Middle Class in DR

cobraboy

Pro-Bono Demolition Hobbyist
Jul 24, 2004
40,964
936
113
Wrong, but I can see why some imagine a connection.

Threads like this one simply reminds me of the time I was shown several news articles from Britain where the overall consensus was that the country was going backwards. Apparently, that consensus was not limited to journalists, it was what the average British thought at the time of the Industrial Revolution. They believed Britain was becoming poorer, that the people's purchasing power was diminishing, and that life was going to be reduced to eternal misery and starvation. They believed that Britain's heydays were behind them. If they only knew what all the evidence says about life conditions in Britain before, during, and after the Industrial Revolution. lol

Even Adam Smith mentioned in his "The Wealth of Nations" that humanity has a propensity to think things are going backwards because prosperity is such a slow process, that it only become visible by comparing long intervals of time. I think he was right, its like aging. You don't see it every day and will be hard pressed to believe it, but when you compare your current yourself with how you were a decade ago, it all becomes clear and believable.

Its like becoming successful in business. The opportunities are there, but not everyone will see them at the right time, but once they do, it's too late and they are too busy missing the opportunities that exist then, to have he whole process repeat itself.

After all of this, I'm sure some people here will not know what I'm talking about. lol
NALs, I contend that the masses are simply unaware and uneducated enough to see and understand underlying economic conditions in a given period of time.

As long as they have bread and circuses-or pollo, platanos, arroz, cervesa, Johnny Walker, merengue and novelas- fed to them they don't even care.

couchpotato.jpg


It's only when lines for for bread and circuses become boredom do they endeavor to educate themselves...and they they pay attention to those with a vested interest in the outcomes of bread and circuses. CB induced Inflation can only mask conditions for so long.

A poignant opinion, written by someone who escaped Communist USSR, that will not curry as poignant to many DR1ers:

The Socialist Mind Game

This is regarding the U.S., but the same situation exists in the Dominican Republic in where economics intersects with politics. Besides, for better or worse the DR lies downstream from other economies.
 

Criss Colon

Platinum
Jan 2, 2002
21,843
191
0
38
yahoomail.com
"As The US Economy Continues to falter", is not a good time to return home to the DR!

If the US economy has a "Cold", the Dr's economy has "Pneumonia"!!!!!!!
The tax, borrow, & spend formula here will make for a dismal 2013!!
C-mon 50 to 1.!!!!!!!!!!
CCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCC
 

redserge

New member
Jan 30, 2011
290
2
0
I was lucky to start paying into a pension at age 19 until I retired at 55 last January! But I worked all those winters here in Canada and now I head to the DR for two or three months! No way I could hack Floriduh or places like that! I just try to be as low key as I can be and relax I hate the assumption that we are "rich" when the only reason we can afford to visit is because we budget and save like hell!
 

DRob

Gold
Aug 15, 2007
8,234
594
113
You, "Worked For a living!!!!"
Now, way too many people just, "VOTE For A LIVING!!!!!!!"
CCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCC

Exactly. Those red staters drive me crazy, too, CC. Such hypocrites for living in states which take more in government benefits than they pay out in taxes....freeloaders!

lol, Happy New Year, DR1.
 

the gorgon

Platinum
Sep 16, 2010
33,997
83
0
Actually, the Dominican Republic is doing better than most regions of the world.

For example, let?s look at GDP per capita (PPP) for 2012:

Dominican Republic $9,645

Compare that to the average of:

Emerging market and developing economies (aka, the Third World) $6,680
Caribbean $7,418
Central America $6,820
North Africa $6,981
Sub-Saharan Africa $2,472
Southeast Asia $5,808
South Asia $3,555
Pacific Islands $3,186

The change in the gap of the GDP per capita (PPP) of the United States with all the countries in Latin America was as follows (for the 1980-2011 period as percentage points; negative means the gap is closing while positive means its widening):

Chile -9
Panam? -7
Rep?blica Dominicana -4
Argentina -3
Uruguay -3
Colombia -2
El Salvador +2
Ecuador +4
Hait? +4
Paraguay +4
Per? +4
Honduras +5
Bolivia +6
Brasil +6
Guatemala +8
M?xico +10
Venezuela +21

Basically, the Dominican Republic has been closing the gap with the United States at a faster rate than all Latin American countries except Panama and Chile. Costa Rica, Nicaragua, and Cuba were excluded due to a lack of complete data or no data at all.

In terms of improvements in the purchasing power of the people for the 1980-2011 period, the ranking looks like this:

Chile 5.8
Panam? 5.1
Rep?blica Dominicana 4.8
Uruguay 4.4
Colombia 4.1
Estados Unidos 3.9
Argentina 3.6
El Salvador 3.5
Per? 3.3
Ecuador 3.2
Brasil 3.1
M?xico 2.9
Paraguay 2.8
Honduras 2.6
Bolivia 2.4
Guatemala 2.2
Venezuela 2.1
Hait? 1.4

Once again, the Dominican Republic?s purchasing power in 2011 was 4.8 times greater than in 1980, that registering as the greatest increase in well being among all countries in Latin America except for Panama and Chile. Costa Rica, Nicaragua, and Cuba were excluded due to a lack of complete data or no data at all.

The changes in the gap between Latin American countries and developed countries as a whole, during the 1980-2011 period, was (in percentage points):

Chile -13
Panam? -7
Rep?blica Dominicana -3
Uruguay -3
Colombia -1
El Salvador +3
Hait? +5
Honduras +5
Argentina +6
Ecuador +6
Per? +6
Paraguay +7
Bolivia +8
Brasil +10
Guatemala +11
M?xico +15
Venezuela +18

Do you see a trend?

Changes in the gap with Spain during the 1980-2011 period was as follows (in percentage points):

Chile -16
Panam? -9
Rep?blica Dominicana -4
Uruguay -2
Colombia 0
El Salvador +5
Hait? +7
Ecuador +8
Honduras +8
Per? +8
Argentina +9
Paraguay +9
Bolivia +11
Brasil +13
Guatemala +14
M?xico +21
Venezuela +37

In essence, the Dominican Republic is not only one of the few countries that has actually gotten closer to the developed countries, but it has consistently been beaten by only two countries, Panama and Chile. Every other Latin American country has experienced economic growth and an increase in well being, but developed countries have grown and experienced an even larger increase, so much so that despite all the growth, most Latin American countries are falling behind, except for a small group of nations, Dominican Republic among them.

What this also means is that the Dominican Republic is one of the countries that converges the most with other Latin American countries. This is evidenced when the country?s production of the 1950s is compared with that of the early 2000s. In the former the Dominican Republic was the poorest country in the Western Hemisphere, Haiti was marginally better off, but by the beginning of the 21st Century, the Dominican Republic already situates itself close to the Latin American median and is the country that has increased the most positions in well being during that half century.

Had the Dominican Republic achieved the gains it has during the 1950s-2000s half century but starting at the level of development it finds itself right now, today the country would had been among the most developed in Latin America, giving Chile a run for its money. But, we started from a very low base, we simply had the worst indicators but the gains have been the greatest. Most other Latin American countries rank pretty much exactly where they did half a century ago, except for a select few, the Dominican Republic distinguishing itself from the pack.

LOL
\

NALS, economic growth, and economic development, are not one and the same thing.
 

cobraboy

Pro-Bono Demolition Hobbyist
Jul 24, 2004
40,964
936
113
Exactly. Those red staters drive me crazy, too, CC. Such hypocrites for living in states which take more in government benefits than they pay out in taxes....freeloaders!
Really, Rob?

Explain the relevance when 40% of the Federal payouts are with borrowed money, not tax dollars.

Are you aware that on an intrastate level, the red suburbs generally support the dark blue urban inner city? Shouldn't some "hypocrisy" be shined on the urban inner city...out of "fairness?" Maybe a nice "Thank You" card or something?

Why, even in your town and the city I grew up in, Atlanta proper recently raised holy hell when North Fulton threatened to secede from Fulton to create "Milton county."
 

porkman100

Gold
Apr 11, 2010
7,468
39
48
Exactly. Those red staters drive me crazy, too, CC. Such hypocrites for living in states which take more in government benefits than they pay out in taxes....freeloaders!

lol, Happy New Year, DR1.

Its ok Rob...those "red" States wont be red for too long, Georgia, Tejas and a few others will be over run by Illegals, and you know what they want....free stuff....like Mitt said. Free stuff should be for the rich only. Socialism only works when it only benefits the top 1% just like mother Russia.
 

DRob

Gold
Aug 15, 2007
8,234
594
113
Really, Rob?

Explain the relevance when 40% of the Federal payouts are with borrowed money, not tax dollars.

Are you aware that on an intrastate level, the red suburbs generally support the dark blue urban inner city? Shouldn't some "hypocrisy" be shined on the urban inner city...out of "fairness?" Maybe a nice "Thank You" card or something?

Why, even in your town and the city I grew up in, Atlanta proper recently raised holy hell when North Fulton threatened to secede from Fulton to create "Milton county."

Oh, see, there you went with Fulton County. The reason North Fulton (and, to expand the discussion, many older suburbs) are highly affluent is because of the effects of "white flight" that occurred after the end of the 60's and 70's civil rights movements. A disproportionate amount of cash and resources were poured into making those "unincorporated" areas what they are, courtesy of highly, um, "interested" county commissioners.

Over time, the commission became more diverse, and stumbled upon the remarkable and highly radical idea of developing the entire county equally. People in the northern part of the county who had unilaterally benefitted from the prior arrangement for decades balked at the idea of their hard-earned money (along with everyone else's) going anywhere but their own neighborhoods, so they opted to - you guessed it! - form their own city.

And that's how it really happened. No matter what Ayn Rand said.

To your earlier point, that's simply not the case. Medicaid and farm subsidies aren't loans, and I'd welcome you to show me instances in which the states have "repaid" the federal government for anything other than emergency funds.

That's a conservative fantasy. The reality is a disproportionate amount of southern "red states" are among the poorest in the nation, and are near-permanent dependents of federal support. The irony is that so many of the people in those states are utterly convinced they don't need any government benefits whatsoever - other than the ones they like.

It's crazy.