Dominican Troops Must Stay on in Iraq, Says US

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Ed_NYC

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SANTO DOMINGO (Reuters) - The United States expects troops from the Dominican Republic sent to Iraq (news - web sites) to serve the full year promised and not to leave ahead of schedule, a U.S. official told the Dominican government on Thursday.

President Hipolito Mejia and Armed Forces Minister Lt. Gen. Jose Miguel Soto Jimenez indicated last week the Caribbean country's 300-strong contingent could be pulled out before February after their base in the southern city of Diwaniya came under mortar attack.

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egomezb

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I Agree!

I agree with the US stance, if they were promised we'll be there for a year I don't see a reason for pulling out our troops before that. Our troops are doing a good job, AFAIK, and just a couple mortars won't scare them.

EGB
 

ltsnyder

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Protecting you own ass . . . . DR style

You have to remember that the DR was promise a position in what would be considered a safe area, alot of what was promised to the DR is turning out to not be true. The DR wants to fulfill this obligation to get favors at the FTA (like a seat at the table, which last I heard they got, I guess it could be taken away). The other side of the coin is that, if were they are positionioned is becoming a hot zone, and with the US encircling towns with resistance in razor wire, setting up check points, issueing ID cards for a limited number that may leave the town (sound familiar?) . . . (making vauge threats about if towns people do not forware attacks that crop and other equipment might be distroyed (This last comment I have not yet double verified, but it sounds probable). The US risks a catastrophic switch of public opinion in Iraq. If the DR troops and general have the heads up on this and know they should pull out before it becomes too hot, more power to them. A significant loss of Dominican life in Iraq would be a very bad and potentially turning issue for an election.

-Lee

Even for me, what I say sounds like doom and gloom, but Vietnam happened with the best armchair generals money could buy in the US.

Here is one more tibbit take it for what it is . . .

The same people who were in operation phenox in vietnam (this was a "human time sensitive taget" operation i.e. assaination and tortur program to eliminate VC loyalist that went totally out of control are now RUmsfields pets and being wisked up the ranks while Rumsfield has been washing out all (in the petntagon)that have been preventing or opposing what he wants . . . . an assasination program against Iraqi insurgent leaders. . . . etc (sound familiar again? . . . ). What's scarier than the program is the people who are being put in charge of the operation, think of the "Deer Hunter" when he was being tortured, Apocoyps now for a personality type you can identify with (remember how I think the leader thought he was a god or the right hand of god so to speak?) or "Platoon" where bloodthirsty people survive just because they were expidiant.

Ok lot's of rambling here, here is one more, which US senator was it that was in a Vietnam massacur, where they were sent out to ambush a meeting of VC and stumbled into a village in a declared "Free Fire" zone, so they killed the whole lot.

US soldiers with a moral sense came out of that so screwed up, they don't know which way is up.

back to the topic, the DR general is just calling it as he sees it, I'm sure he will have a chat with Hippolito and between the need for FTA and other benifits and what he tells Hipo a decision will be made. I don't think the DR troops are in a dangerous zone, but then again Bush also convinced me the war was over.

-Lee
 

Ken

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Lee, you trying to kill this thread. Long diatribes about Vietnam are the quickest way to accomplish that.
 
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safer now???

I think that the Domenican soldiers will stay longer now that Saddam has been captured...

Also, mr Noriega feels that they should stay... for cash from the US hippo will probably let them stay.

MD
 

Texas Bill

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It seems to me that should the Dominican contingent be withdrawn before having completed their stated mission, they would and should be branded Cowards in the face of the enemy and relagated to the role of being "Paper Tigers" incapable of performing as an effective force for either combat OR peacekeeping roles.
The International result of such a withdrawal would be one of shame, regardless of any rationalized excuses given.

Texas Bill
 

jsizemore

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my opinion

I have no opinion as to whether they should stay or should go. However as a military person I personally would not like being the chain of command of another country. So I can see where there is a little less than enthusiasm to be there on the part of the Dominican Officers.
They are such a small number of Dominican Soldiers involved that they can not set up there own force protection and are only able to protect themselves in their compounds. The force protection requirements are so vast that for them to operate on any level other than just staying in the compound means that the put there force protection in the hands of outsiders.
I am basing this only on previous experience over there and not on direct knowledge of the Dominican Soldiers current situation. But like I said it is my humble opinion. The political issues are above my pay grade as they say.
John
 

Criss Colon

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The Dominican soldiers are part of a "Group" of Spanish Speaking military

They are assigned to the Group lead by Spain! They are NOT on their own! CCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCC

Note to Texas Billy.
You know that the Dominican Soldiers on the ground in Iraq,just like the other soldiers there,stay or go at the orders of their Civilians Leaders back home! If their division pulls out,do you expect them to say,"Sorry,I am going to stay and fight"!
A "Coward" is a soldier who runs,or refuses to fight in the face of enemy aggresion,not a soldier who follows legal orders from his superiors to leave the field of battle!Their Government may not have the stomach for them to stay,but the soldiers are not cowards! We do know what you mean however!

I don't know any man who has been in combat,that does not look back on it as a "positive' experience in his life.Can't speak for the dead ones! Cris Colon
 
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Narcosis

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I just saw this and must relpy to Texas Bill..

The last thing you can call those guys are cowards!!

You as an American should be ashamed for saying that..Stupid I would accept..but cowards!!

These guys are members of a 3 world countries armed forces...With not even a shred of the benifits an American soldier gets from their goverment, all for fighting a war most people in the US would never fight. And on top of it is is not their decision to make if the stay or go.
 

jsizemore

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on thier own

Ragradless of what country has their back they still put their safety in the hands of some one besides their own country man.
John
 

Chris

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I really have not even figured out what they are doing over there besides possibly creating political mileage for a certain pancake head that has the nerve to call himself a president. It is not the DR's fight.... I also do not see any other Caribbean country falling over themselves to send their soldiers (If there is another Caribbean country with actual soldiers). Yeah.. yeah - I know mine does not count for the popular opinion.
 

jsizemore

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popular or not is is an opinion

Cris here is my though.
I am active duty military now. America is calling the shots. America should bear the brunt. The troubles the troups are having there will not be aleviated by 500 or even 50,000 troups from the DR and other places.
It is going to take some time. The US military will need to expand and it is not the responsablity of the Dominican Republic to take the pressure off.
The desire for other countries troups in Iraq is not a military decision but a political one.
My humble opinion.
John
 

Narcosis

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John you hit the nail on the head.

This whole issue is a political one. While The United States biggest allies, Germany and France, choose to sit on the sidelines, a tiny peaceful nation chooses to support the US.

I don't care about Hippolito or polititians..I care about 300 guys that are in harm's way and 8 million that must now live by that initial decision to support the USA.

Any American that can call a Dominican soldier a coward should hide their head in shame. Why are you not you in Iraq?
 

jsizemore

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My deployent rotation

I was there unti June adn I go back next July. My last time before I retire.
John
 

Texas Bill

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Let me be VERY CLEAR as to exactly what my post was intended to convey!

I am NOT inferring that Dominican Soldiers are Cowards!
Go back and read the post AGAIN!!

What I said was that if this government pulled it's soldiers out of the 'harms way' mileau, then they would be branded in the manner stated by the International Community!

So, don't put words in my mouth, get all upset and chastize me with your defensive personality, nor for misinterpreting what was written.

I know what fear does to men in combat! I was in Korea flying unarmed T-6 aircraft marking targets for the Combat Air Patrol aircraft. I've chewed my way out of the bottom of my aircraft plenty of times and consider myself amoung the luckiest b^^^^^^^ alive today for having survived.

I thank the 'Old Man Upstairs' that NONE of the Dominican soldiers were killed, injured during their tour and hope that none will be in the future. These men are a credit to their Nation and I expect that they will continue to be in the future if this politically corrupt government will allow it.

Texas Bill
 

Narcosis

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Sorry Bill

With all due respect, maybe you should re-read your own post.

When you state "they would and SHOULD be branded cowards" you not only are saying that internationally these soldiers would be branded cowards but that you in effect agree with them.

I wonder what international community are you referring to? Germany, France ?

Coward is a very strong word and should not be used so recklessly.
 
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Arve

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Mmmm.. I'll try to be careful here. :) Will fail miserably though.;)

Firstly, I'm not sure how the "international community" would
brand the Dominican Republic if they withdrew. A lot would see
the Iraqi issue now as an American job, and wouldn't mind if
they got stuck with it. Don't forget that the international
reputation of the US right now is probably at its lowest point
since the final years of the Vietnam War.

Personally I also think it's a political issue, and I believe it would
be better if they stayed. Right now the US presence in Iraq
struggles to be seen as legitimate. A wider international
participation will IMHO help lend legitimacy to a process of
reconstruction which is in the interest of the world
( not only those who supported the war, or the US.. ), but also
to a majority of the Iraqis themselves.

I'm not sure what the Dominicans there are actually doing.. But
on the "military" side ( I would have preferred it to have been a
largely civilian matter, but it's an imperfect world ), providing
security in a time after an old order has broken down and
before a new one is properly established is tricky and requires
resources. More so than most seem to have expected.. It was
always likely that taking the place would be great fun, I was very
excited about this particular sequel, but holding it is a different
story. Anyways, these transition periods are always the tough
ones, more violent and messy compared to established
orders, authoritarian or democratic. ( So much for the democratic
peace theory in the short term btw, for those who're into that... )

So, it seems like as if the project has been short of both
legitimacy and force. The Dominicans help add to both of those,
and should IMHO be proud and supportive. Getting the job done
in reconstructing Iraq is what matters, and the responsability is
international ( regardless of the facts that Bush is a jerk AND
democraticly elected.., two facts which imho largely determines
one's attitudes on Iraq.. ). The Dominicans are there, great
stuff. Pray neither they nor others get hurt in the process, and
pray for those who are. :)

Final note. People, like Dick Cheney, believed things would go
rather smoothly, and that the troops there would be "welcomed
as liberators". They should have read up on Machiavelli among
others... Your enemies will hate you for losing their priviledges,
and your friends will turn against you as well, as the initial
euphoria will be replaced by disappointment and disillusion when
improvement doesn't come as fast as one had hoped.

I might just be wrong though... BTW, I'm a coward! I'd rather
run to live another day, than die trying. ;)
 

Texas Bill

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Narcosis;

OK! Your point well taken!

The INTENT of my post was to convey that the RESULT of withdrawing forces from 'harms way' in any military event other than capitulation (surrender) was to render the conclusion so cited. The Dominican government would be viewed as the 'paper tiger' in such an event and not the combat/peacekeeping forces, whose orders are given by that government. Such a withdrawal in the face of the enemy would convey to the world the idea that the country had not the will to carry out it's stated policy. The DR would suffer and would be viewed as a politically opportunistic nation with a useless military force which would have been withdrawn dishonorably in the face of undetermined opposition.
Honorable withdrawal is a different story altogether, as you well know.

I apologize for casting unintended disparagement upon the honorable soldiers of the Dominican Republic, but not upon their political leaders. Soldiers must obey their superiors in all legal eventualities.

I do hope the above clearly represents my intentions and clarifies my statement.

Mea Culpa

Texas Bill
 
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