Bocas vs DR

Shauna

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Aug 25, 2003
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I just found a thread from DR! from someone called Neil Thomas who was considering moving to the DR from Bocas. I would like to ask him a question or two, or anyone else for that matter. I lived in the DR from about 1989-1997 on and off in the North Coast. Now I have a small family with dogs and I am considering going to Bocas....anyone have anything? Please email me. Thanks.
 

Escott

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Jan 14, 2002
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Bocas del Toro, Panama...

Why someone would move there is beyond me. 2 full days travel to enter or leave. Makes it tough to travel!

I Like being 7 minutes to the airport that has a direct flight to NY.

Escott
 

AlaninDR

Mr. Chunky Skin
Dec 17, 2002
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Even though I still have interests there, there isn't much to do besides drink. The national brand is Panama and it in no way compares to Presidente. Like Scott said, takes a while to get there. Panama City and then a puddle jumper (Shorts Skyvan) to Bocas. The irritating part is that you must change airports for the in country flight. It's a nice place to visit but i'm not a pure alcoholic (yet) so I need a bit more variety in things to do other than look at very over priced real estate.
 

Shauna

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Aug 25, 2003
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panama1

I am using this forum because someone from Bocas is considering moving to the DR and had posted messages here. There was a ton of great responses. I have not been to Panama but have spent many years in both the DR and St. Lucia. I wanted to hear what people living in the DR had to say about Bocas del Toro. Thank you all for your imput, it really does help but I guess the best idea is to go for myself!
 

andy a

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Feb 23, 2002
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Within the last year or so, some prestigious organization (don't remember who) rated Panama as the BEST place to live in all of Latin America.

I don't know why, and I was very surprised. I'm very skeptical about such reports, but there might be a little reason for it.

I've never been there.
 

Shauna

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Aug 25, 2003
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Bocas...

Currently I am living on a small island in the west coast of Canada but want to return to Latin America. Feel like I should move on from the DR and try other places so CR and Panama seem like good places. I would love to go back to the DR, I have family and a house there but my other half isn't into it...so I am looking for other spots. I like to hear what other people living in the DR think, it gives some sort of common thread on which to consider things. My time has been spent in Puerto Plata, Cofresi and Imbert so I guess that would be my comparison...thanks all!
 

juancarlos

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Sep 28, 2003
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andy a said:
Within the last year or so, some prestigious organization (don't remember who) rated Panama as the BEST place to live in all of Latin America.

I don't know why, and I was very surprised. I'm very skeptical about such reports, but there might be a little reason for it.

I've never been there.

I just found this old thread, but I was reading the same thing yesterday. They said Panama has the lowest crime rate in Lat. Amer., that tap water is drinkable, the US$ is the national currency and that it is very modern.

I am sure some DR1 people have visited or lived in the DR and in Panama. What are the main differences? The big minus that I would see in Panama City is the high humidity and heat all year long. It is my understanding, from what I have read and heard from residents, that at least in Sto. Domingo it cools down a bit in December or January, but not in Panama. Still, Panama has not yet become either a major tourist destination like Costa Rica and DR or a favorite expat. choice, like those two counrtries.
 

abe

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Jan 2, 2002
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Bocas--an impression from a quick visit

I have spent an aggregate of many months on the North Coast of the DR in the last five years. I was in Bocas on a "fact-finding" mission to Panama in May of this year. I was only in Bocas one day, but got the following impressions: of all the places in Panama that we visited, Bocas was the only one where I felt I was about to be swindled at every turn. Real estate hawkers would come up to you at restaurants--not timeshare marketers selling "tours", but people trying to get you in front of realtors with investments. Bogus, according to a lot of research I did prior to getting there. Some real bad guys are in Bocas, as opposed to what appeared to be well-intentioned real estate people (if that's not an oxymoron) in other Panama hot spots. Bocas also is very rainy, but that doesn't detract from its physical beauty. I love the water orientation of the place, and it's indeed international, but there was something palpably smarmy about the place. Forgive me, but there were a lot of self-proclaimed "crackers" from the States there, waving the cracker flag and seeking out like minds to form their little NASCAR and NFL worshipping groups there.

Now, there are plenty of bad guys and self-isolating ex-pats in the DR too--of every stripe--but in Bocas it seemed pretty hard to get away from the aura of fastbuck ripoff because the place is so isolated. There were plenty of far more comfortable places in Panama, in my opinion.

The other factor that's very clear is that the history of Bocas makes English a far more prominent language there than in almost any other part of the country. Forgive my broad brush again, but that could mean that people who have no real intention to try to assimilate or at least respect a new home enough to learn the language will seek out Bocas so they can just speak English.

I really liked Panama as a whole--the capital is vibrant, there are great beach and mountain towns not too far away, the natural attractions are far superior to DR's as far as wildlife is concerned, the infrastructure really works (read: no blackouts), and it's clearly a stable place.

You cannot beat the DR for its people, in my opinion, but the Panamanians were very very nice as well.

That's my 2 Bolivars worth of info--and yes, a small helping of opinionated observations that I may live to regret given the nature of this board sometimes. Oh, well!
 

juancarlos

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Sep 28, 2003
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Abe, when you compare Sto. Domingo and Panama City, how different or similar are they? Also, the heat and humidity, is it worse or or is it the same as in the DR? How about crime?
 

abe

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Santo Domingo vs Panama City

To my regret I never spent any time in Santo Domingo, but here's what I can tell you about PC. It has a colonial section, Casco Viejo, that is no where near as restored as la zona in SD nor Old San Juan. But it is on its way to being reclaimed.

My sense is that PC is more efficient by far than SD with no blackouts, etc. There is a major development project underway featuring hotels, convention centers, even a building or two by Frank Gehry, the acclaimed architect.

I don't have any hard numbers re: crime and can't comment on it, other than there are so many financial entities centered in PC that the city must be motivated to keep it as safe as it can be.

The areas of Panama near the water are hot and humid, yes. But the ability to retreat to the mountains fairly easily (for a certain class of resident, of course) is helpful. PC residents regularly go to the Causeway for breezes and to escape the city. This causeway links the small islands that line the Pacific entrance to the canal. It features restaurants, clubs, a Smithsonian nature center, shopping, etc. and looks back onto the city. Fun for biking, strolling, pedicabs, etc.

I really don't know enough about SD to comment much further.
 

NALs

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Jan 20, 2003
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andy a said:
Within the last year or so, some prestigious organization (don't remember who) rated Panama as the BEST place to live in all of Latin America.

I don't know why, and I was very surprised. I'm very skeptical about such reports, but there might be a little reason for it.

I've never been there.
I know that the real estate market in Panama City suffered a bit after the US handed over the canal to Panama, but that was a while ago.

Anyways, maybe they meant you get a good real estate bang for the buck?
 

NALs

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In my opinion, the biggest difference between Panama City and Santo Domingo is population size.

Panama City has way less people than SDQ has (after all, in Central America only Mexico City and Guadalajara has more people than SDQ). As such, certain problems that exist in SDQ due to high population density are less so in Panama city.

Overall, Panama city is a very comfortable modern city. It has a sort of Miami look and feel in certain areas and an impressive skyline. In short, its very first world. Overall, very nice.

The only problems that I found with Panama City is the humidity and heat and the tendency of raining for ever at times (at least it seems that way during rainy season).

Also, in my opinion, Santo Domingo is much more alive than Panama City, though Panama City is quite alive, more or less.

These two cities have many similarities as well. Both are within striking distance of mountains, beaches, etc. Both have an economy wide enough to offer just about anything you want, both cities offer any lifestyle - at a price.

There is just something about Santo Domingo that makes it "better" in my opinion. I don't know what it is, but its something.
 

juancarlos

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Sep 28, 2003
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Nal0whs said:
In my opinion, the biggest difference between Panama City and Santo Domingo is population size.

Panama City has way less people than SDQ has (after all, in Central America only Mexico City and Guadalajara has more people than SDQ). As such, certain problems that exist in SDQ due to high population density are less so in Panama city.

Overall, Panama city is a very comfortable modern city. It has a sort of Miami look and feel in certain areas and an impressive skyline. In short, its very first world. Overall, very nice.

The only problems that I found with Panama City is the humidity and heat and the tendency of raining for ever at times (at least it seems that way during rainy season).

Also, in my opinion, Santo Domingo is much more alive than Panama City, though Panama City is quite alive, more or less.

These two cities have many similarities as well. Both are within striking distance of mountains, beaches, etc. Both have an economy wide enough to offer just about anything you want, both cities offer any lifestyle - at a price.

There is just something about Santo Domingo that makes it "better" in my opinion. I don't know what it is, but its something.

You are right about the population density issue; the DR's National District alone has Panama's entire population, more or less, since Panama has about three million or less in the entire nation. PC is certainly the most densely populated urban area in Panma. You say Sto. Domingo is a very alive city, do you mean there are people walking the streets at night outside the Colonial Zone and the Malecon, or is the activity pretty much restricted to daytime hours?

It also seems to me there are more hotels in Sto. Domingo and at more affordable prices. That may be because DR gets far more tourists, it is its main industry.
 

NALs

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Jan 20, 2003
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!

You are right about the population density issue; the DR's National District alone has Panama's entire population, more or less, since Panama has about three million or less in the entire nation. PC is certainly the most densely populated urban area in Panma.
That is true. To give you an idea of how much the DR population has grown, the last time the DR had 3 million people was in the first half of the 1900s. Even when Trujillo died the population was rather small (around 4 million nationwide and Santo Domingo had around 250,000 people, that was in 1961).
By the 1970s, the country had around 6 million and the city had around 1 million people! What an increase!

Today, of course, the DR has around 8-9 million and SDQ has around 3 million.

I would argue that if the major economic advances the DR would have taken place while the population would had grown way slower than it has, the DR would have been much much wealthier today overall than it currently is.

You say Sto. Domingo is a very alive city, do you mean there are people walking the streets at night outside the Colonial Zone and the Malecon, or is the activity pretty much restricted to daytime hours?
The activity in SDQ is never restricted, lets put it that way. This city always has something going at anytime (blackout or not). We have lots of Casinos, bars, restaurants, nightclubs, the full mambo jambo. This is the most exciting city in the Caribbean (literally) and even Conde Nast Traveler Magazine last year wrote an article on SDQ stating that "SDQ is given San Juan and even Miami a tough competition as the most happening city in Latin America". I'll try to get a link to the article.

In short, SDQ is much more varied that PC, but that is mostly due to its larger population and economy. SDQ produces 40% of the GDP of the DR, depending on the sources SDQ produces either $19.2 billion or $8.4 billion, either way its alot and the most produced in any 400 square mile area in the entire island, if not the entire Caribbean. SDQ has a higher per capita income than the rest of the nation overall, etc. Its a full fledge metropolis, however by the beginning of the 1990s, SDQ was a different deal all together, it changed during the economic boom of the 1990s.

It also seems to me there are more hotels in Sto. Domingo and at more affordable prices. That may be because DR gets far more tourists, it is its main industry.
Well, Santo Domingo ranks around 3 in tourist popularity among the DR destinations. In my opinion that is due because we don't have a beach, once we build one (whenever that is), SDQ will become much more touristy than it currently is. Much of today's tourism is concentrated in the Colonial Zone and Malecon area. Those areas make up less than 2% of the entire city!

SDQ has a lot of everything. There are many affordable hotels, but there are also plenty of hotels where $200 a night is the norm also, it all depends on what you want. From glitz and glamour to dredgy box construction motels in an industrial area, we got it.

Also, about the blackouts, the wealthier areas of the city now have electricity 24 hours a day most of the days, things are getting back to pre-hippo era.
 

Chirimoya

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Dec 9, 2002
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I haven't read through all this very carefully, so forgive me if I am repeating what has already been said. I agree that Santo Domingo and Panama City have some general similarities. A big difference that puts SD ahead of PC would be security.

When I was in Panama (admittedly aeons ago) people would come up to me in the street and warn me not to walk down certain streets because it was too dangerous. This was not in some out of the way slum but in the area near the old city (equivalent to SD's ZC). Ditto in Colon (the city on the other end of the Panama Canal, not the DR1 poster ;) ).

This has never happened to me anywhere else in the world and believe me I have been to some armpits in my time. Nothing actually happened to me, and for all I know things may have changed since I visited so YMMV, as they say.

Apart from that I loved Panama. Unspoilt, varied, friendly and colourful, but I didn't stay there long enough to be able to compare it to the DR.