Amnesty for illegal foreigners?

Hot Air

Lambada said:

Something a little strange about that?

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No, typical.
Remember, when they introduced DST?

Lambada said:

As you probably all know there's a big conference going on today & tomorrow, 25 countries represented, on the subject of regularising migration policy. And the President's proposal with regard to those foreigners who have been here illegally 10 years and more is:

“que todo extranjero que pueda comprobar una permanencia de diez a?os o m?s en el pa?s al momento de aprobarse la nueva Constituci?n tendr? el derecho de optar por una residencia permanente y de que se le dote de la documentaci?n con una vigencia de cuatro a?os. En tanto los que tengan menos de diez a?os, pero m?s de cinco a?os, podr?n optar por una residencia temporal y documentaci?n v?lida por dos a?os”.
Desde Dominicana

So those here illegally 10+ years will be able to opt for permanent residency which lasts 4 years, those here 5+ years can opt for temporary residency which lasts 2 years. Meanwhile, foreigners here legally still need to renew permanent residency every 2 years.

Something a little strange about that?

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When one considers that Leonel has been the most pro-Haitian president the DR has had (when he was in Spain he even suggested that Haiti should be allowed in the Iberoam?rica community - which doesn't make sense since Iberoam?rica is composed of Portugal and Spain and their former colonies in the Americas), its not strange at all.

-NALs

NALs said:

When one considers that Leonel has been the most pro-Haitian president the DR has had (when he was in Spain he even suggested that Haiti should be allowed in the Iberoam?rica community - which doesn't make sense since Iberoam?rica is composed of Portugal and Spain and their former colonies in the Americas), its not strange at all.

-NALs

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NALs
This is NOT about Haitians, Portuguese &/or Spaniards alone ............ this is about ALL foreigners who have come to this country to live. PLEASE don't get on your soap box on this thread but instead try to see the inaccuracies in the Presidents statement/suggestions!

LEGAL immigrants have to renew their status every 2 years - The President is advocating that those who have been here more than 10 year ILLEGALLY will have a residency that lasts FOUR years, i.e. they get a bonus/reward for having been illegal .............. (Hmmm, sounds about right for this Government. Legal = we screw you, illegal = you get rewarded!!) ~ Grahame.

Leonel know what IberoAmerican means. He stated that the country had first been entirely Spanish before the western third was transferred to France.

So you have to renew your PERMANENT residency every two years?

AND pay income tax on all foreign and domestic income that is not a pension or social security?

Remind me again of the advantages of having residency?

yeap,
doesn't sound anything like fair treatment of those who do since the beginning their paperwork, pay their taxes aso the legal way,
while the illegals get some bonuses rewarded for not paying anything since over 10 years, for giving a shi$$ on existing laws or such.

so what they wanna do then with the ones who are here illegally less than 5 years? a big deep sweep by immigrations and send 'em back home while the 5+years illegals get some sweeties?

how much $$$ the illegal Aliens have to pay to get their "rewarded" 4 years permanent residency?
don't tell me they will get that for free, that would be the big joke of the century, the costs for such need at least to be higher than the costs of getting a permanent residency legally(including costs for doing legally first a temporary one, then the permanent one, then renewing that one after 2 years aso til we reach the 4 years time period).

next point:
what are the requirements for a over 10 years illegal to proof that he is since over 10 years permanently here in the country?
a "purchased" paper from the landlord where he rented his room since over a decade illegally???

what about illegal Aliens here since over a decade but within that last decade they travelled once or twice aso out of the country?

and of course the Haitian immigrations problem is the big factor on that theme,
as a matter of fact they run the by far biggest part of foreigner's communities in the country, so maybe such stupid law makes just the simple sense that the real ones in POWER get nearby unlimited cheap labour slaves from one moment to an other, doesn't matter how many natives are on the streets looking for a job.

how to proof if a illegal Haitian immigrant is here permanently since over a decade???

ha ha ha ha ha

i really look forward to that brainstorming genius system which will proof such.
the guys caught illegally here and sent back to Haiti often show up over here with a new fake name a week later.
many/most of those sugarcane workers (labourers for the POWERS), construction workers aso do not have any legal papers from their homecountry, they crossed the border illegally without a stamp in their anyways not existing passport, so automatically everybody of 'em who is on dominican soil at the moment such law passes get's a 4 years permanent residency, no need to bother with a 2nd option for 5+ years illegals, there will be nobody applying for that one, lol.

i bet there will be even 9 years ole in the line claiming they are here since over 10 years illegally.

if the word of such get's out crossing our border to the west we should get prepared for an Invasion,
b/'c darn sure everybody who hear's some rumors about such Paradise welcome over here will be on the road towards the golden east right away.
they will storm that border soon.

overall,
sounds like a very bad joke to me.
sure i know they do not mean it as a joke,
they are up to something,
and that something sounds like a very bad joke to me.

Mike

BushBaby said:

NALs
This is NOT about Haitians, Portuguese &/or Spaniards alone ............ this is about ALL foreigners who have come to this country to live. PLEASE don't get on your soap box on this thread but instead try to see the inaccuracies in the Presidents statement/suggestions!

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Okay... considering that anytime any official speaks of foreigners they are referring to an overwhelmingly Haitian population, it simply makes sense to interpret what he said as having the issue of Haitian migrants in mind. Any other foreigners might just be an afterthought.

To who will this affect more? Haitian migrants or non-Haitian migrants? Hmmm.... tough one. :cheeky:

-NALs

NALs said:

Okay... considering that anytime any official speaks of foreigners they are referring to an overwhelmingly Haitian population, it simply makes sense to interpret what he said as having the issue of Haitian migrants in mind. Any other foreigners might just be an afterthought.

To who will this affect more? Haitian migrants or non-Haitian migrants? Hmmm.... tough one. :cheeky:

-NALs

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Interesting you mention that.

I was at a meeting recently where some folks started ranting about immigrants, how they're taking over, etc.. I just sat there quietly uncomfortable. At some point the folks discussing immigrants got quiet, and said to me, "Not you, we mean the Haitiano's..."

right Cobra,
it is exactly that way when 'discussed' locally.
and it is the darn same thingy when discussed or mentioned by the politicians.
the country has no kind of problem with US immigrants, neither with Germans, British, Italians, Russians(Yet, lol).
but the country's Powers would clearly have a big problem without the illegal Haitian immigrants.
the country's forthcoming needs the cheap labour slaves from the western of the Isle. they are big business for the ones who make their money out of sugarcane and other 'labour dependend' parts of the economy. those illegal immigrants from Haiti produce more bucks for the powers of this country than all dominican 'labourers' together do.
they are a main factor in case of "what the future brings for the DR".

Mike

MikeFisher said:

the country has no kind of problem with US immigrants, neither with Germans, British, Italians, Russians(Yet, lol).
but the country's Powers would clearly have a big problem without the illegal Haitian immigrants.

Mike

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International pressure concerning the Haitian dilemma is what's behind all this smooching with the Haitians, much more than any 'special interests.'

MikeFisher said:

the country's forthcoming needs the cheap labour slaves from the western of the Isle. they are big business for the ones who make their money out of sugarcane and other 'labour dependend' parts of the economy. those illegal immigrants from Haiti produce more bucks for the powers of this country than all dominican 'labourers' together do.

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That's simply not true. The wealth produced by the sugar and agricultural industry is almost negligible compared to all other sectors. Much more important is construction, and even that is a very small part in the greater scheme of things. Those two sectors (agriculture and construction) is where the bulk of Haitian migrants with a steady job in the DR are found.

The DR economy is much more than those two sectors by a long shot. In other words, more wealth is created in non-Haitian dominated sectors.

BTW, those Haitians most people don't have a problem with. The 'problem Haitians' are those who are perceived to be up to no good (ie. criminals, vagabonds, beggars, traffickers of all kinds, murderers, theives, etc). Its those Haitians that causes Dominicans to react because most Dominicans can't see anything good coming from that lot. It's a different approach given to the hard working one's in agriculture and in the construction sites.

Those are needed, the rest not so much and should go home -- that's the mantra.

One thing is certain, Haitian migrants in the DR are extremely important for the Haitian economy. They send about US$300 million in remittances every year, making the DR the second largest source of remittances to Haiti. Considering that Haiti's economy is extremely dependent on remittances, its not too hard to see how important it is for Haiti to have a Haitian diaspora in the DR. Its a win-win situation, economically speaking, for both sides; but more so to the western third.

-NALs

I would not be concerned too much about the 5 and 10 years of being illegal in the country and the so called "advantages" when legalizing but rather make myself legal here ASAP because it looks like authorities are getting serious about it this time. It will be hard to proof how long you really stayed in the country and everybody who is caught being not legal when inspections start will have serious inconveniences to face.
Now, when most of the people realize the seriousness of this matter there will be a run on the immigration offices, so better hurry up. The process getting your residency might get more expensive, too, because of the increased demand.

MikeFisher said:

right Cobra,
the country has no kind of problem with US immigrants, neither with Germans, British, Italians, Russians(Yet, lol).

Mike

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Are you sure about that? No non Haitian immigrants are drug dealers, money launderers, paedophiles, arms dealers, murderers???? I think you might find that the lax immigration laws here allow for all sorts of nasty types to move here on the run from the law in their own countries.

matilda

I agree with NALs that this is for the most part targeted towards hatians living in the DR, and that it most probably is because of international pressure. While in plain sight it looks like there are advantages over the regular legal route, however i' m pretty sure that it will be quite difficult for people to prove they have been in the country. They have no record of landing, and probably very few other proof in the means of mail, rent receipts, bank accounts, etc. Its basically a sharade, they are giving amnesty, but being that it will be hard to prove, not much is going to happen for a lot of the people that want amnesty. Those who will be able to benifit most from this are the non-hatian immigrants.

this policy is not much different than US immigration policy, every 10 years or though some dim-wit politician proposes amnesty for ILLEGAL immigrants, giving them green cards, while people who went through legal channels can wait years, sometimes forever, and spend thousands of dollars, for nothing.

lets reward the people who broke the law, and screw the people over that tried to things legally.

Then they wonder why there are so many people wanting to cross the border illegally.

Conchman said:

this policy is not much different than US immigration policy, every 10 years or though some dim-wit politician proposes amnesty for ILLEGAL immigrants, giving them green cards, while people who went through legal channels can wait years, sometimes forever, and spend thousands of dollars, for nothing.

lets reward the people who broke the law, and screw the people over that tried to things legally.

Then they wonder why there are so many people wanting to cross the border illegally.

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totally agree on that Conchman.

Matilda,
on the highest level of drug trafficking no foreigner from anywhere is involved, they may use some american burros to bring smaller amounts from A to B, but that business is organized and done from the local gubmin here on the Isle, no foreigners wanted to share the bucks.
paedophiles,
that trash is found everywhere and even more within high societies on it's "better" levels than within the lowlifes who flee their homecountry for minor issues.
murderers/assassins?
the pro's enter US soil or british ground or where ever the same easy way than here, such has nothing to do with relaxed immigrations rules, for them the easy access to neighbour countries is much more important for their pro business, so the Island would be a bad base. for the lil 'murderers', heck, the same like the paedophiles, such trash is found everywhere in every society, the island is not a typical spot for that shi$$. to come here they need to catch a plane, but who's wanted for such at home would have a hard time to catch a plane to anywhere.

i stick 100% with Conchman,
to do such law that way would be a benefit for the street trash who never cared a thing about the local rules/laws, and a hit in the face of the ones who go by the rules and pay their taxes.

Mike

MikeFisher said:

totally agree on that Conchman.


i stick 100% with Conchman,
to do such law that way would be a benefit for the street trash who never cared a thing about the local rules/laws, and a hit in the face of the ones who go by the rules and pay their taxes.

Mike

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Street trash? who would this be referring to? Is this the Haitian law breakers or your fellow American. Should be clarified?? as not necessarily a fair label.
A gringo may come here and spend many months, maybe a year or more before proceeding with the costly residency process, this to ensure if he likes the the DR and feels like it could become his new permanent residence. This has been recommended by many longterm members, many times, wisely so...The laws or lack thereof and or grey area seems to support this, thankfully. So this makes one "street trash"??? Does one have to start the process upon arriving at SDQ to avoid this monaker...i would surely hope not.
Usually this person is only spending his money here that was earned in his home nation and therefore not skating any due taxes here, on the contrary it supports the DR economy. Mike you are a respected poster with many words of wisdom and therefore I may have misinterpredid your comments, but street trash in my book has a different meaning.

i did not mean a specific nationality and sure not new visitors who spend some time here to fianlly decide to stay or not, do residency or not, they have their visitor's visa and can renew that, so they are not within the discussed crowd.
the theme of this thread are the ILLEGALS which are hanging out on dominican streets and beaches since a decade and more, they are most likely not contributing much to the local community or economy. and they are from many different nationalities.
and i am completely against such amnesty for them.
btw i don't believe that many will apply for that, it depends how someone needs to proof that he is permanently here since over 5 years for the temporal or over 10 years for the permanent residency to be given to him.
because the article says 'permanent' 5+ years and 'permanent' 10+years.
such is hard to proof,
i.e. my german passport is valid max 10 years and needs to be renewed then, so after 10+ years permanently here the passport at hand would not show a arrival stamp from 10+ years ago.
Mike

MikeFisher said:

i did not mean a specific nationality and sure not new visitors who spend some time here to fianlly decide to stay or not, do residency or not, they have their visitor's visa and can renew that, so they are not within the discussed crowd.
the theme of this thread are the ILLEGALS which are hanging out on dominican streets and beaches since a decade and more, they are most likely not contributing much to the local community or economy. and they are from many different nationalities.
and i am completely against such amnesty for them.
btw i don't believe that many will apply for that, it depends how someone needs to proof that he is permanently here since over 5 years for the temporal or over 10 years for the permanent residency to be given to him.
because the article says 'permanent' 5+ years and 'permanent' 10+years.
such is hard to proof,
i.e. my german passport is valid max 10 years and needs to be renewed then, so after 10+ years permanently here the passport at hand would not show a arrival stamp from 10+ years ago.
Mike

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Thanks for thr reply and the clarity, which I agree makes sense.