house electrical questions

laurapasinifan · Feb 9, 2006

I bought my GF family a water heater a few trips ago. I just screws into the pipe coming out of the wall and replaces the regular shower head. But it has a small heater in it to heat the water as it goes by. Well my gf's father had a friend who supposedly knows electrical work wire it up. When I saw it I ended up scratching my head. The guy wired it with a double poled ceramic-brass toggle switch only 6 " above the shower head!.... thos switched look very dangerous!....you can SEE the brass connectors under the ceramic! So you KNOW it is not waterproof!. It has two wires from the house power going to it, and they have a green ground wire going from the shower head up into the wall-cieling joint...( hopefully to a real ground)

I dont think this looks too safe... and i want to buy something here in the states to bring back to rewire the unit and move the switch away from the shower stall. I was thinking of adding a light above the vanity mirror and put the switch right next to that new light fixture. But at the store the guy asked my if its 110 or 220...he thinks its 220 because of the double pole throw switch. But i dont think the house has a ground wire...I just think they ran a ground from the shower head on out.... outside where power comes into the house is just 2 large dia wires( poorly coated I might add...lots of cracking) they are about 8 guage. So I am thinking that its only 110 coming into the house.

also the guy said If I put in a GFI in the bathroom, it would be a moot point, if there are other poorly wired fixtures through the house, on the way back to the fuse box.

so ...does 220 normally come into the houses from the street?

does anyone think that the green ground running out of the shower head to ground is sufficient to protect agains getting elctrocuted from water splashing on the ceramic switch?

second part... i want to buy some hand tools in santiago....anyone know of a better place to buy them , and get decent stuff , at a decent price?

thanks...bob

easygoin · Feb 9, 2006

laurapasinifan said:
I bought my GF family a water heater a few trips ago. I just screws into the pipe coming out of the wall and replaces the regular shower head. But it has a small heater in it to heat the water as it goes by. Well my gf's father had a friend who supposedly knows electrical work wire it up. When I saw it I ended up scratching my head. The guy wired it with a double poled ceramic-brass toggle switch only 6 " above the shower head!.... thos switched look very dangerous!....you can SEE the brass connectors under the ceramic! So you KNOW it is not waterproof!. It has two wires from the house power going to it, and they have a green ground wire going from the shower head up into the wall-cieling joint...( hopefully to a real ground)

I dont think this looks too safe... and i want to buy something here in the states to bring back to rewire the unit and move the switch away from the shower stall. I was thinking of adding a light above the vanity mirror and put the switch right next to that new light fixture. But at the store the guy asked my if its 110 or 220...he thinks its 220 because of the double pole throw switch. But i dont think the house has a ground wire...I just think they ran a ground from the shower head on out.... outside where power comes into the house is just 2 large dia wires( poorly coated I might add...lots of cracking) they are about 8 guage. So I am thinking that its only 110 coming into the house.

also the guy said If I put in a GFI in the bathroom, it would be a moot point, if there are other poorly wired fixtures through the house, on the way back to the fuse box.

so ...does 220 normally come into the houses from the street?

does anyone think that the green ground running out of the shower head to ground is sufficient to protect agains getting elctrocuted from water splashing on the ceramic switch?

second part... i want to buy some hand tools in santiago....anyone know of a better place to buy them , and get decent stuff , at a decent price?

thanks...bob

Look at the element itself and it should say what voltage marked somewhere on it. As far as determining incoming power source... do you have single pole breakers only in the box or some singles and double breakers. If double probably 115 - 220. You can also take the cover off of the box ,your feed lines if having to 220 would each feed independent bus bars and also a good ground. Nothing like having a meter when needed. As for the shower head connection I would just put it in a weatherproof box to be on the safe side and be done with it.

easygoin · Feb 9, 2006

laurapasinifan said:
I bought my GF family a water heater a few trips ago. I just screws into the pipe coming out of the wall and replaces the regular shower head. But it has a small heater in it to heat the water as it goes by. Well my gf's father had a friend who supposedly knows electrical work wire it up. When I saw it I ended up scratching my head. The guy wired it with a double poled ceramic-brass toggle switch only 6 " above the shower head!.... thos switched look very dangerous!....you can SEE the brass connectors under the ceramic! So you KNOW it is not waterproof!. It has two wires from the house power going to it, and they have a green ground wire going from the shower head up into the wall-cieling joint...( hopefully to a real ground)

I dont think this looks too safe... and i want to buy something here in the states to bring back to rewire the unit and move the switch away from the shower stall. I was thinking of adding a light above the vanity mirror and put the switch right next to that new light fixture. But at the store the guy asked my if its 110 or 220...he thinks its 220 because of the double pole throw switch. But i dont think the house has a ground wire...I just think they ran a ground from the shower head on out.... outside where power comes into the house is just 2 large dia wires( poorly coated I might add...lots of cracking) they are about 8 guage. So I am thinking that its only 110 coming into the house.

also the guy said If I put in a GFI in the bathroom, it would be a moot point, if there are other poorly wired fixtures through the house, on the way back to the fuse box.

so ...does 220 normally come into the houses from the street?

does anyone think that the green ground running out of the shower head to ground is sufficient to protect agains getting elctrocuted from water splashing on the ceramic switch?

second part... i want to buy some hand tools in santiago....anyone know of a better place to buy them , and get decent stuff , at a decent price?

thanks...bob

Another way to determine voltage, when I do not have my meter handy... I just grab the lines with my hands and if it holds on to me I got 115.... if it blows me back I got 220.:surprised :surprised :surprised

laurapasinifan · Feb 9, 2006

thanks...I am trying to convince myself to buy the stuff here, before i go. I went to a hardware store down there last trip.. and they have tons of that ceramic stuff....seems pretty popular down there...I think there is a bunch more options here to choose from.

so I dont knoiw exactly what they have. And asking is kinda of taking chances....my girlfriend understands me fine, but wont know how to answer electrical questions... and he rfather doesnt speak any english, and I wont know the proper terms in spanish.....even if he knew the answers.

i was wondering if the just the two wires coming in signifies for sure either 110 or 220.....

bob

easygoin · Feb 9, 2006

laurapasinifan said:
thanks...I am trying to convince myself to buy the stuff here, before i go. I went to a hardware store down there last trip.. and they have tons of that ceramic stuff....seems pretty popular down there...I think there is a bunch more options here to choose from.

so I dont knoiw exactly what they have. And asking is kinda of taking chances....my girlfriend understands me fine, but wont know how to answer electrical questions... and he rfather doesnt speak any english, and I wont know the proper terms in spanish.....even if he knew the answers.

i was wondering if the just the two wires coming in signifies for sure either 110 or 220.....

bob

Ceramic is an excellent insulator. As far as the two wires coming in and only two, one's gotta be hot and other a ground. So it should be 120. Are the wire is two different colors and if so what colors?

bigbird · Feb 9, 2006

Any way your girlfriend can pm you a photo so I can see what the installation looks like? My brief job experiences,,,,,,,,electrician, electrical contractor, electrical engineer, project manager, now semi-retired

Pay my airfare and get me a couple of novias and I will rewire the whole house for you.

laurapasinifan · Feb 9, 2006

bigbird said:
Any way your girlfriend can pm you a photo so I can see what the installation looks like? My brief job experiences,,,,,,,,electrician, electrical contractor, electrical engineer, project manager, now semi-retired

Pay my airfare and get me a couple of novias and I will rewire the whole house for you.

tell me you are already in punta cana, and that 2 whores will do.... and you got a deal

she doesnt have a computer.....i took a picture believe it or not , but when my card got full i went in a started deleting some to give me more space!!!!!!!!!! and all the wireing photos went!!!! dammmmm

bob

bigbird · Feb 9, 2006

laurapasinifan said:
I bought my GF family a water heater a few trips ago. I just screws into the pipe coming out of the wall and replaces the regular shower head. But it has a small heater in it to heat the water as it goes by.

Clear one thing up for me. Did it get installed like this,,,,,,,,remove the shower head,,,,,,,,screw on the heater,,,,,,,,,and re-install the shower head

laurapasinifan · Feb 9, 2006

no.... unscrew the shower head ...screw in new unit... hook up wires.... the new unit IS the shower head and heater all in one... they are pretty popular...maybe 650 pesos

so you ARE in punta cana already!!!!!!!!

bob

bigbird · Feb 9, 2006

The very first problem I have is the height and location of an electrical device within the footprint of the tub. The National Electrical Code (NEC) mandates a minimum height of 5 feet above the top edge of the tub for the installatiion of an electrical device. Clearly this does not seem to be the case. The electrical device must be waterproof, clearly this also is not the case.

Keep feeding me info, and I will tell you what to do to resolve the problem. Without seeing it, I think there is a major problem. 90% of DR is not to US electrical wiring standards. In this case I am nervous, a human standing in water with electrical wiring within reach!!!!!!!!!!!!

laurapasinifan · Feb 9, 2006

well Like i said i want to move it over above the sink's vanity cabinet.....

also i need a box that will mount ONTO the wall and not IN the wall..as it is concrete............I was also told that the circut is probably about 30 amps, if it is a heater... I guess that matters for what style and size box to buy........

bob

Hipocrito Mejia · Feb 9, 2006

Bob, those units are usually 110V. You can go to any Home Depot or similar store here, and buy a box and switch rated for outdoor locations, as that should give you the proper protection from splashing water.

On the ground issue, I would think that more than likely, it's not adecuate. Most electricians in DR have no concept of what a proper ground connection is. Go look at their main breaker panel, which more than likely uses screw in fuses, and look to see if there's a main ground connection for the entire house. Probably not!

Hipocrito Mejia · Feb 9, 2006

Those devices are safe when installed properly. It is most likely manufactured in Italy as they are very common there. They are basically a point of use version of the whole house tankless heater than were first popular all over Europe, and have become more common place in the US within the last 5 to 10 years.

bigbird · Feb 9, 2006

Hold on.......I am starting to get a vision.:glasses: If there are only 2 wires coming into the house than it is 110 volt. Except in European countries.

I won't bother to ask if it is UL Listed or sold in the US.

Using a 2 pole switch does not mean 220 volt. In this case the switch is breaking the hot wire and the neutral.

I most definetly relocate the switch from inside the tub.

Can you imagine this? Take a wire (Romex) from the heater gizmo to an area away from the tub, lets say to where you want to install a light and GFCI receptacle........wait a minute

When are you going down?

For now just make sure no one touches the switch while in the tub.

Let's move this to a PM and I will walk you thru what to do. Give me as much info as you can. I will tell you what to buy stateside. When you get there take your camera and send photos. Together we will rewire that bathroom! This may cost you 3 novias, just kidding. I will be honored to help. My way of paying back for all the help I received on this board.

bigbird · Feb 9, 2006

Hipocrito Mejia said:
Those devices are safe when installed properly. It is most likely manufactured in Italy as they are very common there. They are basically a point of use version of the whole house tankless heater than were first popular all over Europe, and have become more common place in the US within the last 5 to 10 years.

Your description is great. In this case a few words painted a picture. So would it be a sealed unit with a 1/2" threaded connector? Where the proper installation would be to use sealtite to extend the wiring to a remote area where the On/Off switch would be located?

bigbird · Feb 9, 2006

Take a look at this link.

http://www.belizenorth.com/electric_shower_head.htm

Is this it?

bigbird · Feb 9, 2006

and this one

http://www.cpsc.gov/cpscpub/prerel/prhtml02/02155.html

laurapasinifan · Feb 9, 2006

VERY similar devices...but not exact....but you get the idea...on the first picture, the third wire hold down going up the wall is about where this open switch is in my GFs house... there is no bathtub....just a tile over concrete shower stall.

I was thinking of running a single cable with two wires from the new location( possible light and switch) back to the shower unit. And keep it super water proof with shrink wrapped tubbing over the connections.

now the new switch....i have sen outdoor water proof boxes with a threaded opening on the end to wire through conduit...with a water proof cover that trips a regular light switch inside the water proof box...I figure i can run power through that as well and onto my new light fixture.....

inside the new waterproof box (the regular light switch) ..will that just cut the hot lead to the shower head, or do both leads run through the new switch???

i am asking now, even though i know it may be obvious once I have it all in hand.......

they have a three fuse fuse box in the kitchen, for the whole house...it appears to have breakers...not screw in fuses...there may be room for one more breaker....it is a small fuse panel for sure..... they dont have electric heat any place , but the new shower head...the biggest power drain would be the new microwave, and or the blow dryer, both of which I have bought in the last 6 months!!!!!!!!... i may burn their house down if i keep buying stuff!!

bob

Hipocrito Mejia · Feb 9, 2006

Those are different than the ones that I'm referring to and have seen in DR. The ones that I've seen are just like a miniature whole house tankless heater. Either way, for any of those devices to be safe, they have to be installed in such a way that all electrical connections are enclosed within a waterproof box and a proper ground is extremely important.

bigbird · Feb 9, 2006

Hipocrito Mejia said:
Those are different than the ones that I'm referring to and have seen in DR. The ones that I've seen are just like a miniature whole house tankless heater. Either way, for any of those devices to be safe, they have to be installed in such a way that all electrical connections are enclosed within a waterproof box and a proper ground is extremely important.

I have to laugh, I have been living in a First World Country way too long. Now to think 3 world electric, I say go with what Hipo said. A PVC weather proof box. The threaded hole a weather proof connector fits in there. Take apart what is there and put it back together with a weatherproof box, wp connectors, and wp cover plate. Probably the easiest 3rd World thing to do is take down a small tube of outdoor silicone sealant to seal all openings on the existing box.

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