DR Adult Literacy Rate - 87.8% ? ? ?

gringosabroso

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DR1 News reports on 8spt05 the results of the U.N. Development Program [UNDP], ratings of various South & Central American countries. Many factors go into the ratings. Much of the data seems fairly subjective? The DR has been 'awarded' an adult literacy rating of 87.8%! Meaning that 87.8% of Adult Dominicans can read & write? Does anyone who has lived here more than 1 year believe this? Is this a misprint? Can the definition of literacy [traditionally the ability to read & write adequately in one's native tongue] be watered down to the extent that 88% of Dominicans can honestly be deemed literate?? With a straight face? Impossible. The actual literacy rate, is in my opinion - living here 9 years - approx. 40%; possibly less. Country wide. Questions to the UN: who administered the DR literacy tests? Suggestion to the UN: get somebody else to administer the tests next go around. Hire witnesses! For verification. Your opinions of the actual DR adult literacy rate?
 

Chirimoya

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There was a thread about this in the dim and distant past. Some criteria for defining literacy are suspect, like the ability to write one's name and not much more. Many people have the basic skills of reading and writing but cannot do much with them, and are known as 'functionally illiterate'. They would not be able to fill in a form, or read a newspaper beyond the headlines.
 
M

Mr.Mark

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40 percent??? Barbarazo!

gringosabroso said:
DR1 News reports on 8spt05 the results of the U.N. Development Program [UNDP], ratings of various South & Central American countries. Many factors go into the ratings. Much of the data seems fairly subjective? The DR has been 'awarded' an adult literacy rating of 87.8%! Meaning that 87.8% of Adult Dominicans can read & write? Does anyone who has lived here more than 1 year believe this? Is this a misprint? Can the definition of literacy [traditionally the ability to read & write adequately in one's native tongue] be watered down to the extent that 88% of Dominicans can honestly be deemed literate?? With a straight face? Impossible. The actual literacy rate, is in my opinion - living here 9 years - approx. 40%; possibly less. Country wide. Questions to the UN: who administered the DR literacy tests? Suggestion to the UN: get somebody else to administer the tests next go around. Hire witnesses! For verification. Your opinions of the actual DR adult literacy rate?

Take into account that most of the population of the DR is concentrated in the big cities (Santo Domingo, Santiago, San Francisco de Macoris and so on), so I advice you not to think that because you find many persons who don't know how to read and write in the countryside can give you a fair picture about the literacy figures in this country. I don't think that 88% is extremely high, but I do consider that 40% is extremely low.

Nonetheless, I second Chiri about his comment on functional illiteracy.
 

POP Bad Boy

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Are you sure.........

..........it was't the ILliteracy rate!!! :nervous: ..........but I really think you are right about the 40 percent. I have been here almost full time for 13 years and know people from all around the country......I know many teachers that I dont' feel know as much as my 8 year old niece from the US. :cry:
 

Marianopolita

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Dec 26, 2003
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The figures are not realistic but here is an interesting article

Whether the figures are accurate or not truly depends on what criteria is used to measure literacy but 87.8% is a very questionable stat in my opinion. An article from a very respected Cuban journalist and writer Carlos Alberto Montaner published in January of this year detailed a study of literacy issues among other problems as they relate to education in Latin America which I found interesting.

International tests PISA and TIMSS revealed that Latin American countries rank very low in education and literacy standards on a global scale to the extent that many countries did not participate in the tests because their respective governments did not want to be accountable for the possible low scores achieved.

As per Carlos Alberto Montaner students of the countries that participated in the international testing are 'functional semi-illiterates'. See link below.

Education failure in most Latin countries

La educacion en Latinoamerica


LDG.
 
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mondongo

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....and I almost forgot....any takers on my tropical beach front property in Cheyene, Wyoming?
 

mondongo

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.....and one more thing (Colombo, anyone?)....the DR1 News also prints that said UN report claims the GNP per capita of the DR is US$6,800....

Let this be conclusive proof of at least 2 things:

1) DR1 News does not always check economic facts before printing them. The editors need to be better aware of what is ridiculous and what is not.

2) International Organizations such as the UN (and the IMF, of course) are full of self serving manure (Anan just admitted guilt in the Oil For Foof Scandal).
 

planner

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Defining literacy

I read some time ago about the different tests for literacy and functional literacy.

One set of criteria was being able to read and write your own name and be able to identify 5 words in headlines written in a typical newspapers front page!!!!

In my opinion that is not literacy!

Another report ( I will try to find it) indicated that 53 % of the people here were functionally illiterate. In other words they did not have the equivalent reading ability of a grade 3 student in north america! Another 5 % had absolutely no education.

So the figure of 40% literacy sounds very plausible to me, that means 60 % are functionally illerate. That would certainly explain a lot of things here!
 

Mirador

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planner said:
I read some time ago about the different tests for literacy and functional literacy.

One set of criteria was being able to read and write your own name and be able to identify 5 words in headlines written in a typical newspapers front page!!!!

In my opinion that is not literacy!

Another report ( I will try to find it) indicated that 53 % of the people here were functionally illiterate. In other words they did not have the equivalent reading ability of a grade 3 student in north america! Another 5 % had absolutely no education.

So the figure of 40% literacy sounds very plausible to me, that means 60 % are functionally illerate. That would certainly explain a lot of things here!


There's a saying in Spanish that reads: "no hay peor ciego que el que no quiere ver". In the same vein it can be said: "the worst illiterate is that who doesn't want to read". It's a fact that Dominicans don't read. Don't take my word for it, find out how many books an average Dominican reads in a week, in a month, in a year, during their entire lifetimes. Ask them where the local public library is, how many books have they checked out. Most newspapers are given away for free, since most Dominicans wont pay money to read them. Books? they're beyond the budget of the common folk. Labels? Dominicans don't read signs, instructions on packages, much less labels. Expiration dates? what's that? And if you write a book, only a handfull of self-appointed intellectuals and literary critics will read it. Frustrating, isn't it? ;-)
 

Chirimoya

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mondongo said:
DR1 News does not always check economic facts before printing them. The editors need to be better aware of what is ridiculous and what is not.

DR1 news is not a primary news source, it is a digest of the day's Dominican news media. In this case it was reporting the UNDP ratings as reported in the local press.

If you notice, there is never any DR1 editorial comment in the text, although the news often features summaries of opinion columns and editorial comments from the daily press.
 

mondongo

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Chirimoya said:
DR1 news is not a primary news source..

Are you suggesting that DR1 News selects its stories randomly from the local outlets? Just regurgitating parts of the local newspapers? Or maybe should they apply wisdom, knowledge and common sense in story selection?

I think that is just an excuse....granted, they likely don't get paid enough to do what I am asking for ... ;)
 

Chirimoya

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I wouldn't say randomly, but yes, the news is selected from the local news outlets and some judgement based on knowledge of what is of interest to the readers is involved.

UNDP ratings are news, whether they are accurate or not. You know as well as I that this is one of the criteria used to define a country internationally. Just as the 'failing state' report got heavy coverage in the press, even though many disagreed with the classification. Or should I say, precisely because many disagreed with it. Same goes for the UNDP rating: it is certain to generate debate among those who know the country better, as has happened here.
 

Yari

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How can anyone refute a study when they have not gone out there themselves to research the information? Many of you living in DR who proclaim to only see illiterates, how do you know that the people cannot read nor write? Have you personally witnessed these folks not be able to read? And to compare DR teachers with second graders in the US (forgot what poster said it) is kind of conceited (for lack of a better word). I am sure teachers are trained to do their jobs.

I just wanted to point out the air of arrogance that I got from reading this thread :cry: , Yari

PS: I am in no way claiming to know more than you all but think about it: that ignorant, loud talking, campesino just may know how to read and or write. Maybe not as proficiently as you or I but MAYBE JUST MAYBE he or she can. (As a side note, my grandma who is Dominican has a second grade education and can read and write rather well, considering).
 

planner

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Rather then use the word "refute" the study Yari, I think many of us are questioning its findings. We DO NOT claim to be experts but many of us do have first hand knowledge!

One example: I had a person cleaning for me 2 days a week. She claimed to have some education but did not finish school. I really did not know what she was or was not capable of. ONe day she did not do what I had requested she do. I left very simple clearly written instructions for her. THe issue: she could not read and was embarrased to tell me. Once I knew, it was very easy to deal with, I simply wrote her messages but then explained them to her as well. Maybe that was also helpful to her.

Sounds to me Yari like you want to shoot the messengers rather then hear the message. In my opinion, one of the biggest stumbling blocks for this country and the people is education, both the quality and the access. No one is suggesting it is any one persons fault. The system is not good here.

We are also not suggesting for one second that lack of literacy or education translates into lack of intelligence. And we did not say or imply we only see illiterates. We are saying the rate of illiteracy in our opinion is much higher then announced.

The intent here is not to come across as arrogant at all! Most of us really care about the people and want to help, not stand in judgement in any way.
 

Yari

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Planner,

like I said in my last post, I know that you all live there and see first hand what is going on so I will not sit here and pretend like I know more than anyone, as I live here in the states. BUT I did want to point out the feeling that I got from reading the posts on this thread. Although I do live here, I know that the system(s) sux in DR. I will not refute that. But all I was saying was not to judge solely on looks or behavior. I have a feeling that many of the non Dominicans that are immigrating to the dr think that Dominicans are not smart or educated based on comparisons they might make to people of the culture of their old country. Don't jump on me, it's just a theory :nervous: .

I did not want to shoot the messenger, but until people go out and conduct their own study on illiteracy on DR people then I feel that they really don't know the true rate of illiteracy. But yes I do agree that 80 something % is high for most countries...

peace, yari
 

DunHill

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Some of the bigger cities San Pedro as example, with a university and a lot of schools, public and private.

Private schools and university scores high in reading and writing, but still it wonders myself, when i am eating in the chinese restaurant at the other site of the street that schoolkids still need to help eachother with reading and writing.

Than we have the public schools, the ones who live in the neighbourhood and can walk to school, and if there is no family reason for not going to school (or something wrong with clothes shoes or hair), will fill the classes, mostly later than planned, but that is common.

If the kids live further away, than it is the financial situation if you are able to get into the bus to goto school.

Than we have the problems with the words they speak, for one unknown reason the dominicans like to "eat" the last letter of a word, changing the R for a L (like a chinese) and more, result IF they can write a word they write it incompletely, and a teacher who is happy that finally somebody is able to write something, won't correct it.

Than the books they use at school , specially in the first grades are very good books, high quality, but for somebody who just can read/write a little it more than their name, ABSOLUTELY to difficult, to read and/or to understand, like giving university books to kids in kindergarten.
But it looks good when you have a lot of books, at least you can say that you are not poor, and can showoff that, and everyday those books (needed and unneeded) are carried to school.

ANd than the afterschool, when in the western world a kid comes home and does not understand a line in a book, he asks his mother or father.
Problem here is that more than xx% of the parents only know how to read/write their own name, not really helpful, and the same result for the neighbours.

The interest of a child to learn to read/write is therefore in a lot of cases absolutely zero.

So if they state that 87% can read/write, that number looks good, we show the world how good we are, and that is important, that we cannot read the statement is something else but somebody told me that it was written somewhere.

Education is a problem in this country, Novellas are more important than social information or news, channel5 is the best (till they stop with the novellas), so my idea for a free, basic school on television, to teach the basics of how to read and write, won't be a good idea.
 

mondongo

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Chirimoya said:
UNDP ratings are news, whether they are accurate or not. You know as well as I that this is one of the criteria used to define a country internationally.


Just as the 'failing state' report got heavy coverage in the press, even though many disagreed with the classification.

Two points:
1) Precisely because UN (et al) assertions are used for very important matters....that is the reason that I prefer to perpetuate accurate information. The number as reported by DR1 News is grossly incorrect, misleading and its mis-application will affect your quality life in the DR.....mainly beacuse it paints a rosier picture that will lead to more indebetedness of the DR.

2) There is a fundamental difference between debating abstruse and qualitative terms/concepts such as the "failed state" designation......and asserting that the per capita GNP of the DR is US$6+K. The latter is a knowable, quantitative, incorrect fact.....the former is a debate on some body's opinion, whose basis for that opinion is unclear. Fact vs chewing the cud. ;)
 

mondongo

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Yari, I am a Dominican born Dominican (redundant, i know!). The folk back in the homeland are poor and un-educated. That is the problem. We have to start calling a spade a spade and stop accepting mediocrity. If the overall level of education in the DR does not materially improve, we will remain stuck as a third world country. thats the bottom line.

I live in Massachusetts. Did you know that some of the worst performing high schools in the state are loaded with Dominicans? Why is that?