Big Article on Domininican Rep. and Haitians RE:Immigration

melphis

Living my Dream
Apr 18, 2013
3,486
1,675
113
I read the article and to me it just sounds like more of same socialist ideas. No where in this article did it say who is going to pay for all of this.
Just imagine for a moment if you took all the money that's required to integrate all these people into any culture, but take that money and get rid of the idiot government in the home country (Haiti) and make life better there. It sounds to simple to work but look at from a sports point of view. Sometimes it makes more sense to fire the coach than replace the team.
 

NALs

Economist by Profession
Jan 20, 2003
13,316
3,122
113
According to Wikipedia, the author of the article was the only American media correspondent that was placed full time in Haiti after the earthquake in 2010. He also published a book, his only book, of how the international help has left Haiti in worse shape.

Given his background, it doesn´t surprise me he´s vehemently pro-Haitian and anti-Dominican. Through the years I learned to research the authors of any article about DR-HT issues before reading the articles, because those that are against the DR use the same arguments -and the same lies and half truths- over and over again. I simply don´t waste my time reading what they write if I suspect they are not going to be balanced, at the very least. You read one one-sided DR-HT article where the DR is shredded to pieces and you basically read them all.

Needless to say that on which of the two countries a person is ´introduced´ to the island usually affects their biases when they have one. For the longest time I noticed that many foreigners that get acquainted* first with Haiti arrive on the Dominican scene with a very obvious pro-Haitian view of things. In a way it is expected, but sometimes I wonder what exactly are the Haitians telling these people about the DR. Some of them arrive with a sort of anger towards the DR. Some, after years of getting to know the DR, revise their original anti-Dominican opinions but they never fully give up their pro-Haitian stance. They simply get rid of the anger once they get a hold of a more complete picture of the situation and the history.


* Visit and get involved for years before they ´discover´ there is another Hispaniola.
 
Last edited:

cavok

Silver
Jun 16, 2014
9,503
4,023
113
Cabarete
Just another typical liberal, anti-Dominican, biased report that makes sure to get in all the usual "hot button" trigger words - fascist, nationalist, racist. Liberals just love those words and use them whenever possible to try to make an argument.
 

mofongoloco

Silver
Feb 7, 2013
3,002
9
38
I read the article. aside from one or two sentences I thought it was well balanced.

"The Dominican Republic also has a long, brutal history of anti-Haitian racism." If he chose bigotry it would have been more accurate.

"They forcibly separated people who’d long mixed together in vaguely delineated borderlands, consecrating a new national boundary that had been set largely by the occupying U.S. military a few years earlier, but which until then existed mostly on paper." Pretty accurate.

"Many Dominicans are not bigoted against immigrants."

It wasn't as bad as I expected it to be.
 

CristoRey

Welcome To Wonderland
Apr 1, 2014
11,679
7,928
113
I read up until I saw these words...."according to Human Rights Watch"
More often then not this liberal organization tends to mix feelings with
the facts. Not worth my time.
 

HarpB

Member
Aug 31, 2012
69
17
18
A very one sided arguement. Forgot to mention Haiti’s own dictatorships followed by basically no government since. If they had a stable government, a somewhat stable government then normalcy might occur.
 

franco1111

Bronze
May 29, 2013
1,247
227
63
Gringo
There was a long discussion on DR1 about the bias of Katz more than a year ago - maybe even two or three - after the court decision that resulted in the DR government beginning to expel from the DR Haitians here illegally. The guy is an amateur journalist who sells articles freelance and has more success when he writes sensational hyperbole.
 

cobraboy

Pro-Bono Demolition Hobbyist
Jul 24, 2004
40,964
936
113
There was a long discussion on DR1 about the bias of Katz more than a year ago - maybe even two or three - after the court decision that resulted in the DR government beginning to expel from the DR Haitians here illegally. The guy is an amateur journalist who sells articles freelance and has more success when he writes sensational hyperbole.
That does not make him a "journalist."

It makes him a "propaganda activist."

Today in all the media, there are far more of the latter than former.
 

jenmar237

New member
Aug 8, 2017
108
0
0
I read the article. aside from one or two sentences I thought it was well balanced.

"The Dominican Republic also has a long, brutal history of anti-Haitian racism." If he chose bigotry it would have been more accurate.

"They forcibly separated people who’d long mixed together in vaguely delineated borderlands, consecrating a new national boundary that had been set largely by the occupying U.S. military a few years earlier, but which until then existed mostly on paper." Pretty accurate.

"Many Dominicans are not bigoted against immigrants."

It wasn't as bad as I expected it to be.

2 out of 3 of those sentences are already anti-Dominican and you somehow find this article to be 'well-balanced'. Interesting.
 

jenmar237

New member
Aug 8, 2017
108
0
0
According to Wikipedia, the author of the article was the only American media correspondent that was placed full time in Haiti after the earthquake in 2010. He also published a book, his only book, of how the international help has left Haiti in worse shape.

Given his background, it doesn´t surprise me he´s vehemently pro-Haitian and anti-Dominican. Through the years I learned to research the authors of any article about DR-HT issues before reading the articles, because those that are against the DR use the same arguments -and the same lies and half truths- over and over again. I simply don´t waste my time reading what they write if I suspect they are not going to be balanced, at the very least. You read one one-sided DR-HT article where the DR is shredded to pieces and you basically read them all.

Needless to say that on which of the two countries a person is ´introduced´ to the island usually affects their biases when they have one. For the longest time I noticed that many foreigners that get acquainted* first with Haiti arrive on the Dominican scene with a very obvious pro-Haitian view of things. In a way it is expected, but sometimes I wonder what exactly are the Haitians telling these people about the DR. Some of them arrive with a sort of anger towards the DR. Some, after years of getting to know the DR, revise their original anti-Dominican opinions but they never fully give up their pro-Haitian stance. They simply get rid of the anger once they get a hold of a more complete picture of the situation and the history.


* Visit and get involved for years before they ´discover´ there is another Hispaniola.

Back when the whole mess with 'La Sentencia' started, he wrote a lenghty piece (on NYT if I'm not mistaken) and myself and a few other friends of mine took him to task on it on FB, and, of course, as is typical with many liberals, he proceeded to delete every single comment that challenged the many lies he had indicated in his article. To say this guy has an anti-Dominican bias and agenda is putting it mildly.
 

franco1111

Bronze
May 29, 2013
1,247
227
63
Gringo
I have nothing personal against this guy. My only criticism has been about one or two stories he did about the Haitian/DR situation some time back. The one article - that I cannot find right now - appeared in the Sunday New Times magazine. That article was full of distortion of the facts and near hysterical hyperbole. My comments were about that.

Here (link below), it appears he is not proud enough of that article to provide a link to it. And, for good reason.


https://jonathanmkatz.com/articles
 

melphis

Living my Dream
Apr 18, 2013
3,486
1,675
113
I think you need to check the meaning of "Socialist".

With most ideologies there can be several meanings. The one I was referring to was the more current one of give everything away, put immigration rules on hold and screw what the tax payers want regardless of what the implications to the rest of society are.
I will leave it at that as I don't want to hijack this thread and get it moved to the political thread.
Or get my fingers slapped