Change

Lalla

Your post doesn't have any sexual relevance. The DR Debates forum has not seen a lot of action lately, try that one.

Also, why don't you go by the Moon Pies thread and give us your opinion, we'd like to hear it.

Thanks Pet. I will move it where it belongs.

Education - the government should take it seriously. Invest in it. Train teachers. Pay them decently. The rest should follow.

Chiri

PS Anna I thought you were Italian Canadian, so why the use of Geordie (NE English) term of endearment 'Pet'?

Short for Petaka.

I am split...

Between education and hanging our politicians. Being that there is little chance of the latter I'd have to say "education". If I am given two choices instead of one then "getting rid of the army" would be second. That would give us plenty money for education and to invest in a better police.

Number one choice for me has to be........

EDUCATION!
With an educated population ALL other things will improve and change would be inevitable!! (I realize change would not necessarily be for the better but with an educated populace it should improve at least!!)

government...............



in order to change the Education system, something must be done about the people that are in charge of it........

so how will we change the government

shooting, hanging, drowning, or burning at the stake?

take your pic, either way its way better than they derserve

I would change three things,..................

They are,Responsibility,responsibility.and most of all,RESPONSIBILITY!!!!!!!!

No one in this country can accept the responsibility for their actions!!They all have an excuse of why it is not their fault! the kids,the maid,your neighbor,the workers,the teachers,the cleargy,and number one on the "Why blame me,it's not my fault"! list,the POLITICIANS"!

From the day that they are born,until the day that they die,dominicans are never heald accountable for anything!Nothing!!

It could start by teaching the children that they will be held accountable for their actions! Say "No"! and mean it! Just because the baby wants to bang on the furniture with a hammer doesn't mean that you must let them.Take away the hammer,say "No!",and let them cry.It won't kill them! Children want and need to have limits set for them! You are not showing love for your children by letting then run wild!

Don't treat lying,stealing,or cheating as some kind of a "joke",When your children lie, tell them that it is never acceptable to lie.Tell them you want to be told the truth.My mother and father always told me;"I will never punish you for telling me the truth"! And they didn't!Did I lie,sure,but not very often,it made me feel really bad!

You go to school every day.

You do your homework everyday.

you have "Chores" to do in the house.

You have to go to bed at 9 pm!

You have to get up at 7 am! (You won't be to tired to "get up" if you went to bed at 9!)

Maybe if the children were taught responsibility, they might be "Honest Politicians" when their turn came!

I don't hold out any hope for change,and I sometimes wonder if my children will be at a "disadvantage" when they grow up,having good values,but living in a country of liars and thieves! Cris Colon

Salito is right. I would agree that the education system probably needs changing more than anything else, but to do that, you've got to change attitudes in the government. Unfortunately, you can't choose just one thing in isolation of everything else. Any one thing that is changed will have a knock on effect somewhere else.

Re: I would change three things,..................

Criss Colon said:

They are,Responsibility,responsibility.and most of all,RESPONSIBILITY!!!!!!!!

No one in this country can accept the responsibility for their actions!!They all have an excuse of why it is not their fault! the kids,the maid,your neighbor,the workers,the teachers,the cleargy,and number one on the "Why blame me,it's not my fault"! list,the POLITICIANS"!

From the day that they are born,until the day that they die,dominicans are never heald accountable for anything!Nothing!!

It could start by teaching the children that they will be held accountable for their actions! Say "No"! and mean it! Just because the baby wants to bang on the furniture with a hammer doesn't mean that you must let them.Take away the hammer,say "No!",and let them cry.It won't kill them! Children want and need to have limits set for them! You are not showing love for your children by letting then run wild!

Don't treat lying,stealing,or cheating as some kind of a "joke",When your children lie, tell them that it is never acceptable to lie.Tell them you want to be told the truth.My mother and father always told me;"I will never punish you for telling me the truth"! And they didn't!Did I lie,sure,but not very often,it made me feel really bad!

You go to school every day.

You do your homework everyday.

you have "Chores" to do in the house.

You have to go to bed at 9 pm!

You have to get up at 7 am! (You won't be to tired to "get up" if you went to bed at 9!)

Maybe if the children were taught responsibility, they might be "Honest Politicians" when their turn came!

I don't hold out any hope for change,and I sometimes wonder if my children will be at a "disadvantage" when they grow up,having good values,but living in a country of liars and thieves! Cris Colon

Click to expand...

This is the best post that has ever graced DR1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Re: I would change three things,..................

Criss Colon said:

They are,Responsibility,responsibility.and most of all,RESPONSIBILITY!!!!!!!!

No one in this country can accept the responsibility for their actions!!They all have an excuse of why it is not their fault! the kids,the maid,your neighbor,the workers,the teachers,the cleargy,and number one on the "Why blame me,it's not my fault"! list,the POLITICIANS"!

From the day that they are born,until the day that they die,dominicans are never heald accountable for anything!Nothing!!

It could start by teaching the children that they will be held accountable for their actions! Say "No"! and mean it! Just because the baby wants to bang on the furniture with a hammer doesn't mean that you must let them.Take away the hammer,say "No!",and let them cry.It won't kill them! Children want and need to have limits set for them! You are not showing love for your children by letting then run wild!

Don't treat lying,stealing,or cheating as some kind of a "joke",When your children lie, tell them that it is never acceptable to lie.Tell them you want to be told the truth.My mother and father always told me;"I will never punish you for telling me the truth"! And they didn't!Did I lie,sure,but not very often,it made me feel really bad!

You go to school every day.

You do your homework everyday.

you have "Chores" to do in the house.

You have to go to bed at 9 pm!

You have to get up at 7 am! (You won't be to tired to "get up" if you went to bed at 9!)

Maybe if the children were taught responsibility, they might be "Honest Politicians" when their turn came!

I don't hold out any hope for change,and I sometimes wonder if my children will be at a "disadvantage" when they grow up,having good values,but living in a country of liars and thieves! Cris Colon

Click to expand...

Damn it man you took the words outta my mouth. My parents really hate dishonesty and I've had that ingrained into my head, so much that it's hard for me to make up a convincing lie, I'll probably just tell the truth. But that was a damn good post.

Re: I would change three things,..................

[B]Criss Colon[/B] said:

I don't hold out any hope for change,and I sometimes wonder if my children will be at a "disadvantage" when they grow up,having good values,but living in a country of liars and thieves! Cris Colon

Click to expand...

I am so sad to hear you say such BS. For someone who's been around the world and back you should be able to make a better analysis of the situation.

Unfortunately honest people are always shy of going into politics. You seldom see any honest, successful businessman run for office. My dad has said a zillion times that he'd rather be hanged with a violing string than become a politician. I have the same feelings. Until we change this attitude only crooks will run for office, and up until then we'll have people, like you, judging 10 M people by the actions of a bunch of crooks.

Stop comparing yourselves to poor, destitute Dominicans....what the hell do you expect?...why dont "you people" instead compare yourselves against similarly educated Dominicans? There are some on this board.

Criss Colon said:

You go to school every day.

You do your homework everyday.

you have "Chores" to do in the house.

Click to expand...

What saddens me is that "you people" don't understand where you live. The DR is not the USA. People in the DR are not educated. They do not have jobs.

"You go to school every day": if there are no books, no good teachers, no supplies, no job after graduation, oftentimes no school at all....then there is an obvious disincentive in the DR.

"You do your homework everyday": if you have no pencils, paper and books.....then what do you do?

"you have "Chores" to do around the house": lets see...my chore today is to sweep the dirt floor....or maybe scrape the concon off the calderon....or maybe I can re-arrange the falling and rusting tin plates on my roof...or maybe my chore will be do do laundry....oops...I dont have to do laundry cause I dont have any clothes!!

When I look at Dominicans at the same economic level as the US average, I note that Dominicans tend to actually work harder and take school more seriously.

Re: Re: I would change three things,..................

Pib said:

I am so sad to hear you say such BS. For someone who's been around the world and back you should be able to make a better analysis of the situation.

Unfortunately honest people are always shy of going into politics. You seldom see any honest, successful businessman run for office. My dad has said a zillion times that he'd rather be hanged with a violing string than become a politician. I have the same feelings.

Click to expand...

I think that if you are honest Pib you wouldnt be making those excuses as criss has described. Step up and do something. Tell the polititions that you are not going to put up with the same BS anymore.

You should run for office. That is how you start something. That is how you change things. I would be the first person donate dollars to your campaign.

Otherwise its exactly what cris says. It's not my fault says Ms Dominicana.

I agree with Pib on both counts

One, hang them!
Two. No way an honest person could make it to office when she-he doesn?t play by the prescribed rules of the game.. namely get all you can and cover up when you?re done so I?ll do the same when your turn comes to leave office.
If by some fluke an honest individual were to make it into public office, the others would surely make it their business to discredit him-her before the person can do any damage to the status quo.
This spells ruin for any respectable person who attempts to change things from the inside.
The best bet is definetly with education. But why leave it to the public schools? What could be accomplished if each peron made it their point to shed some light into someone?s horizon regardless of how dim it may seem..
If you reach just one out of ten people you speak to, then you have started the machinery for change. When the seed is planted, it is like a vine....
Why wait for someone to educate a parent who had no opportunity to be educated? Be that someone. It?s not as hard as it seems.

It all comes back to 1 thing

IGNORANCE!

Extrapolate it out and everything comes back to ignorance.

Go one step further and it's education, or lack thereof.

Ignorance is the underlying theme of everything everyone has mentioned; responsibility (a value learned), corruption so on and so forth.

Fix the ignorance - education is the most obvious place to start - and the rest will be corrected as far as the cultural boundaries allow.

My students feel there is no hope, they say it will take 30 years to correct/address the ignorance. They fail to take it another step - that being then, THEY are the ones who need to focus on fixing what ails "them".

I tell them over and over - "Be the change you want to see"

Just my two cents.

Great topic to talk about, it's difficult to see it being a reality, it's quite a process.

Perhaps a good place to start. This is my ongoing project with my literature students:

In Spanish and English

It's the usual complainers of how horrible things are in the DR. I posed the same question once to Leonel Fdnz. I was just as sour as all of you. He showed me the light. Dr is not more/less corrupt than the USA. Corruption,grafting,greasing the wheels is an endemic problem in politics around the world. He told me about Enron and similar mega problems in the USA. His English is pretty good. Anyways the changes you guys are asking for are not possible in the DR or elsewhere. Your utopian visions are only possible in the Star Trek universe with their United Earth gov't hogwash.

Mondongo,you have been "AWAY" too long!

But it is clear that you are still a dominican at heart! You just complain,blame "You People",and come to a "conclusion" that is just stupid!

"Where is it that you live again?" Santo Domingo"???????????
Oh,BOSTON is it????How many years ago did you leave the land you "defend" so strongly?

We are not "comparing" ourselves to the dominican people,only pointing to their problems and shortcomings!

"Educated Dominicans",talk about an Oxymoron!!!!!!!!!!!! All 2 % of them you must be talking about??? When you talk in generalizations about the DR,you talk about the 85 to 90 % who are functionally illiterate!, not the 12 % who actually can hold a job in a bank, or insurance company,or teach school.Or the 2% who can leave tomorrow for New York or London and go to work as a financial consultant!

Take a deep breath,this ain't personal Pib,we both want the same thing,but you must "expose" the "cancer" before you "cure" it!

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