Good statement. I would interject that crack cocaine fuels a lot of the crime, just as it has in many Carribean islands. One more reason for home protection...
- Thread starter lemunch
- Start date
Las Terrenas warning
Good statement. I would interject that crack cocaine fuels a lot of the crime, just as it has in many Carribean islands. One more reason for home protection...
Any follow-up on this by the police? The new police chief has a tough reputation when dealing with criminals, on the brink of human rights violation... killing and shooting them in the legs...
Yes indeed
if my sources are correct (& my Spanish is good enough to understand a somewhat exciteable voice at the other end of a phone). Let me check with lemunch first as to what is appropriate to post, I don't want to muck up anything.This sounds promising.Yes indeed
Nothing could be better than to hear that they caught the SOB's.
Please keep us advised.
update
Again, so sorry for the delay. We have been going through a lot and I will try to summarize it here. I'm hoping this will give foreign residents of LT more information on how to deal with the police - as well as caution to people thinking of moving here. We also feel safer knowing that a lot of people know what we are going through.
After hearing that our landlord had offered a "reward" to the police, he told us they caught the guys. I went to the police station to identify them, and with no screen or protection of my identity I was shuffled in front of a jail cell to look. The next day, all the men were released on bail.
The next night I got a call from a man in Puerto Plata who claimed to have bought my computer on the street in the city. He said he bought it for 20,000 pesos and that he looked on the hard drive, saw the computer had important information, found my cell number on it and called me to return it to me. He said he would sell it to me for 20,000 pesos.
The man spoke broken English and we had not yet decided how to do the hand-off, when I got five messages the following day that he was in LT and wanted to meet. I went to the police. They set up a pseudo sting operation - which involved me actually meeting the seller, following him to his car, refusing to get into the car, convincing him to show me the computer, then walking away to "get cash." The police then arrested him.
Back at the police station I met a couple from Abregrande Road who had also been robbed at gunpoint. (aggressively, like us) I compared stories with the man and realized we'd been robbed by the same men, same clothes, same gun. They were distant neighbors. His wife had SEEN the gunman on the streets of Las Terrenas the previous day. (The cops had told us - and our landlord - that the guy was in jail...) The cops also told us that my sunglasses and computer speakers had been discovered in a cave hideout. In fact, the husband found them in his backyard. Lastly, the police and everyone involved said these criminals were from Santo Domingo or Santiago and came here to steal. This is also not the case. They live in Las Terrenas.
The cops would not arrest the man that his wife saw on the street, so the husband went to Samana and got an arrest warrant issued. Then he had the suspects arrested. This was the point at which we randomly met at the police station - him having just arrested the guy, and me having just recovered my computer.
The cops told us to come back the next day. The neighbors from Abregrande called me the next morning and said we didn't need to drive to Samana to go to court, so we waited. Then we got another call that we were needed. We drove over and after IDing the gunman, finding other property of mine in his pockets and also displaying the jacket he robbed us in (Northwestern University, windbreaker), they let the man and his two accomplices go. The judge said the men were "arrested improperly." As of 7 pm on Thursday night, they are walking the streets of Las Terrenas - with about $5,000 in cash and at least 5 guns. I know, I just saw one of them.
I have spoken to many people in the last few days. From these interviews I've learned that there have been at least 8 violent robberies in Las Terrenas in the last 4 months, resulting in at least 4 deaths. (1 foreigner, 2 Haitians, 1 Dominican) I'm not sure how much property has been lost. I don't know why this is not public knowledge, and I won't venture to guess.
So I actually have no advice for people living here, other than you are on your own. Be safe and make your own fate. There is no system in place right now to back you up.
Again, so sorry for the delay. We have been going through a lot and I will try to summarize it here. I'm hoping this will give foreign residents of LT more information on how to deal with the police - as well as caution to people thinking of moving here. We also feel safer knowing that a lot of people know what we are going through.
After hearing that our landlord had offered a "reward" to the police, he told us they caught the guys. I went to the police station to identify them, and with no screen or protection of my identity I was shuffled in front of a jail cell to look. The next day, all the men were released on bail.
The next night I got a call from a man in Puerto Plata who claimed to have bought my computer on the street in the city. He said he bought it for 20,000 pesos and that he looked on the hard drive, saw the computer had important information, found my cell number on it and called me to return it to me. He said he would sell it to me for 20,000 pesos.
The man spoke broken English and we had not yet decided how to do the hand-off, when I got five messages the following day that he was in LT and wanted to meet. I went to the police. They set up a pseudo sting operation - which involved me actually meeting the seller, following him to his car, refusing to get into the car, convincing him to show me the computer, then walking away to "get cash." The police then arrested him.
Back at the police station I met a couple from Abregrande Road who had also been robbed at gunpoint. (aggressively, like us) I compared stories with the man and realized we'd been robbed by the same men, same clothes, same gun. They were distant neighbors. His wife had SEEN the gunman on the streets of Las Terrenas the previous day. (The cops had told us - and our landlord - that the guy was in jail...) The cops also told us that my sunglasses and computer speakers had been discovered in a cave hideout. In fact, the husband found them in his backyard. Lastly, the police and everyone involved said these criminals were from Santo Domingo or Santiago and came here to steal. This is also not the case. They live in Las Terrenas.
The cops would not arrest the man that his wife saw on the street, so the husband went to Samana and got an arrest warrant issued. Then he had the suspects arrested. This was the point at which we randomly met at the police station - him having just arrested the guy, and me having just recovered my computer.
The cops told us to come back the next day. The neighbors from Abregrande called me the next morning and said we didn't need to drive to Samana to go to court, so we waited. Then we got another call that we were needed. We drove over and after IDing the gunman, finding other property of mine in his pockets and also displaying the jacket he robbed us in (Northwestern University, windbreaker), they let the man and his two accomplices go. The judge said the men were "arrested improperly." As of 7 pm on Thursday night, they are walking the streets of Las Terrenas - with about $5,000 in cash and at least 5 guns. I know, I just saw one of them.
I have spoken to many people in the last few days. From these interviews I've learned that there have been at least 8 violent robberies in Las Terrenas in the last 4 months, resulting in at least 4 deaths. (1 foreigner, 2 Haitians, 1 Dominican) I'm not sure how much property has been lost. I don't know why this is not public knowledge, and I won't venture to guess.
So I actually have no advice for people living here, other than you are on your own. Be safe and make your own fate. There is no system in place right now to back you up.
Wow.
That's straight out the Twilight Zone.
I remember some threads last year talking about the LT police and their involvement in crime, etc, but this is absolutely ridiculous.
I'm wondering if it might be a good idea for you guys to get out of there.
Nobody likes to lose a righteous cause, but I'm getting the impression that your lives are at risk.
That's straight out the Twilight Zone.
I remember some threads last year talking about the LT police and their involvement in crime, etc, but this is absolutely ridiculous.
I'm wondering if it might be a good idea for you guys to get out of there.
Nobody likes to lose a righteous cause, but I'm getting the impression that your lives are at risk.
Seems to be the case in most of the island.....
I, also, would suggest it might be prudent to leave the area as your life very well could be in danger.
There are many threads on the board that highlight either the complete lack of justice in the DR or at the very least, the complete corruption of the justice system......
Don't risk your life!!! Pick up what you can and leave......
"Better to be safe than sorry!"aranoid:
I, also, would suggest it might be prudent to leave the area as your life very well could be in danger.
There are many threads on the board that highlight either the complete lack of justice in the DR or at the very least, the complete corruption of the justice system......
Don't risk your life!!! Pick up what you can and leave......
"Better to be safe than sorry!"
aranoid:Absolutely. It sounds much too similar to other stories that have ended in tragedy. Your lives are worth too much to risk.
I'd be gone already.
After the robbery attempt I'd have possibly moved to a more secure area.
Now that you've had a couple of run-ins thru the judicial system and not prevailed, I'd be out of the area completely until I had sold off any assets or until I heard others had solved the problem for me.
It's possible to live a lifetime safely in DR as an expat... but once you run afoul of the the wrong people, even through no fault of your own, things can go downhill quickly.
Please don't take offense at this but there may be some 'fault of your own' in how the situation was handled. I don't recall how long you've lived in DR and how well you understand the 'system' in your area. The aggressive follow up is what one would do in the U.S. or Europe. I don't know the particulars out in Las Terrenas, but I can tell you that in other areas you're at times better off as a foreigner not pursuing things at all or at least pursuing in a more indirect and discrete manner.
Please put your safety above other decisions right now. That probably at the very least involves a combination of distance and time.
Yeah (ruefully) that's what I thought too..............wrong! They catch 'em, they release 'em.............:ermm: Where that judge gets 'arrested improperly' is beyond belief, except that it's obviously an excuse covering other motives.
lemunch, thank you for your update. I totally concur with the others, please leave the area. I know when I responded to your PM the other day I asked the question 'can you leave for a few days?' but that was before all this happened. Now it is imperative you leave & not just for a few days. As the others have said, safety first. And good luck to you both.
Copy of my response on TT - Lonely Planet
This is long and may be boring for most of you.
It's a message to lemunch/lescrunch.
This is long and may be boring for most of you.
It's a message to lemunch/lescrunch.
Thanks for the feedback, as it is very interesting for a Las Terrenas resident such as me. I am not surprised by those events, as police in DR is mostly inefficient at best, and 100% corrupt most of the time...
Lemunch, in your position I would also decide to leave the Las Terrenas/Saman? area, and head anywhere else. We don't know for sure what can happen, but you better be safe than sorry. Take advantage of the fact that you don't own property/business here, and that you are not married with a person from here... Get out, it is best for you.
For the rest of us, it is a reminder to keep a "semi-paranoid" attitude when it comes to potential home invasion.
I read from the other thread about the gang of "Haitians" too, but I am wondering if it is not an easy excuse to distract the attention from the real perps... Haitians are easy scapegoats, very anonymous... It is so easy to blame it on those anonymous folks instead of accepting that most crimes is committed by Dominicans themselves.
Interesting from Lemunch. In LT, they all say criminals are coming from other regions, while most are from Las Terrenas (usually they live in barrio "Come Pan" or "Ca?o Seco")...
Lemunch, in your position I would also decide to leave the Las Terrenas/Saman? area, and head anywhere else. We don't know for sure what can happen, but you better be safe than sorry. Take advantage of the fact that you don't own property/business here, and that you are not married with a person from here... Get out, it is best for you.
For the rest of us, it is a reminder to keep a "semi-paranoid" attitude when it comes to potential home invasion.
I read from the other thread about the gang of "Haitians" too, but I am wondering if it is not an easy excuse to distract the attention from the real perps... Haitians are easy scapegoats, very anonymous... It is so easy to blame it on those anonymous folks instead of accepting that most crimes is committed by Dominicans themselves.
Interesting from Lemunch. In LT, they all say criminals are coming from other regions, while most are from Las Terrenas (usually they live in barrio "Come Pan" or "Ca?o Seco")...
I think there is no better lesson to learn than to learn though the experience of others and be spared the "first hand encounter" which you so perfectly described.
I sometimes wonder how we as human beings can sometimes place so little value on our own lives.
The Bad and the Less Bad
After the offer to buy her laptop back at 20k the OP could have assigned an ex police officer as a mediator.
Their 'services' are often useful in negotiating a 'solution' without getting involved oneself.
They are almost always successful and insiders know why...
I for one believe that the victims are not in danger of life.
It's true the local 'tigueres' can be very dangerous but when they are accused justly AND by the victim they tend to shrug it off as normal as they accept that somebody defends him/herself.
(If a third person accuses them rightly or wrongly then it's a different story altogether.)
m'frog
After the offer to buy her laptop back at 20k the OP could have assigned an ex police officer as a mediator.
Their 'services' are often useful in negotiating a 'solution' without getting involved oneself.
They are almost always successful and insiders know why...
I for one believe that the victims are not in danger of life.
It's true the local 'tigueres' can be very dangerous but when they are accused justly AND by the victim they tend to shrug it off as normal as they accept that somebody defends him/herself.
(If a third person accuses them rightly or wrongly then it's a different story altogether.)
m'frog
Quite the contrary.
These criminals get even angrier when they are justly accused.
Nobody gets as excited as a ladrone, when called a ladrone.
People with a clear conscience, shrug it off more easily.
These folks can choose what they would like to do, and you are certainly entitled to your opinion, but bear in mind, that they already felt lulled into a false sense of security when they first moved to that location, and imagine how guilty you would feel if something did happen to them, after suggesting for them to stay.
I still think Lemunch should provide us with the name of the property and the name of the landlord... As much as it sounds invasive, it should serve other potential victims...
I will definitely advise against renting anything in Abra Grande now... Too remote...
I will definitely advise against renting anything in Abra Grande now... Too remote...
I agree to a certain extent, then again, it would be terrible to ruin an innocent person's business/livelihood, specially if the landlord intends on implementing additional security measures, after this lamentable event.
Perhaps the OP could give you the info by PM, and as you live in the area, you might contact the owner and see if he is planning on making a solid security perimeter.
Of course, you can take all the precautions in the world, and some criminals will still manage to penetrate the barriers.
We can only do our best, remain alert and hope for the best.
Bad Advice??
1. I did not suggest anything nor did I give advice.
2. I gave my opinion but realize that it's hardly possible here any more without certain people (whose comments are found in almost any thread of every subforum of this message board) giving their view as the 'ruling one'.
mountainfrog
1. I did not suggest anything nor did I give advice.
2. I gave my opinion but realize that it's hardly possible here any more without certain people (whose comments are found in almost any thread of every subforum of this message board) giving their view as the 'ruling one'.
mountainfrog
You need not be rude in reply to a very polite post.
You did post the following.
You did suggest that their lives were not in danger and that may very well be dangerous advice.
As I politely said to you, you are entitled to your opinion, but you can hardly deny having suggested anything or given advice, when you did.
Indeed... A PM would be the more appropriate measure... I have my little idea about the owner of the house, but I would like either a confirmation or a clarification... That is up to the OP...