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Thread: Santo Domingo Metro

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Porfio_Rubirosa
    This is where I think the plan may fail.

    My seis cheles:

    First, after watching Leonel complete substantial infrastructure projects (by any country's standards) during his first term, I think he could get a Metro done - though I doubt he could start the project for at least two years given the state of the economy.

    Second, that people will "get their cut" hardly matters. They "get their cut" in Boston, Milan, Seul and Mexico City now. Still, giant infrastructure projects get built. It's really not about whether there is corruption, but, rather, whether the corruption is predictable and managable.

    Third, a dedicated power plant and separate governing authority with the power to enter into its own fuel import contracts could resolve the power issue -- "could" being the operative term.

    Fourth, as Erickxson pointed out, the benefits of the project would be massive.

    Fifth, all of the above would be for naught unless the government can keep the guaguas and publicos off of 27th of February. How could any modern transit system compete in price with a 1984 Toyota Tercell seating 8 people that hasn't been inspected ever, has no suspension, has a rusted-out floorboard, and spews more black soot than the entire city of Pittsburgh?

    Finally, Pib, Criss sent me an email asking that I not use the term "kneejerk", which I notice you did in your post. He also derided its use in the debate forum. He says it's very '60s and, apparently, he has trouble sleeping at night when people use it.
    Good post Porfi, however, why did you only rated your post as "seis cheles". I mean, that is so cheap! Un peso would have been much much better.



    Generally, what you said is what I believe confronts this and any other project started by Leonel or any other government afterwards, give or take a few considerations to fit the country of that particular time.

    I am just wondering (and this is for everybody, not just Porfi). When most Dominicans say "vamos en el Metro" they are talking about Metro Bus. I just wonder what would be the popular name for the real metro once it becomes a reality.

    Will they call it "el tren" or "el metro nuevo" or "la guagua nueva"?
    Will the masses invent a new nickname that we never saw coming? Example would be "el gusano" or "la culebra" or something weird. This would be interesting none the less.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by TEHAMA
    Financing from Brazil?? If I recall Curitba, Brazil has a most unique Public Transit System where stretch buses act like trains through a dedicated right-of-way. They called it a BUS RAPID TRANSIT, I think. San Fran, Atlanta and Las Vegas were all hot on this idea at one time. Maybe even Chicago and Portland. This type service is most inexpensive and very possible.
    Here's a link. I can almost picture something like this on the old 27th of February below the elevated highway. http://www.itdp.org/news/BRT_English.html

  3. #18
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    this metro would be a good idea and might even encourage some people to leave their cars at home. That being said, the country is already dug itself 6 feet deep and borrowing the billons necesary for this project the would not be a wise idea and we all know it, no matter how pretty the people that will get rich with this project paint it. If it gets built, I'm the first one to be intimidated by the overhead system until it proves that no DR earthquake can touch it, then I'll roll my dice if I ever have to travel that route. Since the metro will have a linear route, only so many commuters will be able to benefit from it. And what's next?, borrow another gazellion dollars to have a route going north and south?...how about a route to the airport?..zona colonial anyone??..maybe somebody have to tell the president to start mapping land to give up as payment, just like Hippo did recently. I think all these crook politicians finally found a legitimate way to get rich no matter what party runs the country and wait until the perroD comes back up and gets its hands on it, big houses in brickell key, here we come!... About the name, we'll have to wait and see what the metro gets as it will be another "made in DR" nickname.

    just my 2 shillings which are more than 6 cheles.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by leromero
    Comments like this one are obviously from someone that does not know the dominican psyche (sp) to well. I don't pretend to know it either, but when have you seen a project proposed "for the good of the people" without it being hijacked by the corrupt officials meant to oversee the project. The amount of money involved in this is way to much for someone not to look for their cut. This project wont happen.

    My man stick to the subject! if you know the Dominican Psyche so well why arent you living here? you can manage? i gess not.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------

    there are many ways to get rid of those conchos and the freaking stupid oversized with an idiot for a driver guaguas OH MY GOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! you dont know how much i hate those ANIMALS on 27th AVENUE i hate them with all my heart>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    1. All passenger cars must pass an enviroment smoke inspection
    2. All passenger cars must pass a security test
    3. All passenger cars must have seatbealts

    with that i'm pretty sure that 99.9% of CONCHOS will disappear

  5. #20
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    Damn!...ERICKXSON for president. 2008-2012.

  6. #21
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    I would love to see the back of the conchos but getting rid of them is going to be very difficult. Only a very brave politician would risk the ire of the drivers' unions and the passengers themselves. To placate the public, bus and metro fares would have to be comparable to concho fares. The drivers would demand compensation and are sure to raise hell for losing their livelihoods.

    I used to live and work in Caracas where the metro runs like a spine through the centre of the city. You still have to take the more chaotic and popular 'por puestos' (minibuses) from surrounding neighbourhoods down to the nearest metro station. My commute from San Bernardino to Las Mercedes involved a metro ride with one por puesto at each end. I would have never dreamed of driving, and although Caracas has never really cracked its gargantuan traffic congestion problem, it has a wonderful metro used by the carless and car owners alike.

    One of the things I dislike most about living in Santo Domingo is that anyone who has a choice (including me) chooses to use the car. I look forward to the day when there is a realistic alternative like an integrated bus-metro system which means I can leave the damn thing at home.

    Chiri

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nal0whs
    And about the electricity deal, these metro trains would probably have their own planta generating electricity somewhere just for them. In addition to that, each train car could have some solar panels installed on the roof of the cars to create even more energy for the system.

    Do you have any idea how many watts or MW those solar panels would produce on the underground Metro as proposed?

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Argo
    Do you have any idea how many watts or MW those solar panels would produce on the underground Metro as proposed?
    Don't confuse the word metro with what the word means in the rest of the world.

    Example: Metro in rest of the world means a subway system or for those of you Londoners the Tube.

    Metro in the DR for now means those comfy coach buses speaking along the highways, but in this thread it is referred to the monorail that has been planned for Santo Domingo since 1996!

    They were not planning to do an underground thing, its all "al aire libre".

    But to answer your question, solar panels would produce none watts, but since its a monorail type of thing being proposed (and with this Caribbean sun that anybody can cook an egg in minutes out there) a solar panel might produce enough to get it through during a "normal" blackout.

  9. #24
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    Default My 2 Cents

    Im being generally optimistic but I hope 10 years from now this thing [name pending] will be built. I will cry of happiness the day I see GuaGuas publicas and carros publicos abolished, they ruin vacations. Even though this thread is about the Metro I want give some input on how to damage the current "transport" system.
    Create laws:
    1) No old cars aloud [pre-1995] thats about 98.0% of these drivers.
    2) Only legal Taxi Services can pick up passengers, example Yellow Cabs in NYC, DR needs a Yellow Cab service/ system.
    3) Every car must pass inspections and 4 passenger limit [including driver]
    4) Buses can only stop/ pick up on designated posts, I have been scared to death on HighWays as these buses stop randomly in the middle of 100km zone, gotta be stop.
    5) Also Companies/ Union Buses can operate, no independant buses.
    6) Create a special police force to monitor this problem in every city. Those who dont comply will first get fined, repeat get jail time, and if they repeat again get everything confiscated. Also creation of government office so the government can also win something.

    But back to the Metro I hope this government can build something anything to eliminate he traffic problem.

  10. #25
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    I like CampoDominicano's ideas on this, especially #2.

    All the authorized taxis should be new VW Beattles! Everybody (including the illiterate and foreign tourist) will be able to distinguish an authentic authorize taxi from the phonies. And it will make it easier for the police to crack down on the non-beattles picking up and dropping off mass numbers of people!

    Imagine, the streets of Santo Domingo flooded with new Beattles!

  11. #26
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    Default Original Post

    Quote Originally Posted by Nal0whs
    Don't confuse the word metro with what the word means in the rest of the world.

    Example: Metro in rest of the world means a subway system or for those of you Londoners the Tube.

    Metro in the DR for now means those comfy coach buses speaking along the highways, but in this thread it is referred to the monorail that has been planned for Santo Domingo since 1996!

    They were not planning to do an underground thing, its all "al aire libre".

    But to answer your question, solar panels would produce none watts, but since its a monorail type of thing being proposed (and with this Caribbean sun that anybody can cook an egg in minutes out there) a solar panel might produce enough to get it through during a "normal" blackout.
    It must be my reading comprehension yet again, but for some reason the original post seemed to indicate an underground system, my mistake yet again :-(

    I may have missed something over the last few months, but I only noticed that there were plans to construct an underground transport system for Santo Domingo when people started mentioning the controversial appointment of Diandino Pena to oversee this project.

    From the BBC News website
    Quote:
    Diandino Pena, an ex-public works secretary, is appointed to head a subway construction project.

  12. #27
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    Yes, I thought that, originally, but everything I've read in Spanish (El Caribe etc) seems to be suggesting that it could be either above or below ground, depending on the feasibility study. If it IS below ground, what use would solar panels be? Unless the "parking" area was in the sun to stock up.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Argo
    It must be my reading comprehension yet again, but for some reason the original post seemed to indicate an underground system, my mistake yet again :-(

    I may have missed something over the last few months, but I only noticed that there were plans to construct an underground transport system for Santo Domingo when people started mentioning the controversial appointment of Diandino Pena to oversee this project.

    From the BBC News website
    Quote:
    Diandino Pena, an ex-public works secretary, is appointed to head a subway construction project.
    It might be an underground deal, but when this project was first presented to the public (back in 1996), it was a over ground monorail type of thing. Here is the link:

    Notice: the project was presented in both English and Spanish, for English click on "English Version" in the upper left corner. Also, notice that the Monorail project was part of the overall Transportation Project that was implemented in the city. The widening of many major roads, the new expressways, and the tunnels found across Santo Domingo, and the new Juan Bosch Bridge are only a part of the overall Transportation Project for the city. The project also included the light rail system to be implemented as well.

    http://www.modelistica.com/projects/...omingo_en.html

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nal0whs
    It might be an underground deal, but when this project was first presented to the public (back in 1996), it was a over ground monorail type of thing. Here is the link:

    Notice: the project was presented in both English and Spanish, for English click on "English Version" in the upper left corner. Also, notice that the Monorail project was part of the overall Transportation Project that was implemented in the city. The widening of many major roads, the new expressways, and the tunnels found across Santo Domingo, and the new Juan Bosch Bridge are only a part of the overall Transportation Project for the city. The project also included the light rail system to be implemented as well.

    http://www.modelistica.com/projects/...omingo_en.html
    I am sure there are dozens or "proposals, ideas etc" I thought I would be silly and stick to the question posed by the original poster, stupid me :-( thinking I could gather his intent from what he wrote rather than what everyone else surmised and concluded

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    Quote Originally Posted by suarezn
    HB: Please let's not start with that phrase again...I really hate it (cause it came from the PRD).

    Anyhow, I think this is very stupid idea and it's just something designed to give this guy (Diandino) another chance to steal. Everyone knows this guy is corrupt. Where is The DR going to get the money for this? We're talking about 35 million USD per kilometer (that's the current estimate. I'm sure that the actual cost would be about twice that much). Brazil is not just going to give money for this...they may "lend it", as long as the companies contracted to do the work are from Brazil. In addition the fare will have to be subsidized, thus creating another huge amount of money the government will have to disburse on a regular basis (more taxes).
    How about electricity? Won't they need to have it 24/7 for this to work?
    The only way I would support this is if it was financed and operated completely by the private sector.
    Not going to happen...
    suarezn is 100% right.
    the pld are famous for ploys like this.....you can be sure that when this dies down, they will start again about the rail link between the capital and santiago......and somebody will make a few bucks with their 'feasibility studies', etc.
    it is not going to happen.

    getting rid of the old cars, etc......is another thing. the pld will certainly do a better job at that - amet and omsa are both pld inventions, impressive when they first arrived....pitiful these days.
    they will definitely do a better job improving traffic than the pph ever would/did(/will - god forbid).

    how that will help the poor odd-bod in the campo? - i just don't know.

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