haitian integration, while the island be unified once again, once and for all?

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liam1

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i'll admit i don't know the history of the 2 countries and i don't want to dissrespect anyone here, i'll just state what i know. i visited boca chica about 2 months ago and no dominican came up to me begging for $$$, only haitians did. guys in their 20s coming up to me and trying to intimidate me for $2. how do i know they were haitians? coz they were extremely black, and the hotel worker told me so. all i know is this; if boca chica (and DR) becomes over-flooded with haitians (which it's becoming) i'm never going there again. respect.
 
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NALs

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liam1 said:
i'll admit i don't know the history of the 2 countries and i don't want to dissrespect anyone here, i'll just state what i know. i visited boca chica about 2 months ago and no dominican came up to me begging for $$$, only haitians did. guys in their 20s coming up to me and trying to intimidate me for $2. how do i know they were haitians? coz they were extremely black, and the hotel worker told me so. all i know is this; if boca chica (and DR) becomes over-flooded with haitians (which it's becoming) i'm never going there again. respect.

Not just that, but the majority of stolen cars in the DR end up in Haiti, over 90% of slum dwellers in the DR are Haitians and there is so much unnecesary unemployment in the Dominican population here in the DR because many Haitians are taking many of their traditional and non-traditional jobs.

I understand Haitians are people just like me and they need to survive, but go do it in your country or migrate to a country that has the means and resources to actually take care of you. The DR is not that place! If you think about it, if most Haitians (most are illegal in the DR) were to be deported en masse, this is what would happen. The ratio of stolen cars would drop significantly, unemployment will drop, wages will increase at least to livable levels in the sugar industry and other Haitian porous industries, and the Slums will shrink considerably.

In addition to that, tourist like liam1 would enjoy his visit to my beautiful country without having to complaint about the Haitians or any other immigrant group.

People, if many of the beggars are Haitians and they are irritating most tourists, we could very well see our tourism industry being destroyed soon. We need to tighten the border, rapido!
 

Pib

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charlieblaze said:
I just want to say to you all who worry about Haitian immigration, chill. It's unlikely that all of Haiti is coming to the DR, (Most choose to hit Miami or NYC) and rather you like it or not, the two countries will always coexist and both have a part of the other as part of its history.
Is that a fact or did you just make it up? No offense, really, but would you please cite your source?
 

Pib

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aj2 said:
Quisqueya]I think that any country in the world that does not believe in god( the lord) and does not follow rules, is going to end up like your country
Really? Care to provide reasoning for that? Do countries with a majority (or a large minority) of self-declared atheist and agnostics fall in the same cathegory? Cites? Sources? Or is your belief (to you are entitled) based on 'gut feeling' only?
 

Texas Bill

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For What it's Worth

Here is a map of the World published by the UN showing where Hunger is the most prevelent!

It would seem that Haiti is amoung those countries most affected by that Horseman, "Hunger".

And haiti being DR's neighbor, will not the effect of hunger eventually foment additional "illegal immigration" to this "next-door Land of Plenty"???

Heed the handwriting on the wall, people. Armegeddon is closer than you think if the Haitians decide to come here in force. They won't remain complacent for long when their bellies start swelling.

Not intended as the 'Voice of Doom", but rather extrapolating the basic drive of the human creature.

Here is the Link to the map:
http://www.wfp.org/country_brief/hunger_map/map/hungermap_popup/map_popup.html


Texas Bill
 

NALs

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Texas Bill said:
Here is a map of the World published by the UN showing where Hunger is the most prevelent!

It would seem that Haiti is amoung those countries most affected by that Horseman, "Hunger".

And haiti being DR's neighbor, will not the effect of hunger eventually foment additional "illegal immigration" to this "next-door Land of Plenty"???

Heed the handwriting on the wall, people. Armegeddon is closer than you think if the Haitians decide to come here in force. They won't remain complacent for long when their bellies start swelling.

Not intended as the 'Voice of Doom", but rather extrapolating the basic drive of the human creature.

Here is the Link to the map:
http://www.wfp.org/country_brief/hunger_map/map/hungermap_popup/map_popup.html


Texas Bill
Its interesting to see that Puerto Rico has more or less the same percentage of population undernourished as the DR.

Also, its sad that Haiti is the only country with severe undernourishment in this Hemisphere. But of course, it's not my country's (DR) responsibility to take care of them, they must do that themselves and ask for help from those that can help them (again, not us).
 

Ricardo900

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Haiti's solution

Haiti is very beautiful! But I'm scared as sh*t to travel there. If the Haitians just calm the phuck down, stop major corruption, political killings and throw away all those godforsaken weapons, maybe people will travel there and spend money. There are dozens of safe "Black" Islands in the caribbean, Haiti can be one of em. That will mean no more Boat People, no more starvation and a great reason to stay HOME! Mi dos centavos
 

R.Dennis

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Alisha Keys...

You are a fool! Alisha Keys does'nt look white at all...LOl @ You! She's African-American and proud and her boyfriend is a African-American Rapper named Mos-DEF! LOL!!! She sure is fine though! :bandit:
:lick:
Nal0whs said:
What if you have a white mother and a black father?

Or a black parents, both parents are children of black and white parents?

Or what if you think you married into a black Dominican (saying black is assuming 100% black blood lines) and your child comes out as white as white can be with blonde hair, bright brown eyes, etc?

Then what? Is that child black? white?

If people confuse other people for black, than that is an ignorance of accepting that humans are more than a skin color. There is more than meets the eye, that is what I have been trying to explain. Just because a person looks a certain way, doesn't mean that person is that exactly!

In the U.S. there are many light skin afro-Americans that look white, look at Alesha Keys (a afro-American that looks very very very white), but because she has black looking parents, she considers herself black!

Is that an ignorance since most people would conclude (without knowing her at first) that she is white?
 

NALs

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R.Dennis said:
You are a fool! Alisha Keys does'nt look white at all...LOl @ You! She's African-American and proud and her boyfriend is a African-American Rapper named Mos-DEF! LOL!!! She sure is fine though! :bandit:
:lick:

Ok, whatever you say. Of course, its easier to distiguish people once you know their composition.

What about Mariah Carey, she probably looks black too to you.

Boy, don't make me laugh, really!
 

R.Dennis

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Feelin comfortable...

BOY, It's about who you align and identify yourself with and who you feel comfortable with. Obviously most Mixed Race people identify and mostly classify themeselves with people who they feel apart of, and in the case of Alicia Keys and Halle Berry and countless others It's African-American. Enough said...

Nal0whs said:
Ok, whatever you say. Of course, its easier to distiguish people once you know their composition.

What about Mariah Carey, she probably looks black too to you.

Boy, don't make me laugh, really!
 

NALs

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R.Dennis said:
BOY, It's about who you align and identify yourself with and who you feel comfortable with. Obviously most Mixed Race people identify and mostly classify themeselves with people who they feel apart of, and in the case of Alicia Keys and Halle Berry and countless others It's African-American. Enough said...

Feel comfortable or to whom they have been conditioned to unify with according to society?


And please explain Mariah Carey? She is mulatto, but if you were to see her walking in the street without knowing anything about her, you would confuse her with a whitie, won't you?
 

Argo

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You are all too opinionated

Nal0whs said:
Ok, whatever you say. Of course, its easier to distiguish people once you know their composition.

What about Mariah Carey, she probably looks black too to you.

Boy, don't make me laugh, really!


Mariah Carey "looks" like a very attractive woman and sounds like a million dollars, why do you feel it appropriate to try and put her in some sort of "class?"

Does Dominican society have to calssify everyone to what they should belong?
 

NALs

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Argo said:
Mariah Carey "looks" like a very attractive woman and sounds like a million dollars, why do you feel it appropriate to try and put her in some sort of "class?"

Does Dominican society have to calssify everyone to what they should belong?

Um did you missed this by R. Dennis (I quoted it below)

BOY, It's about who you align and identify yourself with and who you feel comfortable with. Obviously most Mixed Race people identify and mostly classify themeselves with people who they feel apart of, and in the case of Alicia Keys and Halle Berry and countless others It's African-American. Enough said...

Obviously, all I said prior to R. Dennis comment is that if you were to see Alicia Keys or Mariah Carey walking down a street, you would assume they are white, but they are mulatto.

R. Dennis is the one categorizing people, all I said was something that is a fact. You see Mariah, in terms of race you see white, until you find out that she is mulatto.

Thus, my case for Mulattos identifying themselves as mulattos, not white or blacks because Mulattos are totally different deal.

South Africa got it, they have "Afrikans" (aka, whites), Blacks, and Brown (aka, mulatto).

The US is the place that bunches mulattos with blacks, despite mulattos being just that, mulattos.

So the real question is why do Americans always categorize a person as black if they are not 100% black, why not white even if they look white like Mariah or Derek Jeter or yes, Alicia Keys?

Which btw, all three are MULATTOS.
 

wventura

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Nal0whs said:
Um did you missed this by R. Dennis (I quoted it below)



Obviously, all I said prior to R. Dennis comment is that if you were to see Alicia Keys or Mariah Carey walking down a street, you would assume they are white, but they are mulatto.

R. Dennis is the one categorizing people, all I said was something that is a fact. You see Mariah, in terms of race you see white, until you find out that she is mulatto.

Thus, my case for Mulattos identifying themselves as mulattos, not white or blacks because Mulattos are totally different deal.

South Africa got it, they have "Afrikans" (aka, whites), Blacks, and Brown (aka, mulatto).

The US is the place that bunches mulattos with blacks, despite mulattos being just that, mulattos.

So the real question is why do Americans always categorize a person as black if they are not 100% black, why not white even if they look white like Mariah or Derek Jeter or yes, Alicia Keys?

Which btw, all three are MULATTOS.


You are BLIND if you think Derek Jeter, and Alicia Keys look white. ABSOLUTELY BLIND.

THey look far from white.

They might pass as "whites" in the D.R (for obvious reasons), but certainly not to anybody who knows any better. Both of them look obviously mulatto.

Mariah Carey does look close to white, but most think she looks "racially ambiguous", and not white.
 
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R.Dennis

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Mulatto is not a Race

Mulatto is not a Race buddy... lol, Mulatto is just a old term to classify people of mixed blood. Most people who are African-American in the US have all types of races and cultures in there blood. That is nature of what happened to our people in slavery unfortunately. You would be hard pressed to find many African-Americans in the US who have clear lines to African lineage. Myself I have various cultures in my bloodlines, with family from Lousiana Creole blood as well, but when it comes down to identifying with one race and culture in America we identify with the African-American culture, customs and ways of life. Like Alicia Keys, Halle Berry and countless others who are mixed with black and white but are accepted, identify and embrace and live the African-American Culture. Like I said before it does'nt matter as much as what your race is, whether who you indentify with and GUY we all know who people of mixed lineage tend to gravitate too. I'm done.
Nal0whs said:
Um did you missed this by R. Dennis (I quoted it below)



Obviously, all I said prior to R. Dennis comment is that if you were to see Alicia Keys or Mariah Carey walking down a street, you would assume they are white, but they are mulatto.

R. Dennis is the one categorizing people, all I said was something that is a fact. You see Mariah, in terms of race you see white, until you find out that she is mulatto.

Thus, my case for Mulattos identifying themselves as mulattos, not white or blacks because Mulattos are totally different deal.

South Africa got it, they have "Afrikans" (aka, whites), Blacks, and Brown (aka, mulatto).

The US is the place that bunches mulattos with blacks, despite mulattos being just that, mulattos.

So the real question is why do Americans always categorize a person as black if they are not 100% black, why not white even if they look white like Mariah or Derek Jeter or yes, Alicia Keys?

Which btw, all three are MULATTOS.
 

NALs

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R.Dennis said:
Mulatto is not a Race buddy... lol, Mulatto is just a old term to classify people of mixed blood. Most people who are African-American in the US have all types of races and cultures in there blood. That is nature of what happened to our people in slavery unfortunately. You would be hard pressed to find many African-Americans in the US who have clear lines to African lineage. Myself I have various cultures in my bloodlines, with family from Lousiana Creole blood as well, but when it comes down to identifying with one race and culture in America we identify with the African-American culture, customs and ways of life. Like Alicia Keys, Halle Berry and countless others who are mixed with black and white but are accepted, identify and embrace and live the African-American Culture. Like I said before it does'nt matter as much as what your race is, whether who you indentify with and GUY we all know who people of mixed lineage tend to gravitate too. I'm done.

Well in that case, then Black and Whites are not races either. After all, the only REAL race is the Human race!

But, since we are not talking about the REAL race, we are talking about the TERMS, then that means that Mulatto is as legitimate a term for differenciating a particular "breed" of human, just as Whites and Blacks terms are used to differentiate among those two.

Please, don't try to change the subject, being mulatto is different from being black or white, that's why the word mulatto exist!

I also understand that most African-Americans (as they like to be called, rather than just Americans) are not 100% black, but try telling that to the 11% of the US population that is considered black! Most will die of a heart attack if they ever realize that many have a genetic connection to their white counterparts (people whom they equate as decendants of slave holders and decendants of racists) other than the Human connection.

Many many African-Americans truly believe they are 100% decendants of those blacks that came off the slave ships, thus the rift in the American white and black cultures.
 

juancarlos

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R.Dennis said:
Mulatto is not a Race buddy... lol, Mulatto is just a old term to classify people of mixed blood. Most people who are African-American in the US have all types of races and cultures in there blood. That is nature of what happened to our people in slavery unfortunately. You would be hard pressed to find many African-Americans in the US who have clear lines to African lineage. Myself I have various cultures in my bloodlines, with family from Lousiana Creole blood as well, but when it comes down to identifying with one race and culture in America we identify with the African-American culture, customs and ways of life. Like Alicia Keys, Halle Berry and countless others who are mixed with black and white but are accepted, identify and embrace and live the African-American Culture. Like I said before it does'nt matter as much as what your race is, whether who you indentify with and GUY we all know who people of mixed lineage tend to gravitate too. I'm done.

That is the way it is in the US. It doesn't mean it is the universal way. In the US mulattoes are considered part of the black population, now called African-American. In the US "black" is actually more of a socio-ethnic label than a true racial classification. This came about because of the Jim Crow and "racial purity" laws which were based on the "philosophy" that the "white race" had to be kept "pure". Since blacks were considered to be members of an "inferior" race, having "one drop" of Negro blood, regardless of physical apperance, disqualified any person from being a member of the "white race". Since blacks were "inferior", well they could take in anyone, they had no purity to protect. Now in reality, in the same way that in the US. African-Americans are a separate ethnicity and all share "the African American Culture", in other countries, mulattoes and other mixed race people are considered ethnic groups with their own identity, ethnicity and culture. Very often, as in the case of the DR, asociated with national identity. For example, most Mexicans are of mixed race. They are a new people born of the union of the Europeans conquerors and the native peoples of Mexico, the "indians". They are called mestizos, theirs is an identity which is separate from the 10 million indigenous people who inhabit different regions in Mexico. Being mestizo in Mexico is synonimous with being Mexican, not indian. Some mestizoes are more European looking than others, but they have their own Spanish culture and language and are a synthesis of both bloodlines. Similar individuals in the US would call themselves "indian". Similarly, many African Americans who are in fact of mixed race, call themselves "blacK" but many Dominicans who look like those mixed race AA, would never call themselves "black", they, like Mexicans, have their own identity. In South Africa, mulattoes, who are called coloreds, are considered a separate ethnic group, separate and different from black Africans, who are the only ones called black, and sharing religion, customs and language with the white Afrikaans.

So, because Mulattoes are not a "race" properly speaking and in the US the last thing you want is to leave someone without a race, the decision was made long ago that they would be "blacks" orwhatever term they used, regardless. Now the fact is that there many, many millions of people in the world who are of mixed race, particularly in the New World and they are recognized as such. However, because of White Supremacy, denial and aversion to officially acknowledge race mixing, in the US you have to become a member of the officially recognized races. However, in practice,this means that if it is any sort of black mixture that is in question, the decision is already made for you, you belong in the "black race", with "them", regardless of who you identify with, nationality, culture or even amount of white blood. If you believe this old racist system is right, you defend it and makes you happy, good, but it does not mean it is right or scientific or that it makes sense. The rest of the world thinks and feels different. I am also done!

Had been very busy lately and not participated here for many days now.
 

DominicanInUS

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Please I don't understand why everyone is so shooked up over this subject. I am a Dominican young girl who has best friends that are Haitian, best friends that are Puerto Rican, and best friends that are Spanish. WE all go to school together and get along great. To tell you the truth I kind of was a little shakey about all of our countries getting along because I"m so use to being made fun of being Dominican by the Puerto Ricans , but I became the bigger person and made friends with everyone anyways. That's how it should be. Everyone should stop getting on each other's countries. That's called racisim you guys and it should stop. Everyone should mind their business and be proud of where they are from and let others be proud of where they are from too. Our heritage is what makes us special. From 1st hand experience I know how much it hurts for me to grow up knowing about all this conflict and every other Dominican, Haitian, and Puerto Rican child does too. If anything stop the racism for your next generation. So we can all get along in peace and share all our cultures without so much hostility and be proud of who we are. Please. I am scared that if one day I marry someone of Hatian or Puerto Rican ancestry my kids would have live with it too. Don't let it happen. It makes me sad when I try to celebrate Dominican Independence Day and some people make fun of me for it.
So basically I'm trying my hardest to put everything aside and everyone else should too. There are way more important things to care about like all of our futures. And 1 more things I have family from all of those countries too and i don't hate on my relatives for it. I simply think it's cool for some of my relatives to be mixed. It's a beautiful thing, and I know a lot of other people in the world think so too.
 
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