Undocumented Haitians

miggy99

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May 4, 2011
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gilligan

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I'm not spending another dime in the Dominican Republic until this situation is resolved.
 

bob saunders

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Jan 1, 2002
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What would you have the government do, give Dominican citizenship to all these illegals. Move out of the way, because half of Haiti will run you over trying to get in.
 

gilligan

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Jun 27, 2011
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What would you have the government do, give Dominican citizenship to all these illegals. Move out of the way, because half of Haiti will run you over trying to get in.

If someone is born in the Dominican Republic it is the country of their birth and they are entitled to a birth certificate. If someone is allowed to pay for and complete high school they deserve a diploma. Why is it easier for me to get a Dominican passport than someone who was born there?

I guess these Dominican citizens are an unintended consequence of importing cheap labour? The government should deal with it!
 

NotLurking

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Jul 21, 2003
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If someone is born in the Dominican Republic it is the country of their birth and they are entitled to a birth certificate.

This is not correct. Jus soli (Latin: right of the soil) is granted under the Dominican Constitution of 2010 (chapter V, section I, Article 18, paragraph 3) for children of Legal resident of the Dominican Republic. The Dominican Constitution is very clear on this point. If the foreigner is illegally in the DR so too are his/her decedent.

Source: Dominican Republic: Constitutions

NotLurking
 

miggy99

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May 4, 2011
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To bad usa don"t have immigration law like that

This is not correct. Jus soli (Latin: right of the soil) is granted under the Dominican Constitution of 2010 (chapter V, section I, Article 18, paragraph 3) for children of Legal resident of the Dominican Republic. The Dominican Constitution is very clear on this point. If the foreigner is illegally in the DR so too are his/her decedent.

Source: Dominican Republic: Constitutions

NotLurking
MAKES SENSE--your illegal so are your descendants--Case Closed
 

gilligan

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Jun 27, 2011
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MAKES SENSE--your illegal so are your descendants--Case Closed

Case is not closed for the 4 children featured in the video. I seem to have a strong sense of entitlement and I don't know what I'm talking about re immigration, so that's cool. But what is not cool is that the kids need their diplomas if they completed high school.
 

AlterEgo

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Jan 9, 2009
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If someone is born in the Dominican Republic it is the country of their birth and they are entitled to a birth certificate. If someone is allowed to pay for and complete high school they deserve a diploma. Why is it easier for me to get a Dominican passport than someone who was born there?

I guess these Dominican citizens are an unintended consequence of importing cheap labour? The government should deal with it!

Illegal Haitians born in the Dominican Republic DO receive a birth certificate, but it is a different color, signifying they are not Dominican citizens.

Are you aware that there are VERY FEW countries in the world who offer citizenship to individuals simply because they were born there??

"In contacting foreign governments directly, the Center for Immigration Studies was able to confirm that only 33 of the world's 194 countries grant automatic birthright citizenship to children born to illegal aliens. Some countries which do have such automatic birthright citizenship policies rarely grant such citizenship to children of illegal aliens, however."

More: Other than the United States, what countries still offer citizenship by birth? (aka birthright citizenshi

AE
 

miggy99

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May 4, 2011
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Not undocumented--- illegal is the word

Case is not closed for the 4 children featured in the video. I seem to have a strong sense of entitlement and I don't know what I'm talking about re immigration, so that's cool. But what is not cool is that the kids need their diplomas if they completed high school.
LIKE I said earlier. sometimes children pay fror their parents ILLEGAL actions. Maybe they should asked their PARENTS why they are not getting them!
 

greydread

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Jan 3, 2007
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If someone is born in the Dominican Republic it is the country of their birth and they are entitled to a birth certificate. If someone is allowed to pay for and complete high school they deserve a diploma. Why is it easier for me to get a Dominican passport than someone who was born there?
I guess these Dominican citizens are an unintended consequence of importing cheap labour? The government should deal with it!

Not unlike many countries in continental Europe, "born there" does not provide a birthright of any sort in the Dominican Republic. Fair? Probably not, but it's the law. This is where the problem lies for the gov't. in terms of "dealing with it". They're between a rock and a hard place because any Dominican politician who advocates bestowing citizenship to Haitian's who have snuck across the border or overstayed their temporary visas might end up getting run out of the country him/herself.

On the other hand, every time the government reacts to the problem with roundups and mass deportations they end up all over the World news like it's a mass genocide or something so the path of least resistance appears to be the "do nothing" option and at present it's really the only current option that the Dominican government can afford..... on many levels. The country relies heavily on foreign capital and can't afford too much bad press. They don't want to be the next Pakistan as US legistators in particular are looking at every pocket with a penny in it. just aching for a reason to end funding both foreign and domestic.

All it would take is one or two cases of mistaken identity by the police (who are not very well organized, funded or trained for the most part) to displace a couple of families of those who are either legal citizens of Haitian descent or "Haitian looking" Dominicans to air on Western media outlets for a couple hundred million people to watch and Santo Domingo would turn into the new Johannesburg at the speed of light.
 

miggy99

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May 4, 2011
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Thank you ALTEREGO

Illegal Haitians born in the Dominican Republic DO receive a birth certificate, but it is a different color, signifying they are not Dominican citizens.

Are you aware that there are VERY FEW countries in the world who offer citizenship to individuals simply because they were born there??

"In contacting foreign governments directly, the Center for Immigration Studies was able to confirm that only 33 of the world's 194 countries grant automatic birthright citizenship to children born to illegal aliens. Some countries which do have such automatic birthright citizenship policies rarely grant such citizenship to children of illegal aliens, however."

More: Other than the United States, what countries still offer citizenship by birth? (aka birthright citizenshi

AE
IT'S simple the PARENTS knew that they are not Dominican citizens and were breaking the law and did nothing about it. Well now time to "pay the piper". ILLEGAL is ILLEGAL not all countries as the quote above states, have immigration policies like the USA.
 

Caribbeandreamto

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Mar 26, 2011
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I posted this video because I thought it was well done, no matter what your point of view is.

It's already been stated and I am in agreement that these individuals are illegal and breaking the law. In any case, there are thousands of undocumented Haitians living in the Dominican Republic. We have generations of undocumented Haitians that have little opportunity to advance in society; so, I bet a good percentage turn to crime to get by.

The problem needs to be fixed at its root: the border. Stiffer border patrols so no more illegal Haitians are crossing into Dominican territory. The ones that are here? I don't know. But I would rather they be given opportunities so they don't end up being criminals.
 

trangalanga

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Jun 10, 2011
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Well I guess there is a majority of Americans here, as most answers seem to reflect. In Europe things are different.

I'm a Lawyer in Spain, and there at least the following two international conventions are binding and their precepts cannot be ruled out by national or regional law:

Convention on the Rights of the Child - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Official UN Universal Declaration of Human Rights Home Page

Therefore, a minor who is within the territory of Spain cannot be denied documentation, full schooling (including titles), complete health care, etc. Period. You'd have no trouble obtaining an injuction for that, but they are seldom necessary, as the aforementioned rules are fully enforced as a matter of fact.

I know that is also true of other European countries.

Here are the Rights of the Child. The bold highlighting is mine. Read the last line to see who has not signed it yet. The DR is a signatory party.

El 20 de noviembre de 1959 la Asamblea General de las Naciones Unidas adopt? su propia Declaraci?n de los Derechos del Ni?o.
  1. El ni?o disfrutar? de todos los derechos enunciados en esta declaraci?n.Estos derechos ser?n reconocidos a todos los ni?os sin excepci?n alguna ni distinci?n o discriminaci?n por motivos de raza, color, sexo, idioma, religi?n, opiniones pol?ticas o de otra ?ndole, origen nacional o social, posici?n econ?mica, nacimiento u otra condici?n, ya sea del propio ni?o o de su familia.
  2. El ni?o gozar? de una protecci?n especial y dispondr? de oportunidades y servicios, dispensado todo ello por la ley y por otros medios, para que pueda desarrollarse f?sica, mental, moral, espiritual y socialmente en forma saludable y normal, as? como en condiciones de libertad y dignidad. Al promulgar leyes con este fin, la consideraci?n fundamental a que se atender? ser? el inter?s superior del ni?o.
  3. El ni?o tiene derecho desde su nacimiento a un nombre y a una nacionalidad.
  4. El ni?o debe gozar de los beneficios de la seguridad social.Tendr? derecho a crecer y desarrollarse en buena salud; con este fin deber?n proporcionarse, tanto a ?l como a su madre, cuidados especiales, incluso atenci?n prenatal y postnatal. El ni?o tendr? derecho a disfrutar de alimentaci?n, vivienda, recreo y servicios m?dicos adecuados.
  5. El ni?o f?sica o mentalmente impedido o que sufra alg?n impedimento social debe recibir el tratamiento, la educaci?n y el cuidado especiales que requiere su caso particular.
  6. El ni?o, para el pleno desarrollo de su personalidad, necesita amor y comprensi?n. Siempre que sea posible, deber? crecer al amparo y bajo la responsabilidad de sus padres y, en todo caso, en un ambiente de afecto y de seguridad moral y material; salvo circunstancias excepcionales, no deber? separarse al ni?o de corta edad de su madre. La sociedad y las autoridades p?blicas tendr?n la obligaci?n de cuidar especialmente a los ni?os sin familia o que carezcan de medios adecuados de subsistencia. Para el mantenimiento de los hijos de familias numerosas conviene conceder subsidios estatales o de otra ?ndole.
  7. El ni?o tiene derecho a recibir educaci?n que ser? gratuita y obligatoria por lo menos en las etapas elementales. Se le dar? una educaci?n que favorezca su cultura general y le permita, en condiciones de igualdad de oportunidades, desarrollar sus aptitudes y su juicio individual, su sentido de responsabilidad moral y social y llegar a ser un miembro ?til de la sociedad. El inter?s superior del ni?o debe ser el principio rector de quienes tienen la responsabilidad de su educaci?n y orientaci?n; dicha responsabilidad incumbe, en primer t?rmino, a sus padres. El ni?o debe disfrutar plenamente de juegos y recreaciones, los cuales deben estar orientados hacia los fines perseguidos por la educaci?n; la sociedad y las autoridades p?blicas se esforzar?n por promover el goce de este derecho.
  8. El ni?o debe, en todas las circunstancias, figurar entre los primeros que reciban protecci?n y socorro.
  9. El ni?o debe ser protegido contra toda forma de abandono, crueldad y explotaci?n. No ser? objeto de ning?n tipo de trata. No deber? permitirse al ni?o trabajar antes de una edad m?nima adecuada; en ning?n caso se le dedicar? ni se le permitir? que se dedique a ocupaci?n o empleo alguno que pueda perjudicar su salud o educaci?n o impedir su desarrollo f?sico, mental o moral.
  10. El ni?o debe ser protegido contra las pr?cticas que puedan fomentar la discriminaci?n racial, religiosa, o de cualquiera otra ?ndole. Debe ser educado en un esp?ritu de comprensi?n, tolerancia, amistad entre los pueblos, paz y fraternidad universal, y con plena conciencia de que debe consagrar sus energ?as y aptitudes al servicio de sus semejantes.
Estados Unidos y Somalia son los ?nicos pa?ses del mundo que no la han suscrito.
 

SKing

Silver
Nov 22, 2007
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Well I guess there is a majority of Americans here, as most answers seem to reflect. In Europe things are different.

I'm a Lawyer in Spain, and there at least the following two international conventions are binding and their precepts cannot be ruled out by national or regional law:

Convention on the Rights of the Child - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Official UN Universal Declaration of Human Rights Home Page

Therefore, a minor who is within the territory of Spain cannot be denied documentation, full schooling (including titles), complete health care, etc. Period. You'd have no trouble obtaining an injuction for that, but they are seldom necessary, as the aforementioned rules are fully enforced as a matter of fact.

I know that is also true of other European countries.

Here are the Rights of the Child. The bold highlighting is mine. Read the last line to see who has not signed it yet. The DR is a signatory party.

El 20 de noviembre de 1959 la Asamblea General de las Naciones Unidas adopt? su propia Declaraci?n de los Derechos del Ni?o.
  1. El ni?o disfrutar? de todos los derechos enunciados en esta declaraci?n.Estos derechos ser?n reconocidos a todos los ni?os sin excepci?n alguna ni distinci?n o discriminaci?n por motivos de raza, color, sexo, idioma, religi?n, opiniones pol?ticas o de otra ?ndole, origen nacional o social, posici?n econ?mica, nacimiento u otra condici?n, ya sea del propio ni?o o de su familia.
  2. El ni?o gozar? de una protecci?n especial y dispondr? de oportunidades y servicios, dispensado todo ello por la ley y por otros medios, para que pueda desarrollarse f?sica, mental, moral, espiritual y socialmente en forma saludable y normal, as? como en condiciones de libertad y dignidad. Al promulgar leyes con este fin, la consideraci?n fundamental a que se atender? ser? el inter?s superior del ni?o.
  3. El ni?o tiene derecho desde su nacimiento a un nombre y a una nacionalidad.
  4. El ni?o debe gozar de los beneficios de la seguridad social.Tendr? derecho a crecer y desarrollarse en buena salud; con este fin deber?n proporcionarse, tanto a ?l como a su madre, cuidados especiales, incluso atenci?n prenatal y postnatal. El ni?o tendr? derecho a disfrutar de alimentaci?n, vivienda, recreo y servicios m?dicos adecuados.
  5. El ni?o f?sica o mentalmente impedido o que sufra alg?n impedimento social debe recibir el tratamiento, la educaci?n y el cuidado especiales que requiere su caso particular.
  6. El ni?o, para el pleno desarrollo de su personalidad, necesita amor y comprensi?n. Siempre que sea posible, deber? crecer al amparo y bajo la responsabilidad de sus padres y, en todo caso, en un ambiente de afecto y de seguridad moral y material; salvo circunstancias excepcionales, no deber? separarse al ni?o de corta edad de su madre. La sociedad y las autoridades p?blicas tendr?n la obligaci?n de cuidar especialmente a los ni?os sin familia o que carezcan de medios adecuados de subsistencia. Para el mantenimiento de los hijos de familias numerosas conviene conceder subsidios estatales o de otra ?ndole.
  7. El ni?o tiene derecho a recibir educaci?n que ser? gratuita y obligatoria por lo menos en las etapas elementales. Se le dar? una educaci?n que favorezca su cultura general y le permita, en condiciones de igualdad de oportunidades, desarrollar sus aptitudes y su juicio individual, su sentido de responsabilidad moral y social y llegar a ser un miembro ?til de la sociedad. El inter?s superior del ni?o debe ser el principio rector de quienes tienen la responsabilidad de su educaci?n y orientaci?n; dicha responsabilidad incumbe, en primer t?rmino, a sus padres. El ni?o debe disfrutar plenamente de juegos y recreaciones, los cuales deben estar orientados hacia los fines perseguidos por la educaci?n; la sociedad y las autoridades p?blicas se esforzar?n por promover el goce de este derecho.
  8. El ni?o debe, en todas las circunstancias, figurar entre los primeros que reciban protecci?n y socorro.
  9. El ni?o debe ser protegido contra toda forma de abandono, crueldad y explotaci?n. No ser? objeto de ning?n tipo de trata. No deber? permitirse al ni?o trabajar antes de una edad m?nima adecuada; en ning?n caso se le dedicar? ni se le permitir? que se dedique a ocupaci?n o empleo alguno que pueda perjudicar su salud o educaci?n o impedir su desarrollo f?sico, mental o moral.
  10. El ni?o debe ser protegido contra las pr?cticas que puedan fomentar la discriminaci?n racial, religiosa, o de cualquiera otra ?ndole. Debe ser educado en un esp?ritu de comprensi?n, tolerancia, amistad entre los pueblos, paz y fraternidad universal, y con plena conciencia de que debe consagrar sus energ?as y aptitudes al servicio de sus semejantes.
Estados Unidos y Somalia son los ?nicos pa?ses del mundo que no la han suscrito.

Because actions speak louder than words.....We don't need to sign anything, that's why the whole world wants to come here. Because ACTIONS speak louder than a bunch of crap on a piece of paper.

SHALENA
 

Mr_DR

Silver
May 12, 2002
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LIKE I said earlier. sometimes children pay fror their parents ILLEGAL actions. Maybe they should asked their PARENTS why they are not getting them!

The US is also trying to pass a similar law where sons and daughters of illegal immigrants born in the country will not be granted automatic citizenship.