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Golfer

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Apr 7, 2002
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6,000 jobs disappear in La Vega due to Fernandez's monetary policy (DR1 news 7-27). Zona Francas are on life support throughtout the Island with many fabrication factories already closed in Esperanza, Puerto Plata, and Boca Chica. Even with nearly slave wages Dominican products are not competitive with production from economies with proper currency valuation. Looks like a fresh crop of children will be fleeing these blighted areas for the streets of the big cities and tourists areas or worse yet trafficed to other countries.
On another front Hoteliers have adjusted their vacation pricing to the "stable" Peso for the 05-06 season resulting in higher prices accross the board. The "bargain of the Caribbean" is looking a lot like Jamica and Cancun and very vunerable to a major malaria scare or weather related problems similar to 05. Hopefully the benefits of commercial activity in an environment of a stable currency will bear fruit before these gathering storm clouds erupt.
 
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Chris

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Oct 21, 2002
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fko1 said:
I too saw that piece of news. Hopefully DR-CAFTA when passed will help bring some jobs to the island.
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I have been thinking about this - will this be good, or not. I'm fast coming to the conclusion that we're between "the devil and the deep blue sea". Pass DR-Cafta and we can sit at the table of master and collect crumbs... Don't pass DR-Cafta and not even the crumbs...

I've said before, I'm really conflicted about this DR-Cafta thing... but then again, I'm more into fair trade than "free trade".
 
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Chris

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Escott said:
The DR will never compete with China so we need to step up the quaility of the tourism to make up for the loss of jobs we will be seeing in the near future.

Escott
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I don't get it... who made China a piece of the pie here? Where does China fit? Are they doing the tourism thing?
 
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Golfer

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Escott said:
The DR will never compete with China so we need to step up the quaility of the tourism to make up for the loss of jobs we will be seeing in the near future.

Escott
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Your point on the quality of tourism is well taken and vital to the Dominican economy however don't dismiss the Island's ability to compete with Asian production. Costs of trans-pacific containers on freighters has skyrocketed in 05 causing US retailers to look to Mexico and Latin America for suppliers. In an environment of increasing energy costs proximity to consumers is vitally important and the DR has better access to the US eastern seaboard than any country in CAFTA. Toursim dollars only go so far and the people populating the central areas of the Island still need to be productive. A sensible monetary policy in place when CAFTA is passed would create an opportunity for many factories and plantations to flourish in the DR and alleviate the grinding poverty in these blighted areas.
 
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RHM

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I agree that the results of CAFTA are not clear cut. Pass it and some will prosper while others are hurt by it. Don't pass it and some will prosper while others are hurt. It's not easy but I guess we'll have to make the best of it either way.

Scandall
 
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Escott

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Jan 14, 2002
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I am not debating with you that the government is keeping the Peso artificially inflated but I think that the Country is better placed in the hands of Tourism than production. China's wages even with fuel kept in mind are too low for the DR to compete with and sooner or later those jobs will leave here.

Escott
 
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RHM

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Escott said:
I am not debating with you that the government is keeping the Peso artificially inflated but I think that the Country is better placed in the hands of Tourism than production. China's wages even with fuel kept in mind are too low for the DR to compete with and sooner or later those jobs will leave here.

Escott
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Well said, Scotty. There are two many forces that work against the DR becoming big producers. But we have a golden opportunity to become one of the premier tourist destinations in the world (more than now). There are some parts of the island that take your breath away. Somebody just has to figure out the best plan on how to develop it to the fullest without ruining it. AI's are not the way to go. They kill the local communities and exclude the culture which should be at least one of the top selling points.

Scandall
 
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Escott

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Chris said:
I don't get it... who made China a piece of the pie here? Where does China fit? Are they doing the tourism thing?
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We cant compete in manufacturing with China. They also manipulate their currency but they go SOUTH instead of NORTH. They are going to eat the DR's lunch even if this government doesn't artificially inflate the PESO.

Tourism is something that can prosper and pick up the slack both in hard currency and in jobs. Scandall said AI's are NOT the way to go and I agree with him. I would like to see a good mix but a higher quality product that includes some of the highlights of this country. Look at Playa Grande, that alone can be a big enough draw of high end consumers that would play a big roll in offsetting the loses in manufacturing.

I am not writing it off completely but I don't see it as a high growth area.

Escott
 
Hlywud

Hlywud

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Jan 1, 2002
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This an that

Antigua, I fail to see how it got involved in the thread.

CAFTA may bring possible some low paying manufacturing jobs to the DR but there will be much more competition to get these, since places like Guatemaela and Costa Rica are in the mix as well.

More people working for less money, outsourcing from North America will take their (USA) jobs away. CAFTA (Cash for the Affluent), the mutil national corporations just love it.

Scott, I can agree with you a proper mix of tourism is needed in the undeveloped places, both AI and non AI.

mi dos peso's
 
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Timex

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May 9, 2002
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This is a Great Thread.

A very important topic.

I'm moving it to the Debate Forum.

Tim H.
 
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kurius

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I'm not so sure about the tourism ...

Ok so don't take this the wrong way because I loved the Dominican when I went there, although I have never been anywhere else tropical ... however, the group of friends that I went with had been to Cuba a few months earlier and have been to Cancun in the past. (The flip side of this coin may be that we are a group of 16 single (mixed) 22-24 year olds). Compared to Cuba it was not as clean, safe, or "hygenic". When going to the Dominican the entire group got all the immunizations and took the malaria pills etc. However, we all got violently ill and no it wasn't from the Brugal or Presidente ... it was from "Parasite" the day after we got back and it took some of us 2-3 rounds of antibiotics to get rid of. Nobody in the group that went to Cuba took anything and nothing happened to them. Also, the 4 star resort that we stayed at was more expensive than and looked like the slums compared to the much cheaper Cuban ones. In addition, some of the workers didn't speak any english (or French) and it was annoying to have all the workers not just the animacion ones whistling and making comments at the girls all the time and doing everything short of attacking us when the guys weren't around. (and then reading the sankie portion of this website and figuring out what they were after) The Cuban workers were much more respectful.

Compared to Cancun ... the party just ain't happening, which is likely why so many of the tourist girls end up with Sankies. They should maybe market it as a romantic couples get away place ... because it is a very romantic place (like most carribean islands or tropical for that matter).

Now I am Canadian, but I do work in the US and anybody American that I told I was going to the DR with my highschool friends was like "Why would you go there?" So a lot of work needs to be done on the image in the US. Now Americans cant go to Cuba (but castro won't be around for ever) but when I asked them about it, the would rather just go to Puerto Rico or Mexico.

HOWEVER, I agree that with DEVELOPMENT the tourism can be great, because the attraction used to be that it was less expensive the Mexico and Puerto Rico and Jamaica ... so they need a new hook.

OK I know this is getting long but I wanted to point out that while companies are moving to Latin America, Tyco for example, is relocating most of its staff along with the plants so it is not going to bring many high paying jobs to the areas ... most of those will be filled by North Americans, while the lower paying jobs which will likely be similar in pay to those that already exist in the areas will be the only ones available. So, yes volume of jobs will increase which is good, but it won't increase the quality of jobs.

Ok sorry for being long winded, correct my misinterpretations, because I am very interested in what it would take to develop the economy there ... but be nice I'm 23 and just one year out of college!

Kurius
 
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rendul

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Feb 24, 2002
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Cuba vs the D.R.?

I have been to Cuba five times and the problem with comparing the D.R. to Cuba is the lack of food, medications, basics in the lives of Cubans. They are poor with little opportunity in services or retail. These are strictly controlled by the government. Your friends probably stayed at an AI so they did not see the whole picture. I have toured the island and talked to residents and seen the lack of everything, including food. I have looked into the ration warehouses, and they are bare. They may get free education, including university but they cannot use this anywhere else but in Cuba. The D.R. is a democracy that at times has struggled but the availability of products, food, medication are a thousand times better than that of Cuba. The two really shouldn't be compared if going beyond the AI comparison.

Cubans are just as warmhearted and welcoming as Dominicans but to live there would eventually be a problem for anyone who is used to being able to buy medications, clothing, foods, etc. Also foreigners cannot buy outright any property. The government maintains control on all foreign investment.
 
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Golfer

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This is all wonderful however,

Of course the DR should try to develop tourism. This takes many years of intensive capital infusion, central planning, infrastructure improvement and their caribbean competition is following the same roadmap. What started this thread was the loss of six thousand jobs right now bringing the total this year to over fifty thousand! These are heads of households and young adults who are now out of work and money. These people now sit home playing dominos not because they work inefficiently or because the products they fabricate are not in demand, they sit home because the margins have evaporated for the enterprises that own these factories. The margins have evaporated not because the Chinese and Koreans work more cheaply than the Dominicans the margins have evaporated because of the monetary policy of this government. To suggest that this loss is inevitable and these endeavors are doomed to failure because other people will work more cheaply than Dominicans is irresponsible. The only reason Fernandez is able to implement this monetary policy is because labor is completely disorganized in the DR. They have no representation in this corrupt form of government no matter which party is in power and only get noticed when they start burning tires in their barrios. I hear that the colmados in Esperanza have had to stop issuing credit and things could ugly. If the DR keeps bleeding jobs these tourists could be reading about more than just burning tires in their newspapers.
BTW, occupying the same island with Haiti has already disqualified the DR for half the US tourists. They aren't interested in taking a geography lesson to learn how insulated the DR is from the poverty, disease, and social unrest of the poorest country in the western hemisphere.
 
Hillbilly

Hillbilly

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Jan 1, 2002
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It's funny

This morning we called a very good friend who has major interests in the Free Zones and he was estatic about the passage. Maybe he knows something we don't?

Regarding a comparison of the DR and Cuba> Why? They are very different.

It would be good if Kurious told us where their group stayed. Remember RIU was shut down for a thorough cleansing?? And we tell people not to take anything for malaria...huh!

One good and very important point being made by several people, Kurious and Escott being two of them,. is the incredible need to improve the tourist (1) IMAGE and the tourist (2) INFRASTRUCTRUE = roads, water and electricity!

If that gets done in the short run, the DR tourist industry will certainly fulfill the 35% growth predicted for 2010...

We hope DR1.com is one of the ways to promote the country, so your comments are very much appreciated.


HB:D:D:D
 
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Escott

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Golfer said:
To suggest that this loss is inevitable and these endeavors are doomed to failure because other people will work more cheaply than Dominicans is irresponsible. The only reason Fernandez is able to implement this monetary policy is because labor is completely disorganized in the DR. They have no representation in this corrupt form of government no matter which party is in power and only get noticed when they start burning tires in their barrios. I hear that the colmados in Esperanza have had to stop issuing credit and things could ugly. If the DR keeps bleeding jobs these tourists could be reading about more than just burning tires in their newspapers.
BTW, occupying the same island with Haiti has already disqualified the DR for half the US tourists. They aren't interested in taking a geography lesson to learn how insulated the DR is from the poverty, disease, and social unrest of the poorest country in the western hemisphere.
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To suggest the loss is inevitable and that is doomed is IRRESPONSIBLE? You must be missing part of your brain. You can wish all you want but the scale will tilt to reality every time.

You have to know when to fold them and stop being a dreamer. Although living here is getting more and more expensive, what is going on here is the price you have to pay for having a dope like Hippo run a country for 4 years.

What would be irresponsibe would be to re-elect him again which will probably happen.

To even suggest that Dominicans will do more than burn tires just shows what you don't know about this country. They went through Hippo and loved it!

Escott
 
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Golfer

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Apr 7, 2002
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You are only partially correct

I am missing part of my brain, have been for some time. Where you're mistaken is that the people did not love living under Hippo and sent him packing. Also, the Chinese were working just as cheaply 10 years ago when the free zones were flourishing but the Dominican Peso was valued properly. Even though this is the debating area of the board there's not much sense in debating this issue further. If you ask these owners why they are closing up shop they will tell you they cannot compete with the current valuation of the peso. If Fernandez is doing the country a service by accelerating these job losses time will tell. You are probably correct that the Dominican people are stoic and largely numb to poverty and will do no more than burn a few tires on a Saturday night. From where I sit it's a human tradegy.
 
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