How does one say...

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rolfdog

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How would one say ?I hope all went well??



1)Espero que todo pas? bien,

2)Espero que todo parara bien.

3)Espero que todo haya pasado bien.

I think I found the answer. I am aware of the rule with the imperfect subjunctive in that the starting verb needs to be in the preterite, or imperfect, etc.

But what if esperar is used in the present tense?

Steve
 

Chip

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"pasara" is past subjunctive. "pasar?" is future.

I believe it is correct to say "?Espero que todo pasara/pase bien?". Even though it is talking about the past I understand the present form of the subjunctive can be used as it it still understood that one is talking about the past. I see this use of the present here discussing past events as somewhat common.
 

RenatoSosua

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"pasara" is past subjunctive. "pasar?" is future.

I believe it is correct to say "?Espero que todo pasara/pase bien?". Even though it is talking about the past I understand the present form of the subjunctive can be used as it it still understood that one is talking about the past. I see this use of the present here discussing past events as somewhat common.

thank you to point that out "pasara" past subjunctive I was in error thinking it was future... those "tilde" they are realy useful.

On my side whenever I'm talking about the past I usually choose either the Preterit or Present Perfect. I still have a lot to learn... thanks
 

Marianopolita

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The sequence of tenses in the subj- there are exceptions-

How would one say ?I hope all went well??

1)Espero que todo pas? bien.
2)Espero que todo paSara bien.
3)Espero que todo haya pasado bien.
....

But what if esperar is used in the present tense?

Steve


The sequence of tenses is the gospel rule with the subjunctive although there are some (regional) exceptions. However, when one masters its usage you will be able to compare choices and decipher one tense over the other. You must also be aware too that you may hear and see in writing certain forms that may be incorrect but that is very rare IMO with native and (true) bilingual speakers. In your particular examples, #3 is correct without a doubt. If those options were on a multiple choice test/ exam I would select three to ensure I get a check mark. #1 is wrong. It's not a form that I would expect to hear or see written in Latin America BUT it may be heard in Europe because of the influence of French where the subjunctive would not be required with 'esperar'. I first noticed similar incorrect forms via translated literature from Catalan to Spanish. #2 is not a form I would say or yet heard in the spoken language but who knows since people express themselves differently.

You will see and hear forms where a speaker is expressing their emotions for an action in the past and that case you would have the present tense + imperfect subjunctive but with 'espero que todo pasara bien' just sounds odd to me at least I have never heard that. Opinions may vary of course. To give an example of what I was saying about expressing one's emotion for a past action with the imp. subj- Steve, siento que estuvieras enfermo- Steve, I am sorry that you were sick. Speakers do differentiate between the sequence of tenses depending if the action is past or present. 'Espero que todo pase bien'= ...that all goes well. 'Espero que todo haya pasado bien'=... that all has gone well (or went well commonly translated in English).

I think the subjunctive is the most difficult grammatical concept to master in Spanish and it's great that you are focused on it because it will put your Spanish at a better level compared to those who have learned the language but still have not mastered the subjunctive fully. Since you are a poster who is a aware of the importance of grammar and appreciate the importance of explanations, I decided to respond after days of not seeing a proper response posted. Keep asking questions and keep challenging yourself regarding this aspect of the language because it's not going away any time soon.

Once again, I suggest reading of any kind to observe its usage- newspapers, magazines, articles etc. Listen to people speak in Spanish. The subjunctive is a part of everyday speech not like in English where it has become almost a rarity but still used by a small percentage of speakers.;)


-Marianopolita.
 

rolfdog

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Thanks Lesley, I was hoping you would chime in. I thought #3 as well. The imperfect subjunctive is one of those "obscure" tenses people feel unnecessary to learn, but I hear it and read it a lot. Good to know the perfecto de subjuntivo is there to use if it doesn't sound right.
 

RenatoSosua

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In this song from Don Omar - CANCIO DE AMOR

Me cans? de escribir cartas y dejarlas en tu puerta,
Nunca supiste quien era, no me atrev? a firmar,
Que m?s quer?as que hiciera si me ped?as la luna,
La luna te daba para ti nada m?s,

Preterit, Imperfect and Imperfect subjunctive are used...

I try to learn using words from songs everyday it can be very useful.:ermm:
 

BermudaRum

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[I said:
RenatoSosua;807175]In this song from Don Omar - CANCIO DE AMOR

Me cans? de escribir cartas y dejarlas en tu puerta,
Nunca supiste quien era, no me atrev? a firmar,
Que m?s quer?as que hiciera si me ped?as la luna,
La luna te daba para ti nada m?s,

Preterit, Imperfect and Imperfect subjunctive are used...[/I]
I try to learn using words from songs everyday it can be very useful.:ermm:

Yo tengo hambre de ti, Dandy Yankee;)
 
Sep 22, 2009
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Thank you, sorry cannot find the words and I've search all over.
The last song I studied from Daddy Yankee was "Llamado de Emergencia"

I don't think using Reggeaton as a benchmark for your Spanish vocabulary will produce a good result?

If you want to use music, try studying those such as Julio Iglesias, Jose Luis Perales, Ana Gabriel, etc. Those noted for excellent grammar, pronunciation, etc.

Studying the lyrics of Reggeaton artists may win you a nickel bag in Villa Duarte :(
 

RenatoSosua

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I don't think using Reggeaton as a benchmark for your Spanish vocabulary will produce a good result?

If you want to use music, try studying those such as Julio Iglesias, Jose Luis Perales, Ana Gabriel, etc. Those noted for excellent grammar, pronunciation, etc.

Studying the lyrics of Reggeaton artists may win you a nickel bag in Villa Duarte :(

I agree completely with you. In the last year I studied songs from: Marco Antonio Solis, Ana Gabriel, Fran Reyes, Julio Iglesias, La Oreja de Van Gogh, Grupo Negros, Raulin Rodrigues, Shakira, Tono Rosario, Jose Luis Perales and many more including Omega just to learn the language from the barrio...
 

Marianopolita

Former Spanish forum Mod 2010-2021
Dec 26, 2003
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rolfdog-

Thanks Lesley, I was hoping you would chime in. I thought #3 as well. The imperfect subjunctive is one of those "obscure" tenses people feel unnecessary to learn, but I hear it and read it a lot. Good to know the perfecto de subjuntivo is there to use if it doesn't sound right.

I have read your comment several times and I am not sure what you mean. The imperfect tense of the subjunctive mood is one of the four and only active tenses in the Spanish subjunctive. The future subjunctive is obsolete but still can be seen in legal documents and certain versions of the Bible. These are two key examples that come to mind right away. Spanish speakers don't avoid its usage. It's impossible and most speakers can't even define the grammar of their language. They just speak it. The average person you meet on the street is not grammar knowledgeable. Do a survey and ask people randomly to define the parts of speech or name ten grammar terms, or the active tenses of the indicative mood in English and observe their reaction, look and responses you get. People speak language or languages without knowing grammar rules. You learn to speak your native language(s) without knowing how to define a noun, verb, adjective or to differentiate between the indicative, subjunctive and imperative mood.

Key aspects to remember about the subjunctive:

1/ It's a mood NOT a tense

2/ There are four active tenses in the subjunctive mood - present (venga), present perfect (haya venido), imperfect (viniera) and pluperfect (hubiera venido)

3/ The sequence of tenses (in the main clause + dependent clause) is a rule you must understand to ensure correct usage. There are regional exceptions but certain phrase structures just won't be considered correct and/ or odd. The reference to time is important like in the example I gave you. One can say 'siento que hayas estado enfermo' or siento que estuvieras enfermo (further in the past).

4/ When you read in Spanish and you see the subjunctive ask yourself if you understand why it was used. Go back and find the grammar element that triggered the subjunctive. Was there a main clause like 'espero que...', or other grammatical clauses like para que, es posible que, antes de que etc. that require the subjunctive.

Sources in which I find interesting to observe the usage of the subjunctive in Spanish (including the formal commands of the imperative mood)

* the Bible- the new international version. Anyone who wants to observe the usage and beauty of the subjunctive in Spanish, religious or not read a few passages from the Bible and you will see how it's such an important structure of the language.

* any kind of guide or book of instructions. For example a book of driving rules, a cook book, etc.

5/ I strongly recommend a good grammatical source (a text book) - not an online link or dictionary. They can never be thorough enough. It will address all grammar issues according to the level selected and the subjunctive will be introduced even at the beginner level since it's a vital part of Spanish. You have plenty of good choices at your disposal for independent study (discussed and posted in other threads).


-MP.
 
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