If locked up by the police...

Chris_NJ · Jan 10, 2004

My question is about the consequences of being locked up by Sosua police.

Here is why I am wondering:
My girlfriend (who owns a small bar in Sosua) just called me crying about an incident that happened to her tonight.

While standing outside the bar she noticed a sankie inside the bar who had come with a tourist that he "befriended." The guy looked suspicious so my girlfriend approached him and asked what he wanted. The guy said juice so she went down in the frigde to get it. The guy then said he would drink it later and left on a motoconcho. Right after he left, my girlfriend noticed her cell phone was missing. She soon concluded the sankie must have reached behind the bar and taken it while she was getting the stupid juice.

My girlfriend was enraged so she closed her bar (can she file a claim for business interuption - just kidding) and was able to track down the sankie thief. An argument ensued as the sankie denied everything and the police came to the commotion. The tourist was still around so the police (Sosua police, not Politur) assumed that my girlfriend and the sankie were working together to scam the tourist. The police were very to taking my girlfriend to the jail, but fortunately she was able to explain what happened.

My question is - if something like this happens and the police get stubborn and take her to jail - what are her rights? is she immediately considered "arrested" and guilty until proven innocent? Would she have some kind of police record? (which would not be good if you read my previous post of her planning to study in US). And I don't even want to think about them sexually assaulting her or something.

I assume the legal/police system in DR has a lot of grey/fishy areas, but any knowledge about this would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Chris

Tom F. · Jan 10, 2004

reputation and money count at this time.

NALs · Jan 10, 2004

I heard once that the Dominican Republic has a Napoleonic Code. I know the educational system works under that code but I'm not too sure if the judicial system works that way with the rights and everything. If so, that means that you are guilty until proven innocent. Thank Napoleon of France for that code and the corrupt politicians in "the Capital".

simpson Homer · Jan 10, 2004

answer and Question

She is not getting a police record because they might toke her to the police station for investigation. The only thing that can make a little bit complicated the story is she knowing the guy for long time and also the he visitting her place so often.

What happen with the tourist ?

Was your girlfriend to the police station to report her cellphone as lost?

who was the first one to go to the police station?

Homer Simpson

mkohn · Jan 10, 2004

_NJ
Might be a good idea to let her handle it on her own. She's got more b*&&s than most people.
It's human nature to want to protect a loved one. In this case, she's a fish in familiar water. Most liberated too.
Your emotional support is what I would want. And of course major kudos to her to validate her quick thinking.
mk

Chris_NJ · Jan 10, 2004

I just talked with my girlfriend so I can clarify a little.

First, she did not know the sankie at all - he just happened to come off the street with the tourist.

No, she didn't report phone stolen as she has a general mistrust of the police and their ability to accomplish anything so she and her bartender tracked down the sankie.

The police came themselves to check out the argument. The police told the sankie to walk by himself to the police station but the 2 girls (my g/f and her camarera) would be taken to the station for investigation of trying to rob the tourist. My g/f believes the sankie must have paid off the police because he obviously never walked anywhere but to commit his next pathetic act of deception.

So, to recap:
-my g/f didn't report it stolen
-she was the 1 one to the station (but as a suspect not a victim)
-nothing happened to the tourist except the sankie gave the phone back to him who returned it to my g/f).

my conclusion:

the policeman was looking for bribes, the sankie is a loser, and they both should be strung up from the highest tree in DR by their cojones.

AnnaC · Jan 10, 2004

Question
Has anyone asked for money?

Chris_NJ · Jan 11, 2004

No one formally asked my girlfriend for money - it was more implied.

Criss Colon · Jan 11, 2004

Ok Chris-NJ" time to tell you what we are all thinking!

You are being "Played" by your so called "Girlfriend"! Don't be too upset,we have all been there too! To many of your "stories"that your girlfriend tells you are what we call the "Tried And True" way to get even more money from you! Most include the girlfriend being the "Victim" of some problem! (Always remember,it is NEVER a Dominicans fault!)"Sick Relatives" are also a favorite!The stolen cell phone has "Wiskers"! Funny how the "Charger" is alway stolen too,even if the charger was at home,and the "theft" in the "Colmado"!

You sound like a nice guy,maybe Too Nice! My bet goes down of the side of this girl taking you for all she can!! This is after looking at your posts for some time.I wanted to say something when you first disclosed the "Bar In Sosua" idea.Sort of like selling "Sand At The Beach"!!! Nobody needs yet another bar,doing no business in Sosua!!

Watch your back,you sound like a victim! Cris Colon "Former Victim"

Robert · Jan 11, 2004

Thread moved to Open - General.

If she is a bar owner, I'm sure she knows the cops and has had experience with these type of situations.

Sounds to me like someone is getting played...

Adrian Bye · Jan 11, 2004

She got the cellphone back, right? So it wasn't stolen.

However, the girlfriend owns a bar in Sosua. Therefore there is a 99.8% chance Chris_NJ is not the only one she's with.

Stephen · Jan 11, 2004

Another Tip

Chris,

I was waiting for someone to voice what you did. It's the same old same old.

Another good tip: Always mark on your calendar everytime they try to hit you up for some help buying a birthday present or something like that. It's amazing how many birthdays someones mother or father has in the dominican in one year.

Also mark down deaths. They have quite a few grandmothers and grandfather's too..... and you'll lose track after a while if you don't make notes!

Chris_NJ · Jan 11, 2004

Thank you all for your concern that she is trying to hit me up for money. I have heard it all before as soon as I mention that I have a girlfriend in Sosua - everyone assumes they want money, they want visas, they want your baby, etc. And most probably do.

The problem with that is that she knows I will never send her a dime - no matter how many times her grandfather dies. I have been 100% clear with her from the beginning - I will not have a girlfriend who needs me for material objects. She knows she will be financially independent or she will not be with me. Period. I will not have a standard Sosua sugar daddy relationship. There will be no serious consideration of marriage etc until she graduates university (and like I wrote before preferrably here in US). We both know that marriage is a serious commitment and that NOBODY (her, her parents, whoever) will pressure me to do anything that I am not 100% ready to.

That is why after 1 year together I felt we had enough trust for me to invest something in her so I sent agreed to sell her jewlery (I sent her the money after I received her UPS of 1000 necklaces which I have already about broken even on and stand to make 5000 to 7000 dollars profit). I knew she had to do something to get ahead so I agreed to work with her like this - my advice and emotional support is certainly worth more than any money that I could scrape up to send her. That expression of teaching someone to fish and they can eat for life applies.

As far as Sosua not needing another bar - probably true - I always wondered how all those bars stay in business until I did the math. By averaging sales of just 40 drinks/day she can clear 20, 000 pesos/month of profit (certainly not making a killing by American standards, but I doubt there are any other 19 year old non-prostitutes in Sosua who can bring that amount home.

So, I am well off the original topic and apparently not a concise writer, but I don't mind a little cynisim or responding to it.

Bobs · Jan 11, 2004

RD Cops....... Ley y Orden.... NOT ! (long)

I've just returned from a (shortened) 12-day visit to the DR, staying with friends at a house in the SanCarlos barrio SD, very near president Hippo's palace. From my dorm and the sitting room I had a clear view of everything that ever went on at the destacamento (policestation). I should explain that I observed everything with a particular private interest, being a command officer in the Dutch police. There were everyday interactions with the public, with the occasional mass raid to round up illegals. What I noticed was a total lack of command line, discipline, social skills, procedure, etc.. One time I definitely saw pesos being given and a recent detainee then promptly released. Relatives coming to assist detainees with food or making inquiries, made to stand hours in the sun, pouring rain and some frosty december evenings, while the cops sat spreadeagle under a roof watching them. I saw a pregnant wife/gf being struck in the face twice hard, while she was just shouting support to her man being dragged in ("te amo, estoy aqui, el abogado biene"). Young girls were always being (sexually) harrased. Trust me, I know the difference between a pirropo and a grope. More than once did I see police-goons kicking and fisting a man in cuffs. One day a group of 5 (five!) elderly men were put in the back of a small Toyota, two escorting officers cramped in on the front seat and a driver, off they went to the palacio, DR HQ.
My officers are not squeeky clean, but any of these occurences in Holland, would lead to cops being disciplined or arrested at once on site.
My advise is simple : Keep your interactions with the DR police to an absolute minimum, or befriend some police or defense brass (same difference) or get to know an agressive abogado. Allways have someone contact your consulate or embassy pronto if you do get harassed or arrested !
A democratic society should have the army defending the country and the police protecting the public..... here the two are interlaced, cops (PN) and defence people (FA) mingle freely. My mistake to think that the RD was a democracy.
Almost all the cops just put on what T-shirt they fancied that day and stuck their sidearm in their belt. With the rare exception, all sidearms were nickelplated. I believe it was Gen. George S. Patton (Ol' Blood and Guts) that said that only New Orleans pimps carry nickelplated pistols. ;-)
I appologize if I offended anyone in one of my earlier postings by saying that I had good hopes for the young PN command cadets I saw being trained. This was after talking to these young folks, during a courtesy visit to DR police brass two years ago.

Robert · Jan 11, 2004

Re: RD Cops....... Ley y Orden.... NOT ! (long)

Bobs said:
I've just returned from a (shortened) 12-day visit to the DR, staying with friends at a house in the SanCarlos barrio SD, very near president Hippo's palace. From my dorm and the sitting room I had a clear view of everything that ever went on at the destacamento (policestation). I should explain that I observed everything with a particular private interest, being a command officer in the Dutch police. There were everyday interactions with the public, with the occasional mass raid to round up illegals. What I noticed was a total lack of command line, discipline, social skills, procedure, etc.. One time I definitely saw pesos being given and a recent detainee then promptly released. Relatives coming to assist detainees with food or making inquiries, made to stand hours in the sun, pouring rain and some frosty december evenings, while the cops sat spreadeagle under a roof watching them. I saw a pregnant wife/gf being struck in the face twice hard, while she was just shouting support to her man being dragged in ("te amo, estoy aqui, el abogado biene"). Young girls were always being (sexually) harrased. Trust me, I know the difference between a pirropo and a grope. More than once did I see police-goons kicking and fisting a man in cuffs. One day a group of 5 (five!) elderly men were put in the back of a small Toyota, two escorting officers cramped in on the front seat and a driver, off they went to the palacio, DR HQ.
My officers are not squeeky clean, but any of these occurences in Holland, would lead to cops being disciplined or arrested at once on site.
My advise is simple : Keep your interactions with the DR police to an absolute minimum, or befriend some police or defense brass (same difference) or get to know an agressive abogado. Allways have someone contact your consulate or embassy pronto if you do get harassed or arrested !
A democratic society should have the army defending the country and the police protecting the public..... here the two are interlaced, cops (PN) and defence people (FA) mingle freely. My mistake to think that the RD was a democracy.
Almost all the cops just put on what T-shirt they fancied that day and stuck their sidearm in their belt. With the rare exception, all sidearms were nickelplated. I believe it was Gen. George S. Patton (Ol' Blood and Guts) that said that only New Orleans pimps carry nickelplated pistols. ;-)
I appologize if I offended anyone in one of my earlier postings by saying that I had good hopes for the young PN command cadets I saw being trained. This was after talking to these young folks, during a courtesy visit to DR police brass two years ago.

Your moral or ethical work values are really of no use here. This is the Dominican Republic, not the Netherlands.
This is how it's done here, for better or for worse, that's the reality.

Welcome to the wild west... It may not have clogs or tulips, but it's one hell of an interesting and fun place to live

gringosmooth · Jan 11, 2004

This is funny. Sosua is a small town and only one lady I know owns a small bar. Her name is C****n. That is, if we are not speaking of a beach bar.

If so, friend, you are being played big time. Ask her how she got the bar (money from a gringo, maybe you?)..Ask her how she got her car (money from a german). Hell, ask her how she got everything she owns....

Also Ask her why she won't go to certain restaraunts with you...and finally, grab your wallet and run for the hills....this girl is a prostitute and a long time player. She works multiple guys at once, always says she needs money because her daughter that lives in Santiago is ill, etc, etc etc. People getting to know you well yet down at your local Western Union office?

Oh yeah, she is pretty good in the sack too, and looks like a model.

Your girlriend? You mean your girlfriend also....

Chris_NJ · Jan 11, 2004

I am must be really bored today to respond this bs but if you read my previous posts you will see exactly where the money came from (and the name of the bar for that matter).

Also, she is 19, has no children, no car, and the bar just opened 2 months ago.

I may have been born in the morning but not this morning.

gringosmooth · Jan 11, 2004

sorry, wrong girl then.

good luck with your relationship, and heads up at all times. BTW, the other girl is only 23

Larry · Jan 11, 2004

OK Chris, is the girls name **** then? If so, you got played. I am not sure if **** is a theif but she does own a bar AND she is a hooker. I wouldn't put anything past her. She is a very bright girl.

Larry

Lets not drag in people by name! They can't defend themselves,and didn't ask to be involved here!!!

Danny W · Jan 11, 2004

Re: Re: RD Cops....... Ley y Orden.... NOT ! (long)

Robert said:
Your moral or ethical work values are really of no use here. This is the Dominican Republic, not the Netherlands.
This is how it's done here, for better or for worse, that's the reality.

Welcome to the wild west... It may not have clogs or tulips, but it's one hell of an interesting and fun place to live

2 things:

1. I love the DR and am thinking of relocating to Sosua in a few years (I'm almost 60). But Robert, does one have to adopt a cynical attitude in order to live there? I'm not naive, and this is not a rhetorical question. Is it really a country void of all moral and ethical work values? After a while, that might get to me.

2. NJ_Chris, I think I met your girlfrient at her bar. Is it that little place near the front entrance of the AI? She's about 19 and speaks english? Congrats. She's a lovely and intelligent kid. She had some of her girlfriends with her, and was very proud of having a boyfriend in Jersey City. It's funny how some people are willing to accept the lousy behavior of the cops, etc., but are ready to condemn a pretty Dominicana. - D

If locked up by the police...

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