Demonic Males: Apes and the Origins of Human Violence

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Golo100

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Richard Wranghams' new book on why agressive, big mouth, insensitive, arrogant men like some in DR1 are so successful with women, unlike corteous, gentlemenlike sentisitive flower-carrying twerps, has now started to bother Dominican feminists.

Wranham's ideas that the reason these rough boys are the ideal men women are really looking for goes back to the beginning of the ape. It seems women are just following their primate ancestors, who stuck to their macho gorillas instead of hanging around weak apes and getting annihilated with them. Females always looked for protection and only a strong arrogant male could provide it. So the typical ideal man which women always profess is just a myth.

Dominican men are the best example. The rough, sometimes physically unattractive guys have it all, while the good looking, sensitive, sophisticated boys get the ugly ones or turn gay.

It is a simple case of natural selection. Only the strong survives.
Wrangham takes it even beyond that. He claims that human violence is a result of this instinct to survive over the anything else. That explains why Dominican men act the way they are and why a record number of women are getting beat up and killed. Some men have even taking it to the extremes in their quest for survival of the fittest and are turning into animals.

Of course, there is a new breed of the ape man whose sophistication nowadays comes from power, in addition to natural instincts.

TW
 

Criss Colon

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Not "Politically Correct",but "Really Correct"!

Except I can't agree that anyone can "Turn Gay"! You either are,or you aren't in my book! Now you will be called a racist,and worse,but they will be wrong!

Studies of African apes show that each troop has adominant male.Only the dominant male is allowed to mate with the females in the troop.If any of the submissive males attempt to mate,they are rejected by the females,and "beaten"by the dominant male!

If a male from another troop arrives he is courted by all the females in the troop,and the dominant male,who violently attacks any male members of his troop who get near any females,"looks the other way", while the "New Guy" has sex with the females of the troop.Why,inorder to diversify the gene pool! This is the reason why a "foreign Guy" is found to be so "Sexy" when he arrives in a country.The women instinctively know that it is always a good idea to "diversify the gene pool"!Doesn't matter if the "Foreign Guy" is old, fat or ugly,he is still going to "SCORE"!

You better not mess with Mother Nature!CCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCcccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccc
 

OwnRules

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Nothing new here -- just someone else promulgating Social Darwinism (Herbert Spencer) and the usual suspects agreeing with him.

Not surprised really, as I've already seen Golo advocate eugenics in that trainwrecked Haitian thread.

Don't know about the rest of you, but I certainly don't need to go around beating on other 'apes' to get laid, nor do I need to treat anyone like sh*t in order to do so. Not sure what planet you guys live in, but it definately ain't the one I am in.

As for "turning gay"...well, I am glad to see Criss has already disavowed that particular piece of ignorant tripe.
 
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Chris

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.Quoted from Golo's post..

So the typical ideal man which women always profess is just a myth.

No, the man is not a myth. The man is also not an ape and neither is he a pig. Strong and arrogant does not necessarily denote ape-like violent behaviour.

Did not read the book Golo and I'm not gonna read the book. Also don't live on The Planet of the Apes.
 

Larry

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Golo

I agree with your post except for the concept of the "instinct to survive" carrying over into beating up and killing women.I dont get that part.Also the turning gay part like Cris pointed out.Besides that,women are definately more attracted to stronger,dominant personalities.Its natural.
Larry
 

Pib

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Re: Golo

[B]Larry (ILoveDR)[/B] said:
women are definately more attracted to stronger,dominant personalities.Its natural.
I would agree with this insofar as we agree that "stronger and 'dominant personalities'" is the opposite of insecure and inmature. The truth IMO can be said about men's taste.
 

mondongo

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golo, CC....you guys are full of it this time...let me ask you..who has the most beautiful women hanging on their arms.... 1)rich, powerful guys....or 2) loud-mouthed, uneducated goons? of course, there is no contetst..

another question: which species has evolved to be dominant? 1) apes, 2) humanoids?......which species is physically stronger? which is smarter......ok....there is your answer.

if you want to be part of the winning evolution team.....side with the smart guys...sure, i admit that you have to be agrresive also...but go sit around the gym with the iron-pumping buffoons and you be left in the Darwin dust.

sprinkle a little fact with a lot of fiction and even you can fool some of the people some of the time....so keep up the interesting fiction....the part about killing and beating women is tasteless even for this crowd.
 

Larry

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Mar 22, 2002
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mondongo

You see women with rich powerful guys because they know the money he has will give them a better lifestyle.You also see girls marry docile guys and guys with malleable personalities because the women know that these guys will make easy agreeable husbands.However,when a woman feels an atraction,when she feels RAW sexual energy toward a man it is 99% of the time attraction to strength,swagger,confidence....a dominant take charge man.Same as in the animal kingdom,our primitive instincts come through.
Larry
 
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There's nothing wrong with strong, dominant men, a lot of women find these traits attractive. But there's a hell of a lot of difference between that and a violent man. I for one would not tolerate any violence in a relationship, if a man ever hit me he would only do it once because I'd be gone.

If you ask me, comparing a violent man to the apes and gorillas is an attempt to justify violence in a relationship. I just don't see how it can ever be justified. If you love someone, why would you want to physically hurt them? And if you do want to hurt them, it ain't love.
 

Criss Colon

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Maybe we should all take an "Oath"?

"I hearby swear that if I am going to respond to a "Post",I have read the post at least 3 times,I think I grasp the authors point of view,I will respond to what is in the post and not to my "Spin" as to what is in the post!" SO HELP ME "ROBERT!"

"Own Rules",would you like to sign the "PLEDGE"? CCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCc
 

Golo100

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Some explanations

I did not by any means try to justify violence against women, but to explain why Dominican men are so violent. In terms of the macho man women prefer, I did not mean the Gold Gyms creations or beach bums. Those guys are the softest "maricones" of manhood.

Muscles are not what this theory is talking about. At least, using today's men standards, it takes more than physical strenght. It is a combination of arrogance, smarts and self-confidence which leads a man to be almost independent and being able to trace his own destiny.

Those who believe power and money are not the essence of this, just have to look at the results. Those who have power and money are the same men the author is talking about...the rulers of earth....those who possess the control and wealth of the economies of their respective lands...the 20% that suppresses the other 80% and makes them work for them.

TW
 

AnnaC

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The difference between humans and apes is that God gave humans a brain.(well some) It's ok to be aggressive and arrogant in dealing with the world but not to your mate ape. If I read the report right it says that male apes beat other weeker male apes in order to get the females. They didn't beat up the female apes and then have sex with them.
 
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Tony C

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Anna Coniglio said:
The difference between humans and apes is that God gave humans a brain.(

Darwin would debate that point.


Any man who would hit a woman out of spite is not a man but a sub-human. I have no tolerance for it and I have intervened personally on more than one occaision.
That being said I must wonder about some of these "Victims". I have heard the whole "Cycle of Violence" theory and it does not wash with me. What about common sense? I have heard many times women stating that by beating her it shows he cares. How can anybody be that stupid?
 
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Personally, I can't understand that sort of attitude from women, but I know first hand that it exists. I do some volunteer work for the Samaritans and have spoken to many many women whose men beat them, or abuse them in other ways, but they still stick with them. Mostly it's out of misplaced loyalty - he's my husband, he's entitled to - or more often, out of sheer fear that if they try to stand up to him he'll do something worse, either to them or the kids. It's an uphill struggle trying to get these women to understand that they are victims, and that they don't have to put up with it.
 

Criss Colon

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Lets not foget the impact of "Economic Bondage"!

A woman with 2 or 3 kids,no job skills,and a drunk wife beater for a husband has few opportunities in life! (This can be in the DR,or anyplace on earth!)She was more than likely raised in a house with an abusive father as well! Human Nature is hard to overcome,and we tend to opt for the "Status Quo" rather than change! Better the "Devil" you know,than the "Devil" you don't know thing!!
Sadly,young boys learn to be abusive,and young girls to accept abuse whre they grow up!
Got to intervene early if you expect to make a difference! Not much hope of that here in the DR!CCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCc
 

rizzo

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I had an older, half sister, now passed on, that is a perfect example of bad choices in men. Married 3 times and all 3 were identical in that they were hard drinkers and wife beaters. My sister was a fairly attractive woman with her own business and certainly didn't need anyone's support. I saw first hand the black eyes, swollen face, and on occasion, brief hospitalizations. I even intervened couple of times because I was in my sisters home when the shit hit the fan. But in every case she would always go back to these guys, and when they split she would invariably choose another with these same sad qualities. So after seeing this up close I have to say that there is a particular type of woman that simply wouldn't have it any other way. Only interested in the bad boys and NICE GUYS need not apply....
 

OwnRules

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Re: Maybe we should all take an "Oath"?

Criss Colon said:
"I hearby swear that if I am going to respond to a "Post",I have read the post at least 3 times,I think I grasp the authors point of view,I will respond to what is in the post and not to my "Spin" as to what is in the post!" SO HELP ME "ROBERT!"

"Own Rules",would you like to sign the "PLEDGE"? CCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCc

Sure. I'll do that as soon as you stop spouting sound-bites and generalities filtered through your own biases.

In the meantime, I stand by my original post. Namely that this a rehash of the old Nature Vs Nurture debate -- a debate that still rages on in the scientific community today and one that has no absolute and/or simple answers.

On one end you have evolutionary psychologist/sociobiologists who claim that we're basically genetic/memetic coding with little room for freewill, and on the other, "clean slate" proponents who claim we're a product of our environment -- with most reputable scientist falling somewhere in between.

Not surprisingly, that's where you'll find Richard Wrangham. His views are quite a bit more complex than Golo lets on in his OP -- yes he writes about an evolutionary predisposition for violence amongst male homo-sapiens, but he is also keenly aware of the analytical capabilities that allow us to control/overcome those impulses. You're welcomed to look it up. Oh, and by the way, his book is not "new" at all -- unless 1996 is considered "new" by Dominican publishing standards.

Here's an interesting interview with the author:Are Human Males Violent by Nature?

So, as you can see, this whole issue, while fascinating, is far from being as cut and dried as you and Golo are making it out to be. And if you, in particular, care to stay away from taking cheap shots for a laugh or two, perhaps it's worth discussing further.

Your call.
 

AnnaC

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Question for rizzo. What kind of a home was your half sister raised in? Was there any male violence in it? Just trying to gather info for my own knowledge .
 

Tony C

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Are human males violent by nature?
Before you ask that you must define what is violent behavior.

If I see a guy beating a woman on the street and I intervene physically does that make me violent?

If some stranger breaks into my house and I greet them with 230 grains of .45 FMJ am I being violent?

Is physically defending oneself violent?
 

rizzo

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Anna the home was fairly normal, she was raised by her father and step=mom, no violence that I recall. She was little bit on the wild side, left home at an early age, ran off & got married to bad boy #1. I could never understand it, even to this day...
 
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