Ways of Losing Dominican Citizenship

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Alltimegreat

Guest
Has anyone heard of naturalized Dominicans having been stripped of citizenship for seemingly unjustified reasons?

I spoke with a friend now living in the DR who said he's heard of several cases where the Dominican government "arbitrarily" determined that the naturalized Dominicans had not obtained citizenship the correct way years ago, and they were not permitted to renew their cédulas or passports upon expiration.

I find it hard to believe that this story is accurate, but it concerned me enough to create this post.
 
W

william webster

Guest
I don't doubt it...given the debacle w/ Windy's cedula -- and others

The system had no integrity a while back
Nefarious dealings/applications - actually 'FAKES'

Hate to see that happen but seems to be unfolding now
 
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william webster

Guest
look it up-- he was disqualified for a false cedula... after 22 yrs (?)
 
C

cavok

Guest
Any country will take away your citizenship if they determine it was obtained fraudently.
 
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Matilda

Guest
I have not heard of any cases - maybe some who were convicted of crimes?

Matilda
 
A

Alltimegreat

Guest
I have not heard of any cases - maybe some who were convicted of crimes?

Matilda

That's probably what happened.

I was just checking if anyone here was aware of arbitrary citizenship revocations targeting law-abiding Americans/Europeans where the alleged "fraud" is attributed to some innocuous technicality.

This guy seemed to be suggesting that, but he could not provide any evidence to support that claim.
 
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william webster

Guest
it was at that point he learned his cedula was invalid
 
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MariaRubia

Guest
A friend of mine is going thru gender reassignment - Male to Female - and she has been refused by Migracion to renew her cedula even though her country has changed her gender on her passport. She has lived her quite a long time and I know it's becoming a big drama with lots of attorneys and embassy people involved.
 
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Sosua Sonny

Guest
A friend of mine is going thru gender reassignment - Male to Female - and she has been refused by Migracion to renew her cedula even though her country has changed her gender on her passport. She has lived her quite a long time and I know it's becoming a big drama with lots of attorneys and embassy people involved.

Why would someone do this? Sounds like the work of the devil…
 
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Cdn_Gringo

Guest
Sounds like the way the DR Govt would handle this type of situation, so it doesn't surprise me. To this day and for many years before, lots of people suggested that the way to solve any problem here was to throw cash at it. Sure that may get you out of a traffic ticket or other minor inconvenience but following this advice when it comes to official processes and documents is fraught with peril.

There is a big difference between a traffic infraction and residency/citizenship applications. While it was and may still be possible to find a DGM employee who is prepared to smooth over the requirements and produce a valid looking identity card, sooner or later there is a good change that such a shortcut will invalidate the card and one's status going back to day 1. Yep, start all over even if it has been decades before the fraud was discovered. Worse, the applicant may not even be aware of the fraud. It's not unheard of here for unscrupulous lawyers/facilitators to fudge the process to make things easier for themselves and to deliver a successful outcome to those who would either have needed more documentation or might have been denied outright.

Citizenship based on fraudulent residency or as the case may have been years ago citizenship granted to an incomplete file or unqualified applicant isn't unheard of. It's a shame and a very real inconvenience for someone who for years has not suspected that anything is amiss with their immigration status. I mean who would think of problems after years of successful residency or cedula renewals?

But alas, anything is possible here especially when it comes to bureaucracy. One cannot assume that someone you hire to look out for your best interests will actually do that. You cannot assume that no issues this year with renewing your residency or cedula means no problems ever. Those who obtained immigration status in this country years ago may well find that some shenanigans were involved with their applications back in the day when graft and corruption was more rampant than it is today.

The moral of this story is that yes you can be bitten by the dog you never see. Yes it will be a p.i.a to correct. Those who deliberately try to circumvent the system for whatever reason should accept that someday they may be found out. Those that were taken advantage of unbeknownst to them by con artists posing as lawyers and corrupt DGM officials are in just as much difficulty as the former group. This is the DR. It is often hard to know for sure whats what and even harder to verify that.

I cannot see why we won't be hearing more of these stories as time goes on and DGM continues to update their computer systems. No matter how you frame it, a divide by zero error is still an error and the computer will always kick it out.
 
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CristoRey

Guest
I believe it could happen. Think about the way things should
be done in this country vs. the way they are actually done.
 
C

cavok

Guest
That's probably what happened.

I was just checking if anyone here was aware of arbitrary citizenship revocations targeting law-abiding Americans/Europeans where the alleged "fraud" is attributed to some innocuous technicality.

This guy seemed to be suggesting that, but he could not provide any evidence to support that claim.

An innocuous technicality could very well be preceived as possible fraud as it was much more common years ago to bribe officials to overlook "technicalities". Even if it is only some paperwork that was honestly done improperly or incompletely, I can still see them revoking citizenship and they, unfortunately, have every right to do so.

You need to get to the bottom of this. Keep calling. I've called them many times, although many times it took many attempts to get through. There's also a "service window" just inside the doors to DGM. You can try talking to them.

You will probably need a good lawyer. Choose wisely.
 
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chrisgy

Guest
Sounds like the way the DR Govt would handle this type of situation, so it doesn't surprise me. To this day and for many years before, lots of people suggested that the way to solve any problem here was to throw cash at it. Sure that may get you out of a traffic ticket or other minor inconvenience but following this advice when it comes to official processes and documents is fraught with peril.

There is a big difference between a traffic infraction and residency/citizenship applications. While it was and may still be possible to find a DGM employee who is prepared to smooth over the requirements and produce a valid looking identity card, sooner or later there is a good change that such a shortcut will invalidate the card and one's status going back to day 1. Yep, start all over even if it has been decades before the fraud was discovered. Worse, the applicant may not even be aware of the fraud. It's not unheard of here for unscrupulous lawyers/facilitators to fudge the process to make things easier for themselves and to deliver a successful outcome to those who would either have needed more documentation or might have been denied outright.

Citizenship based on fraudulent residency or as the case may have been years ago citizenship granted to an incomplete file or unqualified applicant isn't unheard of. It's a shame and a very real inconvenience for someone who for years has not suspected that anything is amiss with their immigration status. I mean who would think of problems after years of successful residency or cedula renewals?

But alas, anything is possible here especially when it comes to bureaucracy. One cannot assume that someone you hire to look out for your best interests will actually do that. You cannot assume that no issues this year with renewing your residency or cedula means no problems ever. Those who obtained immigration status in this country years ago may well find that some shenanigans were involved with their applications back in the day when graft and corruption was more rampant than it is today.

The moral of this story is that yes you can be bitten by the dog you never see. Yes it will be a p.i.a to correct. Those who deliberately try to circumvent the system for whatever reason should accept that someday they may be found out. Those that were taken advantage of unbeknownst to them by con artists posing as lawyers and corrupt DGM officials are in just as much difficulty as the former group. This is the DR. It is often hard to know for sure whats what and even harder to verify that.

I cannot see why we won't be hearing more of these stories as time goes on and DGM continues to update their computer systems. No matter how you frame it, a divide by zero error is still an error and the computer will always kick it out.

6 paragraphs of not much help, you sure do like to write.
 
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Sosua Sonny

Guest
6 paragraphs of not much help, you sure do like to write.

I for one enjoy reading his posts. They are well thought out and executed. In case you are unaware that is what forums are for.

What is your contribution?