzzle can make Stephen Hawking and Roger Penrose look like a high school dropouts.

TW
 

Jim Hinsch

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I don't care what the patents claim. A patent is not evidence. I don't believe there is anti-gravity shielding (or electrogravity) taking place here but I didn't do the tests so I reserve judgement. I hadn't even read about those claims until you pointed them out. They have nothing to do with my post, however. Counter-gravity is at play here, due to thrust.

Ionic proplusioin. It isn't new new. My prototype broken down to such a simple model using only 3 toothpicks, a piece of foil, and a piece of wire to build an object that floats in the air using ionic propulsion is cool and I bet no junior-high or high-school in the DR ever had their students build and demo a working ionic propulsion device, let alone taught the concepts.

The "leaky capacitor" indeed. Somehow I missed the "ionic proplusion from a leaky capacitor" setup during my education. That's what I'd teach the kids.

I don't know about anti-gravity devices, but there are dozens of working counter-gravity devices that do not expel gasses or liquids. Some call this anti-gravity. The leaky capacitor concept here: <IMG SRC="http://homepage.ntlworld.com/ufophysics/figures/figs32.gif">