Dominican Spanish with an emphasis on African inputs

Status
Not open for further replies.

NALs

Economist by Profession
Jan 20, 2003
13,369
3,150
113
Here is a link to a very interesting and thorough (if lengthy) document on African liguistic influences in Dominican Spanish. This document is extremely afro-centric, which brings a refreshing different point of view compared to most other studies done in this and related matters.

The document also includes information on linguistic patterns in Haiti and Cuba and the influences Africans have had on the development of those languages.

The document also puts adequate attention to the history of the country and in itself, is a fine history document of the country, if not the entire island.

Additionally, the author puts more emphasis in connecting and/or attempting to connect Haitian influence over Dominicans, but not much on the terms of Dominican influence over Haitians as migration patterns through the years has been west to east during the zafra and then reversing east to west after the zafra. In any case, it makes for a good read which should spark interesting conversations, though I don't agree with a good number of the findings.

Enjoy!

http://www.personal.psu.edu/faculty/j/m/jml34/afrodom.pdf
 
Last edited:

Kidd Creole

New member
Nov 29, 2005
54
0
0
IT took me a while (still Reading) muy intersante Propz:rambo: wow so I really am creole
 
Last edited:

DominiCubana

New member
Jan 7, 2006
53
0
0
www.ggexpresstravel.net
THANK YOU!! This was very interesting to read!!


Nal0whs said:
Here is a link to a very interesting and thorough (if lengthy) document on African liguistic influences in Dominican Spanish. This document is extremely afro-centric, which brings a refreshing different point of view compared to most other studies done in this and related matters.

The document also includes information on linguistic patterns in Haiti and Cuba and the influences Africans have had on the development of those languages.

The document also puts adequate attention to the history of the country and in itself, is a fine history document of the country, if not the entire island.

Additionally, the author puts more emphasis in connecting and/or attempting to connect Haitian influence over Dominicans, but not much on the terms of Dominican influence over Haitians as migration patterns through the years has been west to east during the zafra and then reversing east to west after the zafra. In any case, it makes for a good read which should spark interesting conversations, though I don't agree with a good number of the findings.

Enjoy!

http://www.personal.psu.edu/faculty/j/m/jml34/afrodom.pdf
 

Hillbilly

Moderator
Jan 1, 2002
18,948
514
113
Interesting read. He seems to conclude that thee is really very little African influence in the modern usage in Dominican Spanish. All of his references are in literature, and in dialect at that.

Interesting.

HB :D:D
 

Marianopolita

Former Spanish forum Mod 2010-2021
Dec 26, 2003
4,821
766
113
Extensive article, vast topic but no debate presented by the OP

John M. Lipski, the author of this document is a professor and researcher of Spanish linguistics and has written many documents on this vast subject matter based on extensive and credible research. His name appears in socio-linguistic research as a reference or excerpts from his many dissertations are included in some of the best textbooks on Spanish linguistics and dialectology.

Having stated the above I must say it took me five days to comb through this document just to ensure that I have not missed any of the details presented. In my opinion it’s not his best article/essay but certainly not lacking in the research department although many of his findings about the Haitianization of Dominican Spanish seems to be speculative (in his esteem) and inconclusive.

There was definitely a linguistic influence in the shaping of Dominican Spanish during the 19th century meaning Haitian Creole on the vernacular Dominican Spanish and from the detailed examples provided in the document it involved many aspects- lexical, syntax and phonetic changes. I identify these aspects of Dominican Spanish as being the most affected when analyzing the speech of Haitians based on the examples provided in the document.

This is a very exhausted topic for me but all information or research is interesting to read and this document just reinforces what should already be known IMO that Dominican Spanish (still today) has vestiges of African elements whether it is a haitianized Creole or Bozal Spanish as compared to Cuba, Puerto Rico, and the Caribbean basin.

When I say African elements I don’t mean in the raw form as presented in the research and found in literature and songs as mentioned in the document but definitely Dominican lexicology (word short forms etc), syntax (sentence structure and patterns) and accepted grammar patterns definitely do not conform to what is defined as 'standard' Spanish. All these components contribute to what is called espa?ol caribe?o as the umbrella term and from there one needs to explore the vast world of Spanish linguistics to understand its complexity.

I will end my comment here due to the fact the OP did not present an opening summary of the article and a discussion topic that would lead to a fruitful conversation. An article as extensive as this one with some very thought provoking phrases (there’s one in particular that could fuel the discussion) should have been better presented by the OP IMO. As well, the vague comments by the others posters have me puzzled.


Quisqueya – ?d?nde est?s?


LDG.
 
Last edited:

samanasuenos

Bronze
Oct 5, 2005
657
18
0
An article as extensive as this one with some very thought provoking phrases (there’s one in particular that could fuel the discussion)

Come on Lesley D, which phrase.........I scanned and got bored/overwhelmed by the piece.............
 

Marianopolita

Former Spanish forum Mod 2010-2021
Dec 26, 2003
4,821
766
113
Samanasuenos

Thanks for confirming what I suspected. A thirty-five page document on a specialized topic is difficult to grasp if one is not familiar with the subject matter at hand. Again it would have been most appropriate for the OP to have summarized the document in the opening post and then provide the link as a reference.

To answer your question there were many provocative phrases in the document but I will reference one which I found most interesting:

Pichardo (1836) also described bozal language as 'com?n e id?ntico en los negros, sean de la naci?n que fuesen, y que se conservan eternamente, a menos que hayan venido muy ni?os: es un castella?o desfigurado, chapurrado, sin concordancia, n?mero, declinaci?n ni conjugaci?n...en fin, una jerga m?s confusa mientras m?s reciente la inmigraci?n: pero que se deja entender de cualquier espa?ol fuera de algunas palabras comunes a todos, que necesitan de traducci?n'- page 2 (bottom)

I am not saying that I disagree with Pichardo's statement. There are two sides to every coin. However, I can easily argue in favor or against this comment. While there is absolute truth to what the statement says good essay writers or debaters don't make blanket statements without further clarifying them (even though this is someone else's quote I think John Lipski used it to defend his argument without considering the implications).

Now a phrase like that implies that all Black Latinos of Caribbean origin don't speak Spanish properly- 'chapurreando el espa?ol' and the basis lies in the influences of bozal Spanish. Throughout the document he refers to this as 'habla de negros'. My point is the statement is too broad and there are many Black Spanish speakers who don't fit this mold throughout the Caribbean region.

Many factors influence the way a person speaks Spanish. Education being the most obvious but socioeconomic factors also way heavily and influence a person's speech. These speech patterns repeat themselves from generation to generation if the above mentioned factors don't change and if a person lives in the same region throughout their life without exposure to Spanish spoken in other areas.

Specific to Dominican Spanish Pichardo's statement is true however, certain Dominican speech patterns that are a property of el habla de negros pervade through all class lines. I am not interested nor will I entertain a discussion that the 'upper class' speaks better. Although this tends to be true many speech patterns typical of Black Spanish speakers cross all class lines in the DR. A lack of exposure and a complete understanding of the Spanish language would influence a person to think otherwise IMO.


I am not looking to discuss this topic unless the article has been read but as a courtesy to you I wanted to respond to your post.


Regards,

LDG.
 
Last edited:

NALs

Economist by Profession
Jan 20, 2003
13,369
3,150
113
Finally Lesley quoted something! :classic:

A thread on Spanish 101 with out Lesley's inputs is, how should I say this, not complete!

John Lipski has very good credentials, but much of what I disagreed with was pertaining to the Haitianization parts, precisely because they are speculative as he himself pointed out in the document.

As with all speculative information, the possibility is always there, but there is not much evidence to support such thing, with the exception of the border the region which due to its geography and historical connections to Haiti on a daily basis, it would be of no surprise of Haitianism extending to the dialects spoken in that region.

The african influence is present, the question is whether it came via our neighbors to the west, immigrants, or bozales. This document successfully shows the lack of influence from bozales, diminishes the influences non-Haitian immigrants of african decent had on the liguistic characteristics of the region they occupied and put speculative emphasis on Haitian creole influence.

Overall, it's an interesting read, but needs less speculation and more concrete evidence in some aspects it discussed.

BTW, Lesley feel free to further elaborate on this issue. Being one of the most versed on subjects dealing with speech and languages, any information you might want to share will be most appreciated.

As of late, I have been moving away from debating on DR1. Debates are tiresome, tend to go in circle, and in the end most of the time go nowhere. Usually, when I summarize a report, it tends to be an start of a lengthy, although lively debate.

This document I supplied was intended only for those who have a real interest in this subject matter. In addition to balance the topics being discussed since African inputs into Dominican Spanish had not been fruitfully discussed, albeit all other influences seem to have been, as far as I can tell.

-NAL

Lesley D said:
John M. Lipski, the author of this document is a professor and researcher of Spanish linguistics and has written many documents on this vast subject matter based on extensive and credible research. His name appears in socio-linguistic research as a reference or excerpts from his many dissertations are included in some of the best textbooks on Spanish linguistics and dialectology.

Having stated the above I must say it took me five days to comb through this document just to ensure that I have not missed any of the details presented. In my opinion it’s not his best article/essay but certainly not lacking in the research department although many of his findings about the Haitianization of Dominican Spanish seems to be speculative (in his esteem) and inconclusive.

There was definitely a linguistic influence in the shaping of Dominican Spanish during the 19th century meaning Haitian Creole on the vernacular Dominican Spanish and from the detailed examples provided in the document it involved many aspects- lexical, syntax and phonetic changes. I identify these aspects of Dominican Spanish as being the most affected when analyzing the speech of Haitians based on the examples provided in the document.

This is a very exhausted topic for me but all information or research is interesting to read and this document just reinforces what should already be known IMO that Dominican Spanish (still today) has vestiges of African elements whether it is a haitianized Creole or Bozal Spanish as compared to Cuba, Puerto Rico, and the Caribbean basin.

When I say African elements I don’t mean in the raw form as presented in the research and found in literature and songs as mentioned in the document but definitely Dominican lexicology (word short forms etc), syntax (sentence structure and patterns) and accepted grammar patterns definitely do not conform to what is defined as 'standard' Spanish. All these components contribute to what is called espa?ol caribe?o as the umbrella term and from there one needs to explore the vast world of Spanish linguistics to understand its complexity.

I will end my comment here due to the fact the OP did not present an opening summary of the article and a discussion topic that would lead to a fruitful conversation. An article as extensive as this one with some very thought provoking phrases (there’s one in particular that could fuel the discussion) should have been better presented by the OP IMO. As well, the vague comments by the others posters have me puzzled.


Quisqueya – ?d?nde est?s?


LDG.
 

samanasuenos

Bronze
Oct 5, 2005
657
18
0
Thank you Lesley

Mil gracias Lesley for your kind reply. The possibility of more of your well-pondered and even better-written replies may even motivate me to struggle through the whole thing. I will stop here as I have not read it in its entirety and as such you've made it clear that you're not looking to discuss it further. I can respect that. Thanks again!
 
Status
Not open for further replies.