Santo Domingo Metro
I may have missed something over the last few months, but I only noticed that there were plans to construct an underground transport system for Santo Domingo when people started mentioning the controversial appointment of Diandino Pena to oversee this project.
From the BBC News website
As an environmentalist I am a strong supporter of promoting effective public transport, so a Metro system for Santo Domingo is - on paper - a good idea.
Diandino Pena, an ex-public works secretary, is appointed to head a subway construction project.
My questions are: is this the right time to be starting this when there are so many more urgent problems that need large amounts of cash?
On a more cynical note, is this destined to be yet another white elephant that makes a lot of money for people in government and their cronies the contractors, but does not end up benefiting the population?
Last edited by Chirimoya; 08-21-2004 at 04:59 AM.
Reason: added in quote from BBC site
1) Financing from Brazil
2) From Los Mina to Herrera, more or less along the 27 de Febrero route.
3) It is supposed to be above ground, sort of like the people mover in Miami
Who know what goes on in the minds of the Come solos??
You guys have any idea how much money that would take? US BILLIONS!! Above ground is cheaper, but either way I would not trust the dominican construction on such project.
I wouldn't look forward to riding the subway anytime soon.
HB: Please let's not start with that phrase again...I really hate it (cause it came from the PRD).
Originally Posted by Hillbilly
Anyhow, I think this is very stupid idea and it's just something designed to give this guy (Diandino) another chance to steal. Everyone knows this guy is corrupt. Where is The DR going to get the money for this? We're talking about 35 million USD per kilometer (that's the current estimate. I'm sure that the actual cost would be about twice that much). Brazil is not just going to give money for this...they may "lend it", as long as the companies contracted to do the work are from Brazil. In addition the fare will have to be subsidized, thus creating another huge amount of money the government will have to disburse on a regular basis (more taxes).
How about electricity? Won't they need to have it 24/7 for this to work?
The only way I would support this is if it was financed and operated completely by the private sector.
Not going to happen...
From what I read the other day, they have yet to launch a feasibility study (although in the back of my mind I recall this being discussed a while back). It would also seem that they will be careful not to upset the Transport Unions, clarifying that in no way is the Metro meant to replace publicos & gua-guas.http://www.elcaribe.com.do/articulo_...49F&Seccion=63
Sometimes i wonder what the hell goes on in some of the board readers and contribuitors...... YES WHAT THE HEll?
1. a subway is a great idea less people destroying the enviroment
2. 24/7 light for the country or atleast the SUBWAY and thus less gas comsuption for the masses since less people will be using cars
3. less freaking traficccccccccccccccccccccc!
4. no more (CONCHOS) in the near future
5. and so on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! look at the positive side of things.
Now why you think Dominicans can't pull that project off? what makes Dominican less than your kind (PLEASE DON'T RIDE THE SUBWAY).
I will reserve my approval or dissaproval pending more information. Kneejerking is not my style.
In principle I am for it. We need better public transport, and say as you wish, but while many people decried the construction that went on during Leonel's governemnt I drove in Santo Domingo before, during and after the construction and I have no doubt in my mind, whatsoever, that it was a good thing. OMSA was also a great step, but we know what the PRD did with it.
We need decent, dignified, reliable, and confortable public transportation. If we get that even I will be glad to leave my car at home often as I am not really all that fond of driving. OMSA was the closest we got to that, but it was just the start and it sunk like a rock during the past government.
If it sounds harsh, sorry. I have worked with numerous civil construction projects. It would very nice to have. However, a country that can't quite manage the electricity bill will not be able to manage a subway. Notice I dont deny the possibly of an above ground light rail project.
Financing from Brazil?? If I recall Curitba, Brazil has a most unique Public Transit System where stretch buses act like trains through a dedicated right-of-way. They called it a BUS RAPID TRANSIT, I think. San Fran, Atlanta and Las Vegas were all hot on this idea at one time. Maybe even Chicago and Portland. This type service is most inexpensive and very possible.
Just my two pesos,
Cynicism gets the best of me, too.
I think a public rail would be ideal....but why go to the expense of going underground (except perhaps in the capital). But i would certainly agree that for now the focus should be the immediate problems at hand. I am hardly an expert on the subject of dominican politics and policies...but i really have been reading up and finding out as much as i possible can. However...what good would a subway be if there is no electricity? Sounds like a no brainer to me. Work on the current problems....then say if things stabelize in a year or so...and economy actualy picks up...THEN seriously consider such a huge project. Yes it means spending money...but it will also generate jobs.
Just my two pesos.....hope i didnt butt in too much
The only Metro without a time schedule, next train... eventually
My guess is this will be another train line like the one the Indians and jailed guy from Puerto Rico was going to build.
These people need to get their heads out of the clouds and work on the little things, like putting gas in an OMSA bus or condemning concho's held together with coat hangers and duct tape.
This board is so critical of what the Dominicans can actually get done. No wonder nothing ever happens. Hehe
This metro deal is a good thing!
As stated before, the masses will benefit well from it and our roads will ease up a bit from all this congestion, especially during the dreadful rush hours!
As with everything, this metro won't last for too long in the hands of the government. Remember, the new world order suggest that government sell every asset to the private sector. The DR government sold all their airports and look how fabulous they have turned out to be. Metro Bus and Caribe Tours are much better than those beat up pre-owned school buses that used to ply the roads before. So, why think it will become a white elephant? This will benefit Dominicans and tourists, so why not!
They should install an express monorail that links the center of the Capital with Las Americas Airport, that would also be a big help!
The samething should be done in Puerto Plata. A monorail connecting Puerto Plata, Sosua, and Cabarete. That would be convenient for the tourists, the Dominican workers, the expats who refuse to buy a car, and everything else on the north coast!
But, right now the most critical place in the DR for such a project is SDQ, we need it so bad!
And about the electricity deal, these metro trains would probably have their own planta generating electricity somewhere just for them. In addition to that, each train car could have some solar panels installed on the roof of the cars to create even more energy for the system.
Comments like this one are obviously from someone that does not know the dominican psyche (sp) to well. I don't pretend to know it either, but when have you seen a project proposed "for the good of the people" without it being hijacked by the corrupt officials meant to oversee the project. The amount of money involved in this is way to much for someone not to look for their cut. This project wont happen.
Originally Posted by ERICKXSON
This is where I think the plan may fail.
Originally Posted by Lambada
My seis cheles:
First, after watching Leonel complete substantial infrastructure projects (by any country's standards) during his first term, I think he could get a Metro done - though I doubt he could start the project for at least two years given the state of the economy.
Second, that people will "get their cut" hardly matters. They "get their cut" in Boston, Milan, Seul and Mexico City now. Still, giant infrastructure projects get built. It's really not about whether there is corruption, but, rather, whether the corruption is predictable and managable.
Third, a dedicated power plant and separate governing authority with the power to enter into its own fuel import contracts could resolve the power issue -- "could" being the operative term.
Fourth, as Erickxson pointed out, the benefits of the project would be massive.
Fifth, all of the above would be for naught unless the government can keep the guaguas and publicos off of 27th of February. How could any modern transit system compete in price with a 1984 Toyota Tercell seating 8 people that hasn't been inspected ever, has no suspension, has a rusted-out floorboard, and spews more black soot than the entire city of Pittsburgh?
Finally, Pib, Criss sent me an email asking that I not use the term "kneejerk", which I notice you did in your post. He also derided its use in the debate forum. He says it's very '60s and, apparently, he has trouble sleeping at night when people use it.
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