Pepper Spray In the Eyes

Ken

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Jan 1, 2002
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Two tourists, big, strong men in late 20s or early 30s, were attacked on the street last night near the Sosua park. The attackers were on a motorcycle and were trying to get the money, etc, of the tourists. When the men tried to defend themselves, one of the attackers sprayed the eyes of one of the tourists 2 times with pepper spray, then grabbed the chain around his neck and riding away with the broken chain.

This is the first time I have heard of a robbery attempt on the street when pepper spray was used on the victims. Have others heard of similar reports?
 

Ken

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Jan 1, 2002
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From the men and from someone who helped them by putting cold water on the eyes of the man in distress
 

jrhartley

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Sep 10, 2008
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no never heard of it before but it was bound to happen as the stuff is easy to get hold of, it can blow back onto the sprayers if the wind is in the wrong direction though, so they may only try it a few times
 

Ken

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Jan 1, 2002
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no never heard of it before but it was bound to happen as the stuff is easy to get hold of, it can blow back onto the sprayers if the wind is in the wrong direction though, so they may only try it a few times

That it is. I have seen it sold over the counter in several stores. Hopefully the wind will favor the victims next time.

What worries me is that the men are sure to tell friends, who will use the same tactic.
 

cobraboy

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Jul 24, 2004
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Tragic development in Sosua..... :ermm:
And folks wonder why tourism is down?

Does anyone think all these stories DON'T get back to travel agents who counsel consumers?

Other than the earthquake the #1 question we get asked lately from folks inquiring about our tours is violent crime. And we explain we do NOT spend any time in the PoP/Sosua/Cabarete area.
 
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jrhartley

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where is the sosua park by the way....you mean near the casino ? its the only thing that may resemble a park
 

CFA123

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And we explain we do NOT spend any time in the PoP/Sosua/Cabarete area.

Not sure why you'd do or say that.

As far as tourist related crime... I don't think the prevalence would be any higher in Pop/Sosua/Cabarete than elsewhere based on # of visitors. You'll be down to riding your clients around in circles on the tarmac at the airport if you plan to avoid everywhere there's a random incident against a tourist. Heck, why don't you advise them not to come at all? Seems more things are reported stolen as luggage passes through the airports than once one is on the street.
 

cobraboy

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Not sure why you'd do or say that.

As far as tourist related crime... I don't think the prevalence would be any higher in Pop/Sosua/Cabarete than elsewhere based on # of visitors. You'll be down to riding your clients around in circles on the tarmac at the airport if you plan to avoid everywhere there's a random incident against a tourist. Heck, why don't you advise them not to come at all? Seems more things are reported stolen as luggage passes through the airports than once one is on the street.
More visitors go to Punta Cana. Can you find reports of murders, "kidnappings" and violence against tourists there?

How about in Samana?

Or Barahona?

Or Jarabacoa?

Or Nagua/Cabrera/Rio San Juan?

Santiago?

~One~ incident is isolated. If continued, then a trend develops.

BTW-I am only reporting what I am asked. Where they get the info, I do not know. But one thing I can tell you for FACT: travel agents are becoming increasingly skeptical of sending folks to the North Coast because of these numerous reports. That creates a problem for ME that I didn't create.
 
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jrhartley

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well there were quite a few in samana when i first moved here, they have either stopped reporting or the criminals have all moved here which seems unlikely.

No reports of crime from boca chica or santo domingo either so I guess it only gets reported in certain areas
 

yacht chef

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Sep 13, 2009
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Look it is sad to say and I know that the travel agents well never say it but it is like taking a vacation to the geto with a beach. But if U go with that in mind U well be OK. No one has stolen my valuables thay are at home.
 
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CFA123

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Can you find reports of murders, "kidnappings" and violence against tourists there?

BTW-I am only reporting what I am asked. Where they get the info, I do not know. But one thing I can tell you for FACT: travel agents are becoming increasingly skeptical of sending folks to the North Coast because of these numerous reports. That creates a problem for ME that I didn't create.

That's just the thing cobra, I think you're reporting/advising people incorrectly. "Murders, kidnappings, and violence against tourists" are high in the areas of Puerto Plata, Sosua, and Cabarete that you mention you avoid? I don't see it.

These gentleman last night ran into an unfortunate mugging type incident & there should be no attempt to minimize the incident.

But to say you choose and advise others to avoid Sosua/Cabarete/Pto Plata because tourists are at high risk doing normal touristy things & perpetuate that belief amongst your clients and tour companies? I'm calling b.s. on that logic.

I'm one of the first to post about incidents that occur in the area. But I seldom have to post anything relating to a tourist incident.
We'll see if others agree. I've been wrong before.
 

cobraboy

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That's just the thing cobra, I think you're reporting/advising people incorrectly. "Murders, kidnappings, and violence against tourists" are high in the areas of Puerto Plata, Sosua, and Cabarete that you mention you avoid? I don't see it.

These gentleman last night ran into an unfortunate mugging type incident & there should be no attempt to minimize the incident.

But to say you choose and advise others to avoid Sosua/Cabarete/Pto Plata because tourists are at high risk doing normal touristy things & perpetuate that belief amongst your clients and tour companies? I'm calling b.s. on that logic.

I'm one of the first to post about incidents that occur in the area. But I seldom have to post anything relating to a tourist incident.
We'll see if others agree. I've been wrong before.
Read what I posted.

I'm not TELLING them anything, much less advise anyone to avoid any area. We don't go through PoP/Sosua/Cabarete and never have...and not because of crime, because they aren't an especially pleasant place to ride motorcycles. The closest we get is Rio Damajagua and Sabeneta.

I tell them we don't go to the areas THEY are concerned about, I try to overcome that objection for ME and other tourist companies in the country..

I am not the one who brings up the crime in the DR. Why the hell would I? That would be pooping on my piggy bank. I LIVE here and KNOW the country needs MORE tourist dollars, including my company.

If you want to complain to someone, start with the big international travel associations and all their member agents...of which I am just one of tens of thousands. It is THEY who trumpet warnings about the area, not me. And FWIW, when a "foreigner" is victim of a crime, folks in the industry think "tourist", they don't investigate the nuances. I don't make that rule.

My job is to diffuse those bombs, not light the fuse.
 

CFA123

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I did reread your posts. I suggest you do the same.
It may not have been what you intended, but it's what you wrote.

cobraboy said:
we get asked lately from folks inquiring about our tours is violent crime. And we explain we do NOT spend any time in the PoP/Sosua/Cabarete area.

you didn't say they inquire about those areas, you said that was your explanation of how you keep your clients safe by saying you avoid those areas.

cobraboy said:
"More visitors go to Punta Cana. Can you find reports of murders, "kidnappings" and violence against tourists there?
How about in Samana? Or Barahona? Or Jarabacoa? Or Nagua/Cabrera/Rio San Juan? Santiago?

You imply that murders, kidnappings, and violence against tourists (your words) are rampant in Pto Plata, Sosua, Cabarete by saying it's not elsewhere. The reality is it's not rampant in Pto Plata, Sosua or Cabarete either.

Again, it may not have been your intent, but as I read it... and with you being a regular poster on DR1 who carries some weight with his words... you've written your posts in such a way to imply these areas are dangerous to tourists. Seems to me you're fanning the flame on the fuse... I think the way you've stated things is misleading and required some rebuttal.
 
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jr, I have never known you to be so dense. Of course it occurred at the park near the Casino. You are beginning to worry me.

This incident is an obvious escalation of tactics. Prior to this incident, a snatch and grab and grab was simply that, a snatch and grab. Now they are introducing a new technique. We should be aware of this development and respond accordingly.
 

cobraboy

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I did reread your posts. I suggest you do the same.
It may not have been what you intended, but it's what you wrote.



you didn't say they inquire about those areas, you said that was your explanation of how you keep your clients safe by saying you avoid those areas.



You imply that murders, kidnappings, and violence against tourists (your words) are rampant in Pto Plata, Sosua, Cabarete by saying it's not elsewhere. The reality is it's not rampant in Pto Plata, Sosua or Cabarete either.

Again, it may not have been your intent, but as I read it... and with you being a regular poster on DR1 who carries some weight with his words... you've written your posts in such a way to imply these areas are dangerous to tourists. Seems to me you're fanning the flame on the fuse... I think the way you've stated things is misleading and required some rebuttal.
My words carry nothing. Ask around.

I merely respond to folks. THEY don't know the difference between Sosua and Pedernales. WE do. And when they ask, my goal is to sell them a tour, not to be the Sosua Chamber of Commerce. THEY get their "violent crime" information from the travel industry and agents, NOT me.

If you wanna go on parsing my words to play "gotcha" play on.

I do NOTHING in my business but PROMOTE the Dominican Republic, not bash one area of it...

I want you to read what folks who have NEVER been to the DR...which is about 95% of my customers...read on the US State Dept./Consular website about the DR:

CRIME: Crime continues to be a problem throughout the Dominican Republic. Street crime and petty theft involving U.S. tourists does occur, and precautions should be taken to avoid becoming a target. While pick pocketing and mugging are the most common crimes against tourists, reports of violence against both foreigners and locals are growing. Valuables left unattended in parked automobiles, on beaches and in other public places are vulnerable to theft, and reports of car theft have increased.

Travelers to the Dominican Republic should strongly consider leaving valuable property at home. The Embassy recommends bringing no item on your trip that cannot be easily replaced and to make contingency plans in case of theft. These precautions include: making photocopies of all credit cards and licenses which include the numbers to call in order to report theft; photocopies of passports and birth certificates; and leaving emergency funds with someone at home in case it is necessary for money to be sent on short notice.

Carry cellular telephones in a pocket rather than on a belt or in a purse. Avoid wearing headphones, which make the bearer more vulnerable and readily advertise the presence of a valuable item. Limit or avoid display of jewelry; it attracts attention and could prompt a robbery attempt. Limit cash and credit cards carried on your person. Store valuables, wallet items, and passports in a safe place.

There are continuing reports of thefts that target Americans as they leave the airport in a taxi that lacks air-conditioning. The driver rolls down the windows and when the taxi stops at a traffic light, a motorcyclist reaches in and steals a purse or anything they can grab. Travelers are advised to utilize the taxi service authorized by the airport if they have made no arrangements before arrival. Even when using such an authorized taxi service, Americans should always be aware of the potential for a criminal to stalk travelers leaving the airport parking area. Take measures to safeguard your personal security at all times.

The dangers present in the Dominican Republic are similar to those of many major U.S. cities. Criminals can be dangerous -- many have weapons and are likely to use them if they meet resistance. Visitors walking the streets should always be aware of their surroundings. Be wary of strangers, especially those who seek you out at celebrations or nightspots. Travel with a partner or in a group if possible.

Many public transportation vehicles are unsafe, especially the route taxis or ?carros publicos? in urban areas. These are privately owned vehicles that run along certain routes, can take up to six or more passengers, and are inexpensive. Passengers in ?carros publicos? are frequently the victims of pick pocketing, and passengers have on occasion been robbed by ?carro publico? drivers. Urban buses (?guaguas?) are only marginally better. The U.S. Embassy is also aware of at least one incident in which the driver of a ?motoconcho? (motorcycle taxi) robbed an American passenger. The U.S. Embassy cautions its staff not to use these modes of transportation. As an alternative, some scheduled interurban bus services use modern buses and run on reliable timetables. These are generally the safest means of intercity travel. With respect to taxis, visitors to the Dominican Republic are strongly advised to take only hotel taxis or taxis operated by services whose cabs are arranged in advance by phone and can subsequently be identified and tracked.

Drivers should exercise extreme caution when driving at night and use major highways when possible. In 2006, the U.S. Embassy received reports of Americans and others who were victims of vehicular-armed robberies in the northern provinces of the Dominican Republic. At least three of the reports indicate the victims were intercepted during the morning hours, when there was little other traffic, while driving on rural highways connecting Santiago and Puerto Plata.

Although kidnappings are not common in the Dominican Republic, in 2007, two American citizens were kidnapped and held for ransom, in separate instances.

The American Embassy calls attention to certain criminal techniques that have surprised Americans and other victims:

Several individuals reported robberies perpetrated by criminals on mopeds (often coasting with the engine turned off so as not to draw attention). The driver approaches a pedestrian, grabs his or her cell phone, purse or backpack, and then speeds away. This type of robbery is particularly dangerous because the motorcyclist reaches the intended victim at 15?20 miles per hour and often knocks the victim to the ground.
The Embassy received two reports in 2008 of a crime involving police collaboration. A seemingly-friendly stranger shakes hands with a tourist, who then finds that the stranger has placed a small baggie of cocaine or other substance into the tourist?s hand. The tourist is then immediately apprehended by the police, who settle the case for a fee.
Americans were victimized more than once this year at Santo Domingo?s airport as they checked in their luggage and prepared to leave the country. Smugglers obtained an authentic airline baggage tag in a U.S. citizen?s name and placed it on baggage that contained drugs, presumably to be retrieved by a confederate at the other end of the flight.
Criminals may also misrepresent themselves in an effort to gain access to your residence or hotel room. In one 2005 homicide, a U.S. citizen was murdered by two men who posed as repairmen to gain access to the apartment. In another similar case, in 2008 the Dominican police arrested the building?s actual maintenance man and an accomplice for a crime. There were also instances in 2008 when U.S. citizens were robbed of large amounts of cash just before a scheduled financial transaction by thieves with apparent inside knowledge of the transaction. In one case a U.S. citizen was robbed just outside his attorney?s office, and in another case a U.S. citizen claimed he was victimized by two police officers.

The U.S. Embassy continues to receive reports from Americans who have been stopped while driving and asked for ?donations? by someone who may appear to be a police officer before they are allowed to continue on their way. Usually, the person(s) stopping the American drivers had approached from behind on a motorcycle; several of these motorcyclists pulled up alongside the driver's window and indicated that they were carrying a firearm. In some cases, the perpetrators were dressed in the light green uniform of ?AMET,? the Dominican traffic police; however, they often seemed too young to be police officers or wore ill-fitting uniforms that might have been stolen. In another incident, individuals dressed in military fatigues told the victim they were police and requested the victim to follow them to the police station prior to robbing him. Such incidents should be reported to the police and to the Consular Section. If Dominican police stop an American driver for a traffic violation, the driver should request a traffic ticket rather than paying an on-the-spot fine. The driver also has the right to ask police for identification. Regulations require police to wear a nametag with their last name. While everyone driving in the Dominican Republic should abide by traffic laws and the instructions of legitimate authorities, Americans finding themselves in the aforementioned scenarios should exercise caution. In general, drivers should keep their doors locked and windows closed at all times and leave themselves an escape route when stopping in traffic in the event of an accident or other threat. Incidents involving police may be reported to the Internal Affairs Department of the National Police at 809 688-1777 or 809 688-0777.

Travelers are advised to use credit cards judiciously while in the Dominican Republic. Credit card fraud is common and recent reports indicate that its incidence has increased significantly, in Santo Domingo as well as in the resort areas of the country.

Travelers who elect nevertheless to use their credit or debit cards should never let the cards leave their sight. They should also pay close attention to credit card bills following time spent in the Dominican Republic. There have been reports of fraudulent charges appearing months after card usage in the Dominican Republic. Victims of credit card fraud should contact the bank that issued the credit card immediately.

Travelers are also advised to minimize the use of Automated Teller Machines (ATMs), which are present throughout Santo Domingo and other major cities. One local ATM fraud scheme involves sticking photographic film or pieces of paper in the card feeder of the ATM so that an inserted card becomes jammed. Once the card owner has concluded the card is irretrievable, the thieves extract both the jamming material and the card, which they then use. There are other ATM scams as well. Exercise caution and be aware of your surroundings when using an ATM card.

The overall level of crime tends to rise during the Christmas season, and visitors to the Dominican Republic should take extra precautions when visiting the country between November and January.

In many countries around the world, counterfeit and pirated goods are widely available. Transactions involving such products may be illegal under local law. In addition, bringing them back to the United States may result in forfeitures and/or fines. More information on this serious problem is available from the Department of Justice.

Beaches and Resorts: The Embassy regularly receives reports of individuals and families who have become victims of crime while within the boundaries of their resort hotel. A growing number of these crimes involve the burglary of their room and even the removal of the room safe. In general the criminals do not commit their crime in the presence of the guest, but it is not unheard of for guests to be victimized in their own room, caught off guard in their sleep. Vigilance is strongly recommended.

The Embassy occasionally receives reports of instances of sexual assault at the resorts, particularly while at the beach. ?All-inclusives? are well known for serving abundant quantities of alcohol. Excessive alcohol consumption may decrease a person?s ability to be aware of their surroundings, making them an easy target for crime. It has also been reported that some predators will use date rape drugs to render their victims unaware. Be cautious of accepting any drink or food from a stranger, as they may have been tampered with. As always, the Embassy strongly encourages vigilance.

Please be aware that crime can happen anywhere and that everyone must take personal responsibility to stay alert of their surroundings at all times. Read the U.S. Embassy?s Crime Security Tips Don?t Be A Victim of Crime When Traveling for more information.

The Embassy also receives reports of individuals who have suffered accidents or medical crisis at resorts. American citizens are advised to check their own insurance coverage when overseas or consider travelers? insurance. Hospitalization in the Dominican Republic can be extremely expensive and patients are expected to pay for services immediately. For additional information, see the section below on medical insurance.

Tourist Police: The Dominican Republic does have police that are specially trained to assist tourists who require assistance. This public institution is called Politur and represents a cooperative effort between the National Police, Secretary of the Armed Forces, and the Secretary of Tourism. Politur typically has personnel in tourist areas to provide first responder type assistance to tourists. If you are the victim of a crime, Politur can help you get to a police station so that you may file a police report and seek further assistance.. Politur is located at the corner of 30 de Marzo and Mexico, Bloque D, Governmental Building, Santo Domingo. The general phone number is 809-686-8639. Visit the Politur web site for further details and contact information.

People read this stuff and take it very seriously.
 

CFA123

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My bad.
I just didn't understand how great you are at promoting the DR 'til I saw it here firsthand. You might consider including info on dengue & malaria in your promotional materials as well.

The U.S. consular fact sheet for DR has been a scary read since I first visited about 20 years ago. (Yet millions visit annually and want to return.) I won't argue with its accuracy, but like your posts above it paints a picture much more dire than reality. Why you simply won't state that's the case with your earlier posts I don't know. Instead you throw out more inflammatory information and leave it on the table for all to read.

Helping to put such things into true, honest context for the uninitiated seems a more reasonable path if one is a true goodwill ambassador promoting the country.
 

cobraboy

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Jul 24, 2004
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My bad.
I just didn't understand how great you are at promoting the DR 'til I saw it here firsthand. You might consider including info on dengue & malaria in your promotional materials as well.
My promotional material is on my website. Go see for yourself.

And once again I field question all the time about denge and malaria. Why? Because they go to their doctor, tell him they're headed to the DR for 10 days, and THEIR DOCTOR is the one who scares the bejeesus out of them, not me. All I can do is tell them I know no one in over 26 years coming here and living here who have had either and I've never taken any drugs proactively for those, or any other, disease.
 

CFA123

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May 29, 2004
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What's the website? Domotours.com? If so, I tried earlier this evening & your promo material is still offline as of now.