My friend is being SUED...

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Big Steve

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I have a friend who works in Santiago who is being sued by a Haitian who is not a legal resident of the Dominican Republic. My friend, being a very generous person who spent a number of years in Haiti, helps out people whenever he can. When people come his way he gives them odd jobs and such to help protect their personal pride, rather than just hand them some money. This one Haitian man in particular, received quite a bit of assistance from my friend, including money for a couple of trips back to Haiti, food, clothes etc. This guy also did some yard work for my firend a couple of times. Well, no good deed goes unpunished. When my friend decided that the charity needed to come to an end, this guy sues him for back pay and severance pay, emotional issues... you name it. He claims he was an employee who was let go without severance pay, vacation time etc. There never was any formal contract, paychecks, nothing, in fact, this guy is not even in the country legally. In conversation with the Dominican lawyer representing the Haitian guy, he has no interested in ending this quietly. He is determined to take it to court, which is scheduled for September 9. Is there any chance that my friend could lose such a ludicrous case? having lived on Hispaniola, I know how often you 'hire' someone to watch or wash your car, do dome light yard work, whatever... if those individuals can now sue you??? What do you think?
Thanks for any help or advice you can give.
Big Steve
 
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Escott

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I don't think your friend got sued. I think he went to a government agency and asked for severance which he may be entitled to. To sue and not being a resident you need to post a bond which is something I would be surprised has happened.

Yes I think your friend may have to pay severance.
 
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Big Steve

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Thanks, Scott, for your reply.
I am not sure perhaps, of the correct terminology, but my friend, the expat, was subpoenaed to appear in court. He contacted the lawyer representing the haitian guy, who is not a legal resident. Is it possible that the lawyer representing the Haitian could take the case without this 'bond' payment? You say that you believe that my friend will have to pay severance in this type of situation. What is to stop this from becoming a HUGE moneymaking scam for the (probably) thousands of "unofficial" workers in the Dominican Republic?
 
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locofoto

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Looks like this case is just based on an afterwards constructed employment contract. There has not always to exist a written contract. Shaking hands and agreeing on something is sufficient. The problem with this type of contract arises when you have to proof its existence.

Frequent payments in other parts of the world just provide this proof. Law in Europe works the same way as in the DR as the base is the same Napolean Code.
 
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Rocky

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Big Steve said:
I have a friend who works in Santiago who is being sued by a Haitian who is not a legal resident of the Dominican Republic. My friend, being a very generous person who spent a number of years in Haiti, helps out people whenever he can. When people come his way he gives them odd jobs and such to help protect their personal pride, rather than just hand them some money. This one Haitian man in particular, received quite a bit of assistance from my friend, including money for a couple of trips back to Haiti, food, clothes etc. This guy also did some yard work for my firend a couple of times. Well, no good deed goes unpunished. When my friend decided that the charity needed to come to an end, this guy sues him for back pay and severance pay, emotional issues... you name it. He claims he was an employee who was let go without severance pay, vacation time etc. There never was any formal contract, paychecks, nothing, in fact, this guy is not even in the country legally. In conversation with the Dominican lawyer representing the Haitian guy, he has no interested in ending this quietly. He is determined to take it to court, which is scheduled for September 9. Is there any chance that my friend could lose such a ludicrous case? having lived on Hispaniola, I know how often you 'hire' someone to watch or wash your car, do dome light yard work, whatever... if those individuals can now sue you??? What do you think?
Thanks for any help or advice you can give.
Big Steve
Click to expand...
Illegal immigrants without working papers are not entitled to "liquidacion" (severance pay)
 
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AlaninDR

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Why not "tip" immigration to also appear in court.....no plaintiff no problems.
 
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MrMike

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Your friend needs a lawyer, no two ways about it. It may be bullshit and it may be not, but he will be screwed either way without adequate representation.

Call 575-3909 and ask for Connie Reyes - hope he speaks spanish. She can tell you what to expect but you may not like what you hear. Also she is a very busy woman who does not generally take on clients (she is personel director of a free zone manufacturing company) but she is an expert on employment law and can advise you how to proceed, refer you to the right lawyer etc.

Most likely the best way to handle your case is to try to settle. Your friend is not up against a Haitian but his greedy lawyers who will not let it rest and will likely give him around 10% of the settlement so do all you can to deal directly with the Haitian - it's in both of your best interests.
 
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Escott

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Big Steve said:
Thanks, Scott, for your reply.
I am not sure perhaps, of the correct terminology, but my friend, the expat, was subpoenaed to appear in court. He contacted the lawyer representing the haitian guy, who is not a legal resident. Is it possible that the lawyer representing the Haitian could take the case without this 'bond' payment? You say that you believe that my friend will have to pay severance in this type of situation. What is to stop this from becoming a HUGE moneymaking scam for the (probably) thousands of "unofficial" workers in the Dominican Republic?
Click to expand...
There is a common thought that illegal people are not entitled to benefits but they are.

Good luck to your friend.
 
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Eddy

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Not enough information

How long did he work there? Did your friend receive notification from the Labour Dept? (Other than a piece of paper brough to him by the plaintiff). Did a guy from the Labour Dept. come to visit him? Better wait for Fabio's advice but if the guy just did odd jobs and did not work for minimum 3 months I don't think he's entitled to anything other than a good kick in the **s. If your friend hasn't allready, he should go to the Labour office and explain the situation. There are two sides to every story. As a rule they are pretty fair, at least in Puerto Plata. Could also be a bluff. I can't imagine an intelligent lawyer taking a case like that unless he thinks your friend is an easy "mark" or he hasn't told you everything.
 
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jcrue20

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bring the case to JUDGE JUDY or JUDGE JOE BROWN. i bet there is no 'severance pay'. HEHEHE!!!
 
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Fabio J. Guzman

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Labor contracts don't need to be in written form under Dominican law. It?s a question of fact that can be established in Court.

Illegal aliens can sue their employers for severance pay. The Dominican Supreme Court has also ruled that foreign plaintiffs do not have to post a bond to sue in labor matters.
 
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Big Steve

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Thanks Sen. Guzman et al.

Fabio J. Guzman said:
Labor contracts don't need to be in written form under Dominican law. It?s a question of fact that can be established in Court.

Illegal aliens can sue their employers for severance pay. The Dominican Supreme Court has also ruled that foreign plaintiffs do not have to post a bond to sue in labor matters.
Click to expand...

Thanks to all who responded to my post. I am afraid that all that this experience will accomplish will be to turn my friend into a cynic whose generous nature will become wary of helping those in our society who are truly needy.
 
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MrMike

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Big Steve said:
Thanks to all who responded to my post. I am afraid that all that this experience will accomplish will be to turn my friend into a cynic whose generous nature will become wary of helping those in our society who are truly needy.
Click to expand...

We all need to examine our reasons and methods for "helping". Helping others puts you in a position where you are making some questionable assumptions:

a: that you are qualified to judge someone else's life
b: that you are capable of improving someone else's life.

OK, if you think so highly of yourself that you are willing to make the above assumptions, then you need to make sure your methods are in line with that.

Does the lady on the street corner with a 6 month old baby begging need 10 pesos? Will the 10 pesos change her situation at all? (yes, it will reinforce her belief that she can drag a baby around street corners everyday to make a living)

"those in our society who are truly needy" do not need anything as much as they need motivation, and an understanding of getting value for value. Sure they need a lot more than that, but giving them handouts takes away what motivation and understanding they may have and the only thing you are contributing to is poverty itself. You are defying the natural order, and when it bites you in the *** you are getting what you deserve.

Face it, when you "help" those you deem "needy" you are not being generous, kind, or good. You are taking a cheap shot at making yourself feel better, maybe compensating for something else or whatever.
 
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Big Steve

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MrMike you presume too much

MrMike said:
We all need to examine our reasons and methods for "helping". Helping others puts you in a position where you are making some questionable assumptions:

a: that you are qualified to judge someone else's life
b: that you are capable of improving someone else's life.

OK, if you think so highly of yourself that you are willing to make the above assumptions, then you need to make sure your methods are in line with that.

Does the lady on the street corner with a 6 month old baby begging need 10 pesos? Will the 10 pesos change her situation at all? (yes, it will reinforce her belief that she can drag a baby around street corners everyday to make a living)

"those in our society who are truly needy" do not need anything as much as they need motivation, and an understanding of getting value for value. Sure they need a lot more than that, but giving them handouts takes away what motivation and understanding they may have and the only thing you are contributing to is poverty itself. You are defying the natural order, and when it bites you in the *** you are getting what you deserve.

Face it, when you "help" those you deem "needy" you are not being generous, kind, or good. You are taking a cheap shot at making yourself feel better, maybe compensating for something else or whatever.
Click to expand...

Defying the natural order? By helping the needy I assure you that I was not referring to indiscriminate handouts. If someone is without food or money to buy food and I offer them some money in exchange for some work how does that defy the natural order? Never mind, this thread is not about giving a man a fish and he'll be hungry tomorrow, just teach him to fish and he'll eat whenever the fish are biting, it is about a legal issue, forgive me for opening the door to discussing welfare...
 
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MrMike

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You're right, I went off on a tangent. It's something that's been bugging me lately and I had to vent. I should have started a seperate thread.

By your response however it's clear that the man was an employee, at least by most definitions, the only thing left to determine is for how long and for how much.

"If someone is without food or money to buy food and I offer them some money in exchange for some work how does that defy the natural order?"

You, I mean your friend would be well advised to settle. Don't deal with the lawyers though, deal with the guy personally.
 
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Big Steve

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Start another thread...

MrMike said:
You're right, I went off on a tangent. It's something that's been bugging me lately and I had to vent. I should have started a seperate thread.

By your response however it's clear that the man was an employee, at least by most definitions, the only thing left to determine is for how long and for how much.

"If someone is without food or money to buy food and I offer them some money in exchange for some work how does that defy the natural order?"

You, I mean your friend would be well advised to settle. Don't deal with the lawyers though, deal with the guy personally.
Click to expand...

Start another thread in the Living Forum. I think that this could be a valuable subject to discuss among people who live among poverty... BTW, I really am talking about a friend, (I live north of Chicago), and whether or not he ever "worked" for my friend was never the issue. The question was and still is, if you give someone an odd job or two, (or three or four...) when does that person become an 'employee' in the formal sense deserving of benefits, vacation pay, severance etc.? That is the issue...
 
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MrMike

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Big Steve said:
Start another thread in the Living Forum. I think that this could be a valuable subject to discuss among people who live among poverty... BTW, I really am talking about a friend, (I live north of Chicago), and whether or not he ever "worked" for my friend was never the issue. The question was and still is, if you give someone an odd job or two, (or three or four...) when does that person become an 'employee' in the formal sense deserving of benefits, vacation pay, severance etc.? That is the issue...
Click to expand...

Well if he can allege that he was given regular employment for a period of 3 months or more, then he has a better than 80% chance of winning a court case against your friend. He should be able to claim around 2 months pay, whatever that is. But if it goes to trial, your friend will also have to pay extra for trying to deprive the man of his legal due and his legal fees, which could be astronomical. Your friend needs a lawyer and should call the phone # I posted. Most lawyers who deal with labor law will make private deals with the employee and make sure you lose. (it's easier and the money is better)

What your friend absolutely cannot do is ignore the situation.
 
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