Aight My Dominicans Holla At Me

Status
Not open for further replies.

samiam

Bronze
Mar 5, 2003
592
0
0
Re: The Haitians have destroyed their own economy,

Criss Colon said:
The Haitians have destroyed their own economy, deforested their country

You say it as if its a bad thing, we are doing it too.
And its even worse because we should've learned. We have destroyed our rivers and our forests with out any help from Haiti, our wildlife both land and sea are on the border of being wiped out. And dont get me started on our economy because the way things are going, no one will be able to fix that either.
 

jj007104

New member
Aug 13, 2003
12
0
0
WOW

I guess I get what I ask for...well I am one of those Haitians I guess most of you would not have a problem with, but on the same token, I dont regard myself different from any Haitian whether it's the one spending money with you, or the one begging in the street...I am just fortunate...those begging in the street did not put themselves in that position, they did not have a choice but to endure this type of life and now it's survival...we are human beings and we are all survivors it's in our instinct to make it some way some how...if someone has gotten the bad end of the stick, I cant find it in me to dislike them for where they are in life...I can only dislike someone once I find out who they are, I cant dislike people I see but dont know...

As for the comment about Dominicans winning their freedom from Haitians, I sort of dissagree...It is well documented why Haiti occupied the whole Island...it was because back then when we were the Pearl of the Carribean, our leaders Toussaint Louverture, Jean Jacques Dessalines (who died on his way to be the king in DR side of the Island) were on a mission to rid the whole Island of slavery and keeping slavery from ever being reestablished...I dont know if you know, but on the DR side of Hispaniola even whites were made slaves if they didn't have enough money to buy freedom, well they occupied the Island and abolished the Spanish owned slavery that was there and kicked the French out of the eastern part that they controlled...There was tensions growing between the Dominicans who remained on that part of the land and before a war was even to break out, the Haitian leaders that occupied the Dominican Republic got out of the country and left it to the Dominicans as a free country with no slaves...maybe my reading of our, sorry, my history is incorrect, please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong

I dont know the full situation of the relations as for the people of both countries cause I dont live in either country anymore, but I know alot of Haitians will argue by saying there are alot of Dominicans crossing over to our part of the Island to...many of them women who work as prostitutes, but I am not one to argue against what people do for survival...I love both sides though I relate more to mine. I remember in Haiti in the early 80's our next door neighbors had a Dominican living in with them...his name was Kiko and he was about 10 years my senior...he was treated as one of us though he was Dominican...the story with him was him and his brother killed their father protecting their mother in DR and was sent to Haiti as orphans to hide out and our neighbor adopted Kiko as their son and the neighborhood loved him as one of ours and as all the other children he had his chauffer come every morning to take him to school ect. nothing was made of where he came from and what his situation was, point is he was there and our job was to make him feel welcomed...but those were the days when things were good before the country hit rock bottom...who knows what would of happened these days....

Anyway thanks for your feedback...hopefully in the next lifetime things can be different...
 

jj007104

New member
Aug 13, 2003
12
0
0
Re: The Haitians have destroyed their own economy,

Criss Colon said:
Build a huge fence,and shoot them as they climb over! cccccccccccccccccccccccccccccc

WOW...it's that deep huh...
 

ERICKXSON

Bronze
Dec 24, 2002
1,222
0
0
47
www.creambay.com
Re: Re: The Haitians have destroyed their own economy,

samiam said:
You say it as if its a bad thing, we are doing it too.
And its even worse because we should've learned. We have destroyed our rivers and our forests with out any help from Haiti, our wildlife both land and sea are on the border of being wiped out. And dont get me started on our economy because the way things are going, no one will be able to fix that either.


Samian if you don't know don't talk, if you want to test the waters go to the D.R. try to cut a tree and get caugh by the foresta police and let's see what happens to you stop talking trash if you don't know.
 

ERICKXSON

Bronze
Dec 24, 2002
1,222
0
0
47
www.creambay.com
Re: WOW

jj007104 said:
I guess I get what I ask for...well I am one of those Haitians I guess most of you would not have a problem with, but on the same token, I dont regard myself different from any Haitian whether it's the one spending money with you, or the one begging in the street...I am just fortunate...those begging in the street did not put themselves in that position, they did not have a choice but to endure this type of life and now it's survival...we are human beings and we are all survivors it's in our instinct to make it some way some how...if someone has gotten the bad end of the stick, I cant find it in me to dislike them for where they are in life...I can only dislike someone once I find out who they are, I cant dislike people I see but dont know...

As for the comment about Dominicans winning their freedom from Haitians, I sort of dissagree...It is well documented why Haiti occupied the whole Island...it was because back then when we were the Pearl of the Carribean, our leaders Toussaint Louverture, Jean Jacques Dessalines (who died on his way to be the king in DR side of the Island) were on a mission to rid the whole Island of slavery and keeping slavery from ever being reestablished...I dont know if you know, but on the DR side of Hispaniola even whites were made slaves if they didn't have enough money to buy freedom, well they occupied the Island and abolished the Spanish owned slavery that was there and kicked the French out of the eastern part that they controlled...There was tensions growing between the Dominicans who remained on that part of the land and before a war was even to break out, the Haitian leaders that occupied the Dominican Republic got out of the country and left it to the Dominicans as a free country with no slaves...maybe my reading of our, sorry, my history is incorrect, please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong

I dont know the full situation of the relations as for the people of both countries cause I dont live in either country anymore, but I know alot of Haitians will argue by saying there are alot of Dominicans crossing over to our part of the Island to...many of them women who work as prostitutes, but I am not one to argue against what people do for survival...I love both sides though I relate more to mine. I remember in Haiti in the early 80's our next door neighbors had a Dominican living in with them...his name was Kiko and he was about 10 years my senior...he was treated as one of us though he was Dominican...the story with him was him and his brother killed their father protecting their mother in DR and was sent to Haiti as orphans to hide out and our neighbor adopted Kiko as their son and the neighborhood loved him as one of ours and as all the other children he had his chauffer come every morning to take him to school ect. nothing was made of where he came from and what his situation was, point is he was there and our job was to make him feel welcomed...but those were the days when things were good before the country hit rock bottom...who knows what would of happened these days....

Anyway thanks for your feedback...hopefully in the next lifetime things can be different...




Huh? and what happen Feb 27 1844? do you know and why it happened?
 

ERICKXSON

Bronze
Dec 24, 2002
1,222
0
0
47
www.creambay.com
They left it to the Dominicans after a long fight, if things were as easy as you portrait them life would of being a lot easier, read a little.


The emigration of upper-class Dominicans served to forestall rebellion and to prolong the period of Haitian occupation because most Dominicans reflexively looked to the upper class for leadership. Scattered unrest and isolated confrontations between Haitians and Dominicans undoubtedly occurred; it was not until 1838, however, that any significant organized movement against Haitian domination began. Crucial to these stirrings was a twenty-year-old Dominican, of a prominent Santo Domingo family, who had returned home five years earlier after seven years of study in Europe. The young student's name was Juan Pablo Duarte.

Dominican history can in many ways be encompassed by a series of biographies. The personality and attributes of Duarte, however, ran counter to those of most of the country's caudillos. Duarte was an idealist, an ascetic, a genuine nationalist, a man of principle, and a romantic in a romantic age. Although he played no significant part in its rule, he is considered the father of his country. He certainly provided the inspiration and impetus for the achievement of independence from Haiti. Shocked, when he returned from Europe, by the deteriorated condition of Santo Domingo, the young student resolved to establish a resistance movement that would eventually throw off the Haitian yoke. He dubbed his movement La Trinitaria (The Trinity) because its original nine members had organized themselves into cells of three; the cells went on to recruit as separate organizations, maintaining strict secrecy, with little or no direct contact among themselves in order to minimize the possibility of detection or betrayal to the Haitian authorities. Young recruits flocked to Duarte's banner (almost literally, for it was Duarte who designed the modern Dominican flag) as a result of the pent- up resentment under Haitian rule. Despite its elaborate codes and clandestine procedures, La Trinitaria was eventually betrayed to the Haitians. It survived largely intact, however, emerging under the new designation, La Filantr?pica, to continue its work of anti-Haitian agitation.

Despite their numbers and their base of popular support, the Trinitarios (as the rebels still referred to themselves) required a political disruption in Haiti proper to boost their movement toward its ultimate success. The overthrow of Boyer in the Revolution of 1843 provided a catalyst for the Dominican rebels. Charles Rivi?re-H?rard replaced Boyer as president of Haiti. Like most Haitian leaders, he required a transition period in which to deal with competitors and to solidify his rule. Rivi?re-Herard apparently identified one disaffected Haitian faction in the administration of the eastern territory; his crackdown on this group extended to the Trinitarios as well, because apparently there had been some fruitless contacts between the Dominicans and some liberal Haitians. The increased pressure induced Duarte to leave the country temporarily in search of support in other Latin American states, mainly Colombia and Venezuela. In December 1843, a group of Duarte's followers urged him to return to Santo Domingo. They feared that their plans for an insurrection might be betrayed to the Haitians and had therefore resolved to carry them through quickly. Duarte sailed as far north from Caracas as the island of Cura?ao, where he fell victim to a violent illness. When he had not arrived home by February 1844, the rebels, under the leadership of Francisco del Rosario S?nchez and Ram?n Mella, agreed to launch their uprising without him.

On February 27, 1844--thereafter celebrated as Dominican Independence Day--the rebels seized the Ozama fortress in the capital. The Haitian garrison, taken by surprise and apparently betrayed by at least one of its sentries, retired in disarray. Within two days, all Haitian officials had left Santo Domingo. Mella headed the provisional governing junta of the new Dominican Republic. Duarte, finally recovered, returned to his country on March 14. The following day he entered the capital amidst great adulation and celebration. As is so often the case in such circumstances, the optimism generated by revolutionary triumph would eventually give way to the disillusion caused by the struggle for power.

Santana's power base lay in the military forces mustered to defend the infant republic against Haitian retaliation. Duarte, briefly a member of the governing junta, for a time commanded an armed force as well. He was temperamentally unsuited to generalship, however, and the junta eventually replaced him with General Jos? Mar?a Imbert. Duarte assumed the post of governor of the Cibao, the northern farming region administered from the city of Santiago de los Caballeros, commonly known as Santiago (see fig. 2). In July 1844, Mella and a throng of other Duarte supporters in Santiago urged him to take the title of president of the republic. Duarte agreed to do so, but only if free elections could be arranged. Santana, who felt that only the protection of a great power could assure Dominican safety against the Haitian threat, did not share Duarte's enthusiasm for the electoral process. His forces took Santo Domingo on July 12, 1844, and they proclaimed Santana ruler of the Dominican Republic. Mella, who attempted to mediate a compromise government including both Duarte and Santana, found himself imprisoned by the new dictator. Duarte and S?nchez followed Mella into prison and subsequently into exile.
 

ERICKXSON

Bronze
Dec 24, 2002
1,222
0
0
47
www.creambay.com
Alittle more HISTORY

The island of Hispaniola, of which the Dominican Republic forms the eastern two-thirds and Haiti the remainder, was originally occupied by Tainos, an Arawak-speaking people. The Tainos welcomed Columbus in his first voyage in 1492, but subsequent colonizers were brutal, reducing the Taino population from about 1 million to about 500 in 50 years. To ensure adequate labor for plantations, the Spanish brought African slaves to the island beginning in 1503.

In the next century, French settlers occupied the western end of the island, which Spain ceded to France in 1697, and which, in 1804, became the Republic of Haiti. The Haitians conquered the whole island in 1822 and held it until 1844, when forces led by Juan Pablo Duarte, the hero of Dominican independence, drove them out and established the Dominican Republic as an independent state. In 1861, the Dominicans voluntarily returned to the Spanish Empire; in 1865, independence was restored.

Economic difficulties, the threat of European intervention, and ongoing internal disorders led to a U.S. occupation in 1916 and the establishment of a military government in the Dominican Republic. The occupation ended in 1924, with a democratically elected Dominican Government.
 

AZB

Platinum
Jan 2, 2002
12,290
519
113
"I am just fortunate...those begging in the street did not put themselves in that position, they did not have a choice but to endure this type of life and now it's survival...we are human beings and we are all survivors it's in our instinct to make it some way some how.." jj007104

You are defending them because you are a hatian, but I bet you would be also upset if they come around your neighborhood and take over your side walks. Eat, shit, piss there 24/7. I wonder how much your real estate value would go up having your folks around you?
If they are poor and unfortunate then its not my fault. They can stay in their own country and beg there but please don't come around our houses and businesses and spread filth around. they often come and sleep on the stairs of our entrance of the building where I have my office. They beg our clients to give them money when they are entering into the building. This looks ugly and repels potential clients from coming inside.
So please don't tell me about people who have the short end of the stick, we are not responsible for them, their own government is. Hatian government should take care of their own people not dominicans.
 

jj007104

New member
Aug 13, 2003
12
0
0
That article is basically on point with what I have read during my research...just from other sources...even in your story there's nothing in there stating there was a war fought over your independance nor were there retaliations...during the time the Haitian goverment was split and support was not given by the goverment in Haiti to those that were in the Dominican Republic and one of the reasons was because the way in which they were trying to run the Dominican Republic was not in accordance to the goverment's efforts...they were throughout D.R. scuffles between Dominicans and Haitian habitants in that part of the Island, but it was more the tension that drew the Haitian goverment there out of the country...Independance was taken by D.R. but it was not after a war and bloodshed...the reason the country was made one was not because of any hatred towards the Dominican people...the rulers there at the time did get at of hand with the way they were trying to run things, but that was not the original plan...when Dessalines was going to DR, his intent was to keep the Spaniards and Frenchmen and even the English for a while out who were agressively trying to reestablish slavery in the island...
 

jj007104

New member
Aug 13, 2003
12
0
0
AZB said:
Hatian government should take care of their own people not dominicans.

Hey I am not dissagreeing with you...Our goverment (Haitian goverment) have failed us miserably and now this is what we have to deal with...but all I am saying is you may hate the situation but dont hate the people...it's human nature and instinct to survive any means necessary...I wish I can take a bullet to make things better for them so they wont have to bother you anymore or sleep in front of your office and having to read things like this and think about things like this...but nothing I can say can shed light on anything in here, it's apparent that the situation is much worst then I thought and nothing is gone unlearned because I got to know what some Dominican feel about Haitian people...some feel Haitian people are tolerable if they are spending money with them and are well off, but they are not when they are poor and have to beg them to survive...I understand clearly...but you are absolutely correct, the Haitian goverment has failed our people miserably to the point where you are being burdened...on behalf of my people everywhere I appologize to you, and If I could of made things better I would...I dont hate people, I hate situations that's why with the help of some of my fellow Haitian diasporas I started a foundation to help my people so hopefully one day you wont have to worry about us anymore...

I do appreciate all of your comments no matter how hurtful some of them are...in the meantime let me go to check out that link on DR history
 
Status
Not open for further replies.