Arrivals Down At POP During First 3 Months Of 2014

Robert

Stay Frosty!
Jan 2, 1999
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You need to look beyond the destination and focus on the tour operators that bring the bulk of tourists to the DR. When you understand their needs and practices, then your get a better grasp of why Sosua has no chance of being on the radar anytime soon. Sosua is a niche market. The tourism numbers in Sosua don't even register, when you compare to Punta Cana.
Recent activities in Sosua have little to do with tourism, you need to look deeper and wider to see why it has been happening.

Playa Dorada never invested in a better product due to low margins and being at the mercy of the tour operators. The writing was on the wall 8-10 years ago, look at some of the old posts on this.
 

ramesses

Gold
Jun 17, 2005
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Sosua attracts a tourist that enjoys doing everything themselves. A tourist that has a sense of adventure. They want the feeling of interacting with the locals and seeing some "culture". They are willing to put up with substandard accommodations in a trade off for that sense of adventure. They like to try different places to eat and drink.

...or they want girls.

PC attracts a tourist that wants them to be taken care of, the kids to be taken care of. They don't want surprises, they want everything to be as expected. Their goal is to be entertained, fed at the trough, given tons of free drinks...and have a spectacular place to stay. They assume anything off the resort is dangerous....and they are told that.
 

Robert

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Jan 2, 1999
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The tour operators decide where people will go. They run the market and work on the financial margins. If another resort can come up with a better cost/return and the least hassle for them, that's where they will send the people.

They care very little for a place's reputation or what's on offer there, purely what they can sell it for,how many they can sell and how much they have to pay for it.Just like a shopkeeper really.

Nailed it!
 

SosuaSam

Member
Jan 4, 2010
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Say I'm a tourist (husband and wife) that don't like AI's and we like the condo rental, going to restaurants, etc. but we also don't like being hassled. Should we go to Sosua? Nope, it has a reputation as a sex town so we'll go elsewhere. What are the positives of Sosua...nice beach, lots of beaches within 20 km, bars, restaurants, zip lining, quad tours, snorkeling, etc.. I can also rent a condo in PC, what does it have...nice beach, bars, restaurants, Quad tours, snorkeling, etc. Seems to have the same things as Sosua, except one thing...in your face whoring. Any wonder condo's are springing up in PC like crazy..not all PC people are AI people.
 

Robert

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Jan 2, 1999
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Sosua attracts a tourist that enjoys doing everything themselves. A tourist that has a sense of adventure. They want the feeling of interacting with the locals and seeing some "culture". They are willing to put up with substandard accommodations in a trade off for that sense of adventure. They like to try different places to eat and drink.

...or they want girls.

PC attracts a tourist that wants them to be taken care of, the kids to be taken care of. They don't want surprises, they want everything to be as expected. Their goal is to be entertained, fed at the trough, given tons of free drinks...and have a spectacular place to stay. They assume anything off the resort is dangerous....and they are told that.

Not true. The bulk of the tourists do not get a "real" choice of their destination or even know Sosua exists when looking at the DR. See the posts by wrecksum and myself.

Sosua is a word of mouth or referral destination.
 

Robert

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Jan 2, 1999
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Say I'm a tourist (husband and wife) that don't like AI's and we like the condo rental, going to restaurants, etc. but we also don't like being hassled. Should we go to Sosua? Nope, it has a reputation as a sex town so we'll go elsewhere. What are the positives of Sosua...nice beach, lots of beaches within 20 km, bars, restaurants, zip lining, quad tours, snorkeling, etc.. I can also rent a condo in PC, what does it have...nice beach, bars, restaurants, Quad tours, snorkeling, etc. Seems to have the same things as Sosua, except one thing...in your face whoring. Any wonder condo's are springing up in PC like crazy..not all PC people are AI people.

Not true. 95% of the tourists coming to the DR have no clue about Sosua or it's reputation.
See previous posts in this thread.
 

ramesses

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Jun 17, 2005
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Not true. The bulk of the tourists do not get a "real" choice of their destination or even know Sosua exists when looking at the DR. See the posts by wrecksum and myself.

Sosua is a word of mouth or referral destination.

As far as the PC thing I mentioned, these are the things they expect. I was one of them at one time. This was what was talked about at work when planning vacations. When you say Dominican Republic, you mean Punta Cana.

I agree Sosua is one of those places you have to look for...or hear about through someone in the know.
 

Uzin

Bronze
Oct 26, 2005
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I don't know, the report comes out so negative but the drop is only about 2.5% and then we have less incoming from Russia and some other countries and then 26.5% increase in (rich) Scandinavians ! Any half descent spin-doctor can make this to a positive report and with the further note that the total year could still be up.

Also POP airport does not just serve Sosua (not even half I would say), there are a lot of other places in the North Coast.

Yes PC is having a good time but I say that is a bit in a different league really with all the investment there - perhaps they should ask if they are getting back all the money they put in for that place, and compare that with all the money they "did not" put in the North Coast !?
 

Lobo Tropical

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Aug 21, 2010
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The tour operators decide where people will go. They run the market and work on the financial margins. If another resort can come up with a better cost/return and the least hassle for them, that's where they will send the people.

They care very little for a place's reputation or what's on offer there, purely what they can sell it for,how many they can sell and how much they have to pay for it.Just like a shopkeeper really.

You are right!
PUJ is driven by tour operators A.I. package market. 1-2 weeks, full planes, volume, new infrastructure.
 

Ken

Platinum
Jan 1, 2002
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495
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You need to look beyond the destination and focus on the tour operators that bring the bulk of tourists to the DR. When you understand their needs and practices, then your get a better grasp of why Sosua has no chance of being on the radar anytime soon. Sosua is a niche market. The tourism numbers in Sosua don't even register, when you compare to Punta Cana.
Recent activities in Sosua have little to do with tourism, you need to look deeper and wider to see why it has been happening.

Playa Dorada never invested in a better product due to low margins and being at the mercy of the tour operators. The writing was on the wall 8-10 years ago, look at some of the old posts on this.

No question about it, this was seen coming years ago. When you have too many hotels and must depend on tour operators using low prices to fill the planes and hotels, then each day the hotel operates it is one day closer to deterioration because it has no money to do the necessary maintenance.

When the tour operators left for greener pastures, Playa Dorada was left with nothing but a reputation for low class tourists and buildings in serious need of repair.
 

Rustxko

New member
Aug 3, 2014
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There is a lot of tourism discussion on this board, and I thought I'd weigh in instead of troll for information. I am a tourist that has been to PC and Sosua. I am in no way an expert. I've spent a total of 4 weeks in DR, but I've been travelling in Latin American and the Caribbean for 12 years.

I think the post above about the type of tourist is a bigger deciding factor in a tourist destination choice than is often recognized. The driving force between being tourist number 1 that's wanting to experience something different and tourist number 2 who wants to reside in a AI 1 stop shop on a pretty beach is safety. I prefer to be tourist number 1 but I've considered never going to Sosua again for reasons I'll get to, but here are my general opinions.

1st, the reputation for safety is really bad. My friends and co-workers know that I travel and they will ask me for advice on places. Most US tourists I talk to are too afraid not to stay at a AI in DR. I've recommended to the north coast to friends, and they think I'm crazy for going to Sosua and Cabarete. They say if they went at all it would be to a AI in POP. A friend I've travelled off the AI beaten path a little with in Mexico refuses to go with me. He prefers to return to Mexico because he thinks the cartels just kill each other there and in the DR its open season on locals and tourists alike. Even though, he has little faith in the police there, he believes the federales and navy will keep the tourists safe as a priority.

2nd, the police in the DR do not inspire confidence. While police corruption is endemic throughout Latin American and the Caribbean, the police in the DR have a particularly bad wrap which I don't think it completely undeserved. Once again, 4 weeks is a small sample size, but I don't really see them do much even the PN which you would think would be the most professional but it appears to be the opposite. They should address the panhandlers, pick pockets, and dealers in some way.

Think of it from a tourist standpoint. You see a guy wrestle with a pick pocket and police within eyeshot do nothing. A typical tourist thinks I'm out of here. They'll just let you get attacked

You see panhandlers going up and down the street approaching tourists and the police do nothing. The average tourist thinks There is serious third world desperation here. This is not a safe place

When you pass by a row of guys and every one asks you if you want some dope, a tourist thinks This is so out in the open that it isn't safe here. Let's be honest. A lot of tourist like dope or those guys wouldn't be there, and there are those guys in every tourist town, but they should limit the amount of them. Generally speaking local organized crime usually limits the amount of them, but there seems to be nothing organized in the DR.

3rd. The whores. They are really less a major factor in driving away tourism than most people think. One thing, most tourists don't know they are there in other tourist towns unless they are the kind of tourist that is looking for it. The girls in Sosua really aren't that aggressive. Personally, I thought the ladies were much more aggressive in Costa Rica. I just don't stop in the bars they frequent, and I don't talk to them in the street. They rarely say anything to me. Every tourist town that I have ever been to has hookers by the truckload. Jaco in CR is easily as big a whore town as Sosua, but I've known groups of women and couples that travel there. Why? Because it's perceived as safe. In Cancun, there are strip clubs/whorehouses a block off Ave Kukulkan in the tourist zone and in Cabo San Lucas, they are mixed right in with the tourist bars/clubs. Most tourists don't know because they don't see scantly clad women twerking in the street. They just see a neon sign and think strip club. The issue in Sosua is that its right out in the open and on the same street non-sex tourists want to hang out on. Make the girls go inside or clear off. Don't keep them out in the street. The glass going up at the clubs was a good idea. You put them out of sight and then you kick them out in the street. It makes no sense, and when you combine hookers with pick pockets, drug dealers, and beggers, tourists don't feel safe. Most tourists would accept any of the 4 on the streets in limited numbers but the public concentration at that one intersection in Sosua is crazy. As a tourist, you feel like you're running a gauntlet if you have to walk through there.

4th. I hate that I feel this way, but I sometimes feel that some locals in Sosua don't even want tourists around. I've had a much more welcoming feeling in PC. It seems that collectively people there understand that taking care of the tourist in terms of safety and entertainment and supporting that industry is in everybody's best interest. In Sosua, I don't get the same feeling as much. In other towns when there is an crime committed against a tourists, business owners come out in droves to ensure the police take severe action because they don't want it to hurt their business. They have the most to lose or gain from tourism. There is a screw over the rich tourist in any tourist town but in Sosua, I really get that feeling. It's probably mostly due to already being on edge for the reasons cited above. It also might be that some local people think that all the tourists that come there are there to exploit, get high, and take advantage of the women and they put off that vibe. Either way, those two types of tourists are going to exist. The strange thing is, that in Sosua, people seem to think that they can exist on the same street and I don't think they can. If those activities were separated by even two blocks, you have a whole different nightlife scene and you could police and control it effectively.

I know that's a book of negativity, but I do like the north coast. I'll probably return because I really like the beach scene and uniqueness. The beach scene is really great, and it's near a access point like POP. I kind of think of Sosua as more dangerous wild west version of Isla Mujeres. Anyways, I wanted to share one tourist's opinion.
 

Ken

Platinum
Jan 1, 2002
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495
83
What Sosua needs to concentrate on is getting the people who are already here to make more use of the restaurants.

If I were a restaurant owner, I would rather have clients from Sea Horse Ranch, for example, than mongers from New York. But you will never have both.
 

TropicalPaul

Bronze
Sep 3, 2013
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I wonder if it's possible, just once, for someone to put a post up about the North Coast without a whole bunch of people then turning it into a "how terrible it is that they are driving out the whores in Sosua" piece. We get the message you are upset about this. Move on. Surely there is something else that happens on the north coast other than prostitutes in Sosua?
 

aname4me

Active member
Jun 18, 2011
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Imagine you are a Tourist in Sosua.
You want to eMail a picture Home showing you really came to the right place.

Not counting the Beach....
What should you take a picture of?
What would confirm you were in Sosua?
Where is that Kodak moment in Sosua to impress your Friends?

Where is that really pretty spot (not a Beach)?
Remind me where the Old Square is.

For that matter... where do I take my kids to have hours of fun time.
-It has to be inside Sosua.

Is there a place to spend several hours (not 10 minutes) soaking up the Culture of Sosua?

Why market what you don't have.


Now, imagine your a Monger arriving in Sosua.
Not counting the Beach....
What should you take a picture of?
What would confirm you were in Sosua?
Where is that Kodak moment in Sosua to impress your Friends?
 

ramesses

Gold
Jun 17, 2005
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What Sosua needs to concentrate on is getting the people who are already here to make more use of the restaurants.

If I were a restaurant owner, I would rather have clients from Sea Horse Ranch, for example, than mongers from New York. But you will never have both.

When I travelled here, I ate 3 meals a day, everyday I was here.

Now I live here half the year, I eat at restaurants twice a month. My girlfriend and I cook most meals.

I find most restaurants here subpar and the selection is very poor. It is one of the things that disappoints me about Sosua.

Maybe, this is true for most people who live here?
 

ramesses

Gold
Jun 17, 2005
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I wonder if it's possible, just once, for someone to put a post up about the North Coast without a whole bunch of people then turning it into a "how terrible it is that they are driving out the whores in Sosua" piece. We get the message you are upset about this. Move on. Surely there is something else that happens on the north coast other than prostitutes in Sosua?

It's a nice place to live. I like it because there is nothing at all to do.
 

beeza

Silver
Nov 2, 2006
3,481
732
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Why do these statistics use percentages? They are meaningless.

They say the Scandinavian arrivals are up some 25%. SO you had three flights a month...big deal. It's not really going to make a huge impact. Then they add another flight. Again, not very much impact, one flight, but the stats then read an increase of 25%!
 

the gorgon

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Sep 16, 2010
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The tour operators decide where people will go. They run the market and work on the financial margins. If another resort can come up with a better cost/return and the least hassle for them, that's where they will send the people.

They care very little for a place's reputation or what's on offer there, purely what they can sell it for,how many they can sell and how much they have to pay for it.Just like a shopkeeper really.

a brilliant observation which has been left unattended in the considerations...
 

the gorgon

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Sep 16, 2010
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You are right!
PUJ is driven by tour operators A.I. package market. 1-2 weeks, full planes, volume, new infrastructure.

the only tourist destinations that are not driven by tour operators are places like Paris, Rome, and very few others. tour operators decide where the lift goes, and without airline seats there is no tourism. the operators function on razor thin margins. they make very little on each ticket they sell, and have to maximize profits on each sale. if a destination gets negative exit polls, they simply stop selling it. my buddy tried to buy a ticket from a Toronto operation to a particular Playa Dorada AI, and they would not sell it to him. they do not need the complaints. it is far more complicated then painting the crosswalks and improving the lighting.