Bolivia/Morales - any influence in DR?

samanasuenos

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I know this is a stretch,but....does anyone see Evo Morales's election in Bolivia as having any influence on folks in the DR?

I read an interview in which he suggested redistributing large private lands as well as nationalizing their gas reserves.

I know they are far away. But as Bolvia,Cuba, Brazil, and Venezuela get chummy..........and Cuba not so far away....I dunno.

What do voters in the DR think of Morales? ( I know, they do not vote in Bolivia.)

Please do not throw spoiled vegetable at me..........thank you!
 

HOWMAR

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Why would the Dominican voters give any thought to Bolivia when they don't even give a thought about the present Dominican administration buying oil from Venezuela with 30 year financing? If this practice continues the government will have mortgaged the entire country to Chavez in the next few years. The population only cares about comfort today, let the kids worry about paying for it tomorrow.
 

samanasuenos

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Good point.

well taken. thanks for going light on the raw eggs. :)

30 years? JEEZUS....I had no idea. Thank you. --

I was just curious about on the street reactions to Morales, what do folks at the colmados say when they read about him in the papers (do they?), what do the wealthy golfing guys say about him.......that kind of thing...They may not care, but I know Dominicans have OPINIONS!! JAJAJA.LOUD ONES!
 

RHM

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samanasuenos said:
well taken. thanks for going light on the raw eggs. :)

30 years? JEEZUS....I had no idea. Thank you. --

I was just curious about on the street reactions to Morales, what do folks at the colmados say when they read about him in the papers (do they?), what do the wealthy golfing guys say about him.......that kind of thing...They may not care, but I know Dominicans have OPINIONS!! JAJAJA.LOUD ONES!

Most do not have an opinion because they have no idea what goes on in the world. Those few who do know are more than likely happy. The romanticism towards the leftist "Rebel" is alive and well. Che Guevara t-shirts and hats line the shops in the Colonial City.

Scandall
 

samanasuenos

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Che

Thank you. I noticed the Che regalia everywhere, but not too many down home regular folks seemd to know much about him other than that he was cool.

Thanks again.
 

Chirimoya

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I think that's the extent of it, although there is a minority that does share the politics. This same minority will be watching events in Bolivia with interest, mostly with the awareness that nothing of the sort is likely to happen here.

You also have to remember that as well as being fashion icons, in Latin America figures like Che and Fidel are admired across the political spectrum as symbols of Latin American nationalism as much as for being heroes of the left.
 

shadInToronto

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Real heroes - Mao, Ho Chi Minh, Fidel, Che, et al

Long live the revolution ... Cuba, Venezuela, Bolivia, Vietnam, China, N. Korea, ..... ;)
 

Squat

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I have been noticing that Chavez is increasingly popular amongst dominicans. Especially middle class educated younger dominicans.

Whenever I have a chat with any of that kind of young men, I always remind them that so far, there?s no oil in DR, so any Chavez wanabee (it might happen sooner that we think...) that wins the presidency down here, won?t be able to act foolishly as Hugo does, because we don?t have all this easy money like they do down in Venezuela.
 

RHM

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Squat said:
I have been noticing that Chavez is increasingly popular amongst dominicans. Especially middle class educated younger dominicans.

Whenever I have a chat with any of that kind of young men, I always remind them that so far, there?s no oil in DR, so any Chavez wanabee (it might happen sooner that we think...) that wins the presidency down here, won?t be able to act foolishly as Hugo does, because we don?t have all this easy money like they do down in Venezuela.

Winston Churchill said if you're not a liberal by the time you are 18 it means you have no heart...and if you're not a conservative by the time you are 30 it means you have no brain.

I do not agree 100%. Meeting different people from all over the world and learning about different political opinions over the past 10 years or so has softened me up a little bit...but I will still take Ronald Reagan over Castro/Che.

Scandall
 

samanasuenos

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Oil vs. Mining - nationalizing an industry

Interesting replies; thanks all. Really, thank you for your consideration.

Now....As for some Dominicans favoring Chavez, and despite the lack of oil in the D.R. -- the DR does have some serious mines, does it not? Exactly what is mined? I think those(gold, silver, mineral )mines are ripe to be nationalized. A leftist leader could do so and provide schooling and essential infrasctructure with the revenue, could he/she not?

I know, I know, the wealthy oligarchy will not let it happen, but in my sluggish socialist slumber this daydream doesn't seem completely untenable.

I believe that Canadian and Chinese corporations own most of the mines, is that right? Or do they lease? and if so, how long are the leases? Just wondering out loud.

Any thoughts?
 

Mirador

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samanasuenos said:
...but in my sluggish socialist slumber this daydream doesn't seem completely untenable....QUOTE]

slugish socialist slumber


Wow, anybody who can espouse a concept with such a seamless alliteration has my vote. What do you want to know? Oil in the DR? There's plenty of it, but while Shell shamelessly runs the show (ha, I can do that too ;-) here, nobody is going to put up the needed venture capital for exploration and exploitation. Also, there's plenty of other minerals, for example, Falconbridge has been mining nickel deposits for over a quarter century, but not declaring the cobalt content....
 

samanasuenos

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Mil gracias!

Many thanks for the kind words.

1. Now, I read that there was NO oil. You say Shell has some? Offshore drilling??


2. Nickel? That's all? Hmn.....I thought I read about some serious minerals, trace stuff used in nuclear business.....

-- Rapidly Roused Reader!
 

Tuan

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Che?

Is that the same sociopath, the Che Guevara that issued a commerce embargo against the U.S. when he was Minister of the Economy in 1961? You know, the one the U.S. Congress took two more years to transliterate and turn around on him that today is remembered as the U.S. Embargo?

Minister of Economy Che. Kind of like Jeffrey Dahmer as Sec. of the Treasury, then appearing on Cuban tee-shirts 40 years later. But if you tell a lie big enough and often enough you can rewrite history ... you can even repeal the natural laws of economics by daydreams ...

Recall that all socialist revolutions first murdered their intellectuals, and watch what you wish for!
 

samanasuenos

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About murdering socialists

Tuan - thank you for your passionate reply.

I would like to clarify that I am NOT wishing for a revolution. I note that poor Dominicans suffer from an apathy, feeling controlled and powerless.

In my limited study of history I find that quite unexpected changes have been made possible - when blessed with the right timing, recipe and ingredients.

I am just asking about ingredients here, not saying I want to bake the cake, OK?

!Cuidate miucho, companero! -- Just a Curious Mind
 

Squat

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No offense to Hugo Chavez, I didn?t intended to say he is a fool !

And yes, being attracted to socialism in your early twenties is normal... Then you grow up and realise things don?t really work that way.

My point is that a very dominican version of populo-socialismo would be a real disaster down here. But I don?t think it would really happen. What is more realistic is a populist pseudo dictatorship. Hard to explain, but yes, something like Chavez, without the whole "Revoluci?n Bolivariana" stuff.

A strong power that starts with an election, and slowly metamorphosis into a more authoritarian power. I can think of Candelier, who is keen on copying the attitude of Trujilllo when he wasn?t yet in power...

Hust a wild guess of course...
 

Mirador

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samanasuenos said:
Many thanks for the kind words.
1. Now, I read that there was NO oil. You say Shell has some? Offshore drilling??
2. Nickel? That's all? Hmn.....I thought I read about some serious minerals, trace stuff used in nuclear business.....
-- Rapidly Roused Reader!

1. The oil is there, however 'big oil' is not interested, since it's more cost effective to buy it in the international market than to exploit the local source.

2. If you're talking uranium, all proven deposits are in Haiti. However, we have some Pu, burried as nuclear waste in the Barahona peninsula (near Cabo Rojo), from the 4 hydrogen bombs lost near the Thule Air Force Base, circa 1968.
 

bob saunders

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samanasuenos said:
Interesting replies; thanks all. Really, thank you for your consideration.

Now....As for some Dominicans favoring Chavez, and despite the lack of oil in the D.R. -- the DR does have some serious mines, does it not? Exactly what is mined? I think those(gold, silver, mineral )mines are ripe to be nationalized. A leftist leader could do so and provide schooling and essential infrasctructure with the revenue, could he/she not?

I know, I know, the wealthy oligarchy will not let it happen, but in my sluggish socialist slumber this daydream doesn't seem completely untenable.

Any thoughts?
At any time in your sluggish socialist slumber have you actually been to a country where it is practiced? I have been to Cuba a number of times, and if that's what you wish for the Dominican people, you must hate them. Cubans, when they can talk safely, have nothing good to say about Che.
 

samanasuenos

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Dear Bob Saunders

Dear Bob:

Thank you for your energectic response.

I think you were posting as I was typing the following, which explains your question...

"'Tuan - thank you for your passionate reply.

I would like to clarify that I am NOT wishing for a revolution. I note that poor Dominicans suffer from an apathy, feeling controlled and powerless.

In my limited study of history I find that quite unexpected changes have been made possible - when blessed with the right timing, recipe and ingredients.

I am just asking about ingredients here, not saying I want to bake the cake, OK?

!Cuidate miucho, companero! -- Just a Curious Mind"

As stated above, I am not hoping for said revolution, just musing as to the ingredients. If this helps you cool off, why don't you imagine me an old granny (or Michner ) weazving an adventure/thriller/political fiction story, at home up north by the fireplace, trying to make it as believable as possible.

Save your energy for the moonlight motoconchos with no brake lights!

Be well, granny M.