- Thread starter Sarah Lee
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All Inclusive
Terry, can you be specific about the "moaning and complaining" you refer to?
Tery: "People should be more appreciative of there Dominican hosts"
Response:
Tourists are customers to the businesses that cater to tourism. The customer can and will take their business elsewhere if the business does not do more than the businesses selling similar products elsewhere. This is not my opinion. This is how business is done in a free market.
When one buys a vacation and visits a foreign country, it is the tourist that is doing the favor to the host country, not the other way around. After all, tourists don't market to the host country, "Please let me visit". It is the other way around, with the host country marketing, "Come see the Dominican Republic".
While it is good manners to act civilized no matter where one travels, it is by no means expected that the customer be "appreciative" to any business that is selling to them a product or service, and between a tourist and a business that caters to tourism, that IS the relationship. Not guest-host. Business is business. For most of the world, businesses do not expect "appreciation" from the customer. Are they in the "appreciation" business? Most are in business for money as far as I know, and even the smiles businesses put up front are tools to get money. Why should the DR be any different.
The people are not underpaid. They are paid exactly what they are worth. The DEFINITION of worth is what someone else is willing to pay. Period. They are not forced to work for the wages the do. They accept, willingly. How much the same work earns elsewhere is irrelavent.
Sarah Lee, what leads you to believe "THAT THEY EXPECT AN ALL INCLUSIVE TREAMENT EVERYWHERE THEY GO"? What did you read that makes you draw that conclusion? I'm unaware of any ongoing situation where people routinely leave their resorts and expect people that are not employees of the resort to service them as an extension of the resort. Please enlighten us.
Tery: "People should be more appreciative of there Dominican hosts"
Response:
Tourists are customers to the businesses that cater to tourism. The customer can and will take their business elsewhere if the business does not do more than the businesses selling similar products elsewhere. This is not my opinion. This is how business is done in a free market.
When one buys a vacation and visits a foreign country, it is the tourist that is doing the favor to the host country, not the other way around. After all, tourists don't market to the host country, "Please let me visit". It is the other way around, with the host country marketing, "Come see the Dominican Republic".
While it is good manners to act civilized no matter where one travels, it is by no means expected that the customer be "appreciative" to any business that is selling to them a product or service, and between a tourist and a business that caters to tourism, that IS the relationship. Not guest-host. Business is business. For most of the world, businesses do not expect "appreciation" from the customer. Are they in the "appreciation" business? Most are in business for money as far as I know, and even the smiles businesses put up front are tools to get money. Why should the DR be any different.
The people are not underpaid. They are paid exactly what they are worth. The DEFINITION of worth is what someone else is willing to pay. Period. They are not forced to work for the wages the do. They accept, willingly. How much the same work earns elsewhere is irrelavent.
Sarah Lee, what leads you to believe "THAT THEY EXPECT AN ALL INCLUSIVE TREAMENT EVERYWHERE THEY GO"? What did you read that makes you draw that conclusion? I'm unaware of any ongoing situation where people routinely leave their resorts and expect people that are not employees of the resort to service them as an extension of the resort. Please enlighten us.
Dos centavos para Jim......
Here in Juan Dolio the resorts are in close proximity to local establishments. If you talk to many of the owners of these businesses they almost all have the story to tell of the people who came in, ate,drank whatever and then got up to leave without paying. They were genuinely surprised when stopped and presented with the bill......methinks there is a "Duh" factor at work in these cases.
Also many of the "all inclusive" resorts have dive centers and water sport activities and restaurants,massage centers etc. that are privately owned and not part of the "all inclusive". It is surprising the number of people that expect these services to be "free" and become upset when they have to pay extra.
I realize that with the over abundance of these AI's and the "cheap" vacation packages promoted by many tour companies the "quality" of tourists has declined. Many of those arriving at an AI are on their first "real" vacation and believe that an all inclusive is just that! ALL INCLUSIVE!!!
Seems to me that some of today's travellers need a basic education in the terminology used by tour operators to "sell" their product.
As to your comments to Terry.....you said it!!
Here in Juan Dolio the resorts are in close proximity to local establishments. If you talk to many of the owners of these businesses they almost all have the story to tell of the people who came in, ate,drank whatever and then got up to leave without paying. They were genuinely surprised when stopped and presented with the bill......methinks there is a "Duh" factor at work in these cases.
Also many of the "all inclusive" resorts have dive centers and water sport activities and restaurants,massage centers etc. that are privately owned and not part of the "all inclusive". It is surprising the number of people that expect these services to be "free" and become upset when they have to pay extra.
I realize that with the over abundance of these AI's and the "cheap" vacation packages promoted by many tour companies the "quality" of tourists has declined. Many of those arriving at an AI are on their first "real" vacation and believe that an all inclusive is just that! ALL INCLUSIVE!!!
Seems to me that some of today's travellers need a basic education in the terminology used by tour operators to "sell" their product.
As to your comments to Terry.....you said it!!
attacking
i continue to be baffled at how quickly we "jump" on a new poster just because the poster aks an ignorant question....ignorance can be cured, stupidity cant...lets first determine which one we're dealing with before going on the offensive....appologies to JH and MommC as I am not directing this specifically toward you....I just feel a little snippy tonite....MommC: save some bandwidth for ME!!
i continue to be baffled at how quickly we "jump" on a new poster just because the poster aks an ignorant question....ignorance can be cured, stupidity cant...lets first determine which one we're dealing with before going on the offensive....appologies to JH and MommC as I am not directing this specifically toward you....I just feel a little snippy tonite....MommC: save some bandwidth for ME!!
I am specificly refering to the people who continue to complain about the negative side of the Dominican Republic.so much talk of sankies(never heard of that word till I visited dr1) perhaps Golo could start his own sankie forum(sankie domingo.con)and your own contribution Jim, a list of reasons to borrow money,(re Paul Simon a hundred ways to "screw" your lover).
(perhaps someone can come up with the lyric)
Seriously the view a potential tourist could get from reading certain posts on this forum would be anything but positive. which leads to your next point.The people who should be more appreciative are the ones who currently reside here and post their views on the Dominican Republic. As you implied tourist are fickle bunch and it wouldn't take much to change there destination.I can only be regarded as a tourist, I come here two to three weeks a year at most,I know a different Dom. Reb. than the one painted here.
With regards to your comments on wages, I was wondering if perhaps you were related to Margaret Thatcher.The people who work in those A.I. resorts are grossly underpaid,but if that is the only work that is available what choice do they have.Its amazing what a starving man will eat.
(perhaps someone can come up with the lyric)
Seriously the view a potential tourist could get from reading certain posts on this forum would be anything but positive. which leads to your next point.The people who should be more appreciative are the ones who currently reside here and post their views on the Dominican Republic. As you implied tourist are fickle bunch and it wouldn't take much to change there destination.I can only be regarded as a tourist, I come here two to three weeks a year at most,I know a different Dom. Reb. than the one painted here.
With regards to your comments on wages, I was wondering if perhaps you were related to Margaret Thatcher.The people who work in those A.I. resorts are grossly underpaid,but if that is the only work that is available what choice do they have.Its amazing what a starving man will eat.
My firned. Excuse the appearance.
I guess I forgot to include the context from when that was originally posted. The "lines" post from back in 2000 was all in fun and at the time, was a popular topic. Here's the one I posted for the tourist.
http://dr1.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=41555&post41555
You may never have heard the word sanky, but if you've stayed at an AI resort , they were there. They exist at beach resorts all throughout the Caribbean. Jamaica and Costa Rica is even more popular for "Romance Tourism" as they call it.
You are right about mostly complaints. People aren't going to post "everything was fine". Forums of any kind generally are for posting problems and maybe getting solutions, aren't they?
Go to any product forum and you won't see, (modem manufacturer site) "My new modem is fast.", you'll want one", you'll see "Where can I get an updated driver. The one I've got doesn't work with my computer".
Everybody's experience is different. Go to Debbies Dominican page and you'll see praise and disgust given to the same properties there. No different here.
What does "underpaid" mean. If it means not enough money to live comfortably, then I won't argue. I take it to mean less than what the job is worth. Which do we usually use when deciding what to pay someone? What it is worth, or what people can live comfortably on?
When it is MORE than what people comfortably live on, do we give expect the employees to give the excess back to the resort? No, we pay the minimum we need to, in order to get the kind of employees and attitudes we feel are sufficient to meet our business objectives. It's OK to operate at business that way isn't it? That's how most of the businesses in the western world operate.
The resorts did not make the people poor and starving. The resorts did not make the people jobless. The resort just gave them an employment OPTION, where before there was none. I think most of the employees there would rather have the option to work there (at very low wages) than not have the option at all. The resort's option of low pay can make the difference between someone eating, or not. You'd rather the latter?
When it is your company, you can take "your" profits and spend them on higher wages, and take out a loan for higher wages if you aren't making a profit this year.
There is a minimum wage law in the DR and it is not being violated. This is what the government, elected by the people, decide is the minimum. Not you or me.
The low pay makes possible bargain prices, which is one of the key points driving tourism in the DR, if not THE key point. You want to drive away tourism? That can't be good for anybody.
The pay is in line with wages in the DR and the market value for the job. Do you offer to overpay at a hotel, if it's going bankrupt and all the employees are about to lose their jobs and maybe not eat? Should the rule be that you can't start a business unless you pay high enough wages for people to live comfortably? Do these same employees that also have colmados, salons in the family or whose family might employ a housekeeper, pay enough to their employees to make a comfortable living? Guaranteed it's less than the resort pays. Those are sought after jobs in the DR, at the pay rate they offer. Very sought after. There are always more people that want the job than the resort has jobs to offer.
Anyway, this is an old topic, discussed to death in the archives.
I guess I forgot to include the context from when that was originally posted. The "lines" post from back in 2000 was all in fun and at the time, was a popular topic. Here's the one I posted for the tourist.
http://dr1.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=41555&post41555
You may never have heard the word sanky, but if you've stayed at an AI resort , they were there. They exist at beach resorts all throughout the Caribbean. Jamaica and Costa Rica is even more popular for "Romance Tourism" as they call it.
You are right about mostly complaints. People aren't going to post "everything was fine". Forums of any kind generally are for posting problems and maybe getting solutions, aren't they?
Go to any product forum and you won't see, (modem manufacturer site) "My new modem is fast.", you'll want one", you'll see "Where can I get an updated driver. The one I've got doesn't work with my computer".
Everybody's experience is different. Go to Debbies Dominican page and you'll see praise and disgust given to the same properties there. No different here.
What does "underpaid" mean. If it means not enough money to live comfortably, then I won't argue. I take it to mean less than what the job is worth. Which do we usually use when deciding what to pay someone? What it is worth, or what people can live comfortably on?
When it is MORE than what people comfortably live on, do we give expect the employees to give the excess back to the resort? No, we pay the minimum we need to, in order to get the kind of employees and attitudes we feel are sufficient to meet our business objectives. It's OK to operate at business that way isn't it? That's how most of the businesses in the western world operate.
The resorts did not make the people poor and starving. The resorts did not make the people jobless. The resort just gave them an employment OPTION, where before there was none. I think most of the employees there would rather have the option to work there (at very low wages) than not have the option at all. The resort's option of low pay can make the difference between someone eating, or not. You'd rather the latter?
When it is your company, you can take "your" profits and spend them on higher wages, and take out a loan for higher wages if you aren't making a profit this year.
There is a minimum wage law in the DR and it is not being violated. This is what the government, elected by the people, decide is the minimum. Not you or me.
The low pay makes possible bargain prices, which is one of the key points driving tourism in the DR, if not THE key point. You want to drive away tourism? That can't be good for anybody.
The pay is in line with wages in the DR and the market value for the job. Do you offer to overpay at a hotel, if it's going bankrupt and all the employees are about to lose their jobs and maybe not eat? Should the rule be that you can't start a business unless you pay high enough wages for people to live comfortably? Do these same employees that also have colmados, salons in the family or whose family might employ a housekeeper, pay enough to their employees to make a comfortable living? Guaranteed it's less than the resort pays. Those are sought after jobs in the DR, at the pay rate they offer. Very sought after. There are always more people that want the job than the resort has jobs to offer.
Anyway, this is an old topic, discussed to death in the archives.