POP airport and the conspiracy

Taylor

Buy the ticket, take the ride
Jan 28, 2005
362
73
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It's no secret that Cabarete's (and the north coast) tourism is not what it once was. Over the last decade there's been a string of theories as to why. The latest one that I'm hearing from business owners is that POP airport is the most expensive airport in the DR, which is why the airlines are cancelling flights.

To me that doesn't make a lot of sense.

What I understand is that airlines identify a route with demand, work a deal with the airports and offer a flight. They in turn charge as much as they can to offer that flight. The free market system ensures that if the prices (and profit) go up enough, that encourages other airlines to add that route which in turn keeps the prices in check - demand and supply.

So as a result, the flights to POP are being cancelled because there is a lack of demand, and the few flights that remain charge what they can. If there was a demand, then someone would either start offering a connector flight from PUJ, or another flight to POP from wherever the demand is.

What I am missing that the business owners look at me as if I'm from space when I say this?
 

Luperon

Who empowered China's crime against humanity?
Jun 28, 2004
4,510
294
83
It's no secret that Cabarete's (and the north coast) tourism is not what it once was. Over the last decade there's been a string of theories as to why. The latest one that I'm hearing from business owners is that POP airport is the most expensive airport in the DR, which is why the airlines are cancelling flights.

To me that doesn't make a lot of sense.

What I understand is that airlines identify a route with demand, work a deal with the airports and offer a flight. They in turn charge as much as they can to offer that flight. The free market system ensures that if the prices (and profit) go up enough, that encourages other airlines to add that route which in turn keeps the prices in check - demand and supply.

So as a result, the flights to POP are being cancelled because there is a lack of demand, and the few flights that remain charge what they can. If there was a demand, then someone would either start offering a connector flight from PUJ, or another flight to POP from wherever the demand is.

What I am missing that the business owners look at me as if I'm from space when I say this?
Anything is possible where there is unrestricted corruption. Can money in Punta Cana or anywhere else influence corporate and government officials? Never say never.
 

Taylor

Buy the ticket, take the ride
Jan 28, 2005
362
73
28
Anything is possible where there is unrestricted corruption. Can money in Punta Cana or anywhere else influence corporate and government officials? Never say never.

Anything is possible, but to what end would money in PC what to spend what would be a massive amount to repress a place who's loss of business would not simply mean redirected to PC. People could just as easily go anywhere else.
 

william webster

Platinum
Jan 16, 2009
30,247
4,329
113
Punta Cana airport is privately owned...and thriving w/ over 60% of incoming flights to the country

Not a gov't facility like the other airports....
 

Taylor

Buy the ticket, take the ride
Jan 28, 2005
362
73
28
Punta Cana airport is privately owned...and thriving w/ over 60% of incoming flights to the country

Not a gov't facility like the other airports....

So if there was demand for POP, someone would organize a shuttle flight to PUJ
 

SKY

Gold
Apr 11, 2004
13,470
3,604
113
So if there was demand for POP, someone would organize a shuttle flight to PUJ

There were at least 2 airlines that did run shuttle flights to POP. They both folded up. Not many customers. Small planes.
 

Luperon

Who empowered China's crime against humanity?
Jun 28, 2004
4,510
294
83
Anything is possible, but to what end would money in PC what to spend what would be a massive amount to repress a place who's loss of business would not simply mean redirected to PC. People could just as easily go anywhere else.
All I say is.. Never say never. It's a zero sum game. If pop fails, real estate prices fall, so somebody buys cheap.

Look hard enough and you will see there is always financial windfall for market manipulation. This is multiplied in the Dominican Republic.
 
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cavok

Silver
Jun 16, 2014
9,527
4,045
113
Cabarete
It's very hard for small, commuter-type airlines with 19 seats or less(and I think that's all the market could bear) to operate with relatively cheap fares. I think it would be too expensive and too much of a hassle to fly PUJ-POP.

Somewhat of a mystery why a regional jet or larger, like Southwest, doesn't have a flight out of FLL(?). A lot of peope hate connecting through MIA. Competiton woud help bring down fates.
 

drstock

Silver
Oct 29, 2010
4,502
2,086
113
Cabarete
From what I hear it is true that airport charges are higher for flights coming into POP than into other airports here. This in turn makes ticket prices higher, which makes the flights less popular, which makes it even less profitable for airlines to come to POP, as they have to reduce their margins to fill their seats. The whole thing is a vicious circle which ends up with fewer airlines coming and bringing fewer visitors.
 

ctrob

Silver
Nov 9, 2006
5,591
781
113
I doubt it's the airport fees by themselves. Airlines fly in here now. They're making a profit or they wouldn't do it.

The problem is the aging infrastructure, crappy roads, aging AI's, sewage smell everywhere you go, AI's and hotels raising prices to make up for less traffic, and less traffic becuse of the prices being raised.

The gov't is improving roads, educating about the garbage everywhere, and beginning to advertise the NC. But it ain't going to happen overnight.
 

malko

Campesino !! :)
Jan 12, 2013
5,545
1,327
113
It's no secret that Cabarete's (and the north coast) tourism is not what it once was. Over the last decade there's been a string of theories as to why. The latest one that I'm hearing from business owners is that POP airport is the most expensive airport in the DR, which is why the airlines are cancelling flights.

To me that doesn't make a lot of sense.

What I understand is that airlines identify a route with demand, work a deal with the airports and offer a flight. They in turn charge as much as they can to offer that flight. The free market system ensures that if the prices (and profit) go up enough, that encourages other airlines to add that route which in turn keeps the prices in check - demand and supply.

So as a result, the flights to POP are being cancelled because there is a lack of demand, and the few flights that remain charge what they can. If there was a demand, then someone would either start offering a connector flight from PUJ, or another flight to POP from wherever the demand is.

What I am missing that the business owners look at me as if I'm from space when I say this?

It kind of fits the cultural rhetoric...... it is not our ( anybody you can think of, gvt officials, buisness owners, etc.....) fault tourists dont come back to the NC, it is their fault ( anybody elses except the chosen our ).
 

william webster

Platinum
Jan 16, 2009
30,247
4,329
113
I doubt it's the airport fees by themselves. Airlines fly in here now. They're making a profit or they wouldn't do it.

The problem is the aging infrastructure, crappy roads, aging AI's, sewage smell everywhere you go, AI's and hotels raising prices to make up for less traffic, and less traffic becuse of the prices being raised.

The gov't is improving roads, educating about the garbage everywhere, and beginning to advertise the NC. But it ain't going to happen overnight.

definitely not the fees alone...
that is an amateur's approach to the problem

PC offers more, better for less or the same...
when people flock... air prices drop

Witness El Catey & JetBlue
JetBlue didn't abandon the DR.... just a low traffic airport

They moved the flight to PC
More $$per seat per mile... which is how airlines live or die

NYC - AZS was a great flight -- rarely full but they had to drop the price so far it became unprofitable
 

dv8

Gold
Sep 27, 2006
31,266
363
0
i really do not think it's the airport fees as such. no matter what people say about the numbers of snowbirds and puta chasers flocking to the NC - they are only a drop in the total numbers of tourists arriving to DR. the vast majority of people come here for a brainless fry-in-the-sun holiday. they stay in all inclusive hotels and they stick to them throughout their stay with little more than an occasional excursion. NC has a slim offer for those tourists so there are less flights. it does not attract business travelers either since most major businesses and agencies are located in SD. and NC does not have facilities for holding large conferences either.

so granted, each european flight i took from/to POP was full to the brim but it was always a type of once/twice a week connection. PUJ and SDQ serve few such flights a day. i guess it makes more sense to keep the connections that are most profitable in terms of regular management of flight crews, planes and so on. i'm sure there are folks here like beeza who know ins and outs of such operations and can comment further on the subject.
 

wrecksum

Bronze
Sep 27, 2010
2,063
96
48
So if there was demand for POP, someone would organize a shuttle flight to PUJ
It's been tried a few times.
I think the main problem is that airlines run on punctuality.

Everything and every employee has to be in the right place at the right time,from pilots to passengers,handlers, check in staff,flight attendants,ground staff,fuellers,maintenance staff,functioning ground equipment etc.etc..
All the documents have to be strictly completed and up-to-date and airport and operating fees paid on time.

In a country which does not have a culture of timekeeping the result is usually chaos.
 

Cdn_Gringo

Gold
Apr 29, 2014
8,671
1,133
113
Lots of factors at play that make the North Coast less attractive the the travel companies and thus lowers the demand for an airline to service the route. In part, are the fees charged at POP. The airport's costs are fixed. If lots of flights to spread those costs around, then overall the fee per flight could be lower. If less flights, the obviously those fees have to be higher per flight.

Which comes first the flight or the tour package?
 

KyleMackey

Bronze
Apr 20, 2015
3,126
848
113
POP and PUJ had similar or the same landing fees last time I checked. It was a few years ago. Similar to Montego and probably the highest in the Caribbean.