Al Sharpton alive and kicking at the US Embassy!

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Robert

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I know we have a policy of keeping racism off the board, but sometimes somethings just need to be talked about.

Embassy bans its employees from Loft (story below)

My favorite line from the press release.

"Bullen says that it is rare for an embassy to make a decision of this type, but added that the clubs are violating both Dominican and US laws".

Who cares that they are breaking US laws, this is the DR, hello!!!

Embassy bans its employees from Loft
The US Embassy in the DR has prohibited its employees from visiting the popular Santo Domingo nightclub "Loft" because of alleged racial discrimination practiced by the nightclub. Roland Bullen, Charge d'Affaires at the Embassy, informed all US citizens belonging to the diplomatic mission that they should not visit that club because it did not allow admission of an African-American US Embassy employee on 22 July. Bullen said that in 2005 his predecessor Lisa Kubiske tried to persuade several Santo Domingo nightclub owners to change their admissions policies because of continued complaints from African-American embassy employees. Bullen says that it is rare for an embassy to make a decision of this type, but added that the clubs are violating both Dominican and US laws.
See the Embassy press release on the matter at: Departamento de Estado Emite Informe Sobre Trata de Personas 2007
 

Mr. Lu

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My question is what is this press release, and the prohibition, REALLY going to do? Its not as if people will stop going to the club, maybe they'll just go more. Who cares, honestly. Its not as if its a good club anyway. Have you been Loft??????? In fact Mr. Bullen has given a bad club some free press. Nice job!

At the same time, where are the details from the night and incident in question? I'd like to know if their was legitimate racial discrimination or if there was something else that happened that resulted in that guy not getting in?

WHATEVER!!!!!!!!! We can now put this under the no one cares because we are in the DR file.
 

Ant

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Al Sharpton?

Robert, I'm sure you will correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it against Dominican law to discriminate based on skin color? As the press release stated, they are breaking DOMINICAN laws, too.

I am sure that someone close to some higher-ups at the U.S. Embassy was the one discriminated against. That is why the "unprecedented" step of the press release.

Should the American Embassy not say anything?
 

Sholly24

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"Bullen says that it is rare for an embassy to make a decision of this type, but added that the clubs are violating both Dominican and US laws".

Who cares that they are breaking US laws, this is the DR, hello!!!

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The american embassy has an obligation not to support anything that is against the US law whether the incident occurs in the US or outside it's shores. Dominicans are free to do whatever they want in their country whether the US likes it or not.........but to the extent that it is something that our laws/society stands against, then the embassy has every right to refuse to support it.

I am not sure whether the embassy staff was refused because of color or some other reason. If the reason is due to race, then the american embassy has made an excellent call in my opinion and I completely support it. Alan Sharpton will blame everything and anything on race if he can, but this (if it is really what it seems to be) is entirely different.

Sholly
 

Robert

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Sure it's against Dominican law as far as I'm aware, but that's not why I highlighted a particular paragraph.

My point is this... Why throw in the US law comment, this is the DR?
Are the exporting laws along with moral values these days?

Bottom line.

Loft will be jam packed this weekend.
 

CJnNJ

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I know we have a policy of keeping racism off the board, but sometimes somethings just need to be talked about.

I See. But you're not really interested in discussing the issue of racism, and the unprecedented steps taken by the Embassy to address the matter. Rather, you want to talk about Al Sharpton and.. what? Is he down there, too?

In any event, I am curious if any of the members of DR1 have been to this place and if so have they observed or experienced this discriminatory policy themselves.

Also, I don't believe this thread should be shut down, since the article is right there, on DR1's site, and worthy of discussion.
 

NALs

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Sure it's against Dominican law as far as I'm aware, but that's not why I highlighted a particular paragraph.

My point is this... Why throw in the US law comment, this is the DR?
Are the exporting laws along with moral values these days?


Bottom line.

Loft will be jam packed this weekend.
Remember what Albert Schweitzer in 1913 told his African dependents in the colony of French Equatorial Africa: "I am your brother, but your older brother."

He went to Africa on the belief that Westerners have a moral duty to provide order, law, and good government to subject peoples. In the absense of colonial authority, despotism, cruelty, corruption, and incompetence would prevail.

Hm.... perhaps there is something of the sort from the part of the US embassy or maybe not....

-NALs
 
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StellaRay

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Sure it's against Dominican law as far as I'm aware, but that's not why I highlighted a particular paragraph.

My point is this... Why throw in the US law comment, this is the DR?
Are the exporting laws along with moral values these days?

I'm thinking they included "US law" part to show that American employees are expected to uphold American standards/ideals or something along those lines? I mean, in Amsterdam certain drugs are legal, but I'm assuming that the Embassy doesn't want its employees indulging in such things, since they're against American law.

I don't really know, and I'll admit I'm completely clueless about these things, so I'm just throwing out a guess.
 
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jackieboo

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They threw the US law comment in because the American employees of the embassy work in the United States as the embassy itself is a sovereign property of the US. As a sovereign property persons working there are subject to the laws of the United States.

An American citizen didn't break the law? Plus it was outside of the embassy.
In this case, who cares what the US law is, it doesn't apply, so why mention it.

All this press release does is insight more bad feeling towards the USA here in the DR. Despite the fact that "Lisa Kubiske" apparently tried to resolve the problem a few years ago. They still should have sat down with the owner of Loft and had a little chat with him over a beer. They should have been a little more "Dominican" about the situation.

Then again...

Maybe the owner of Loft doesn't want African Americans or Gringos in his bar?
 
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Alyonka

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I have been to Loft and saw dark skinned people there. I think that guy must have done something other than being black for him not to be allowed in that club and then told at work about racial descrimination. Sometimes dark skinned Americans can be very sensitive and attribute all kinds of communication and other problems to their skin color. I have seen this happening in the places I have worked in the US. This is just my opinion.
 

Janin

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No Dark People at Night

I know we have a policy of keeping racism off the board...
Yes, strangely enough, as everybody knows that there IS racism in this country.

The skin check practice does seem to be exercised in other places as well and two other night clubs are mentioned in this article:
El Nacional, la voz de todos

For me the interesting question is, if also in this case of critizism Sr. Carlos Morales Troncoso will react in the same furious manner against the American embassy as he has done so many times when the country was slandered.

Janin
 

NALs

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For me the interesting question is, if also in this case of critizism Sr. Carlos Morales Troncoso will react in the same furious manner against the American embassy as he has done so many times when the country was slandered.

Janin
Why would Troncoso react towards this?

The country is not being slander, just a single nightclub.

The US embassy is not claiming that the Dominican government supports discrimination. That is completely different from those groups that go around claiming that the DR government does support racial discrimination.

There is a BIG difference.

And what do make of Alyonka's posts?

Alyonka said:
I have been to Loft and saw dark skinned people there.

-NALs
 

Robert

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jackieboo, I'm really sorry, I clicked on the edit button instead of the quote button on your post #11. Feel free to call me an idiot and post what I removed :(
 

lewpo

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Cute;
Not for nothing, but I was hoping to leave this sort of nonsense in the States when I moved down to DR.(near future). Just to illuminate US government policy abroad. If an establishment in the vicinity of lets say a military base in Kosovo went neo-nazi the commander of said base would place same "OFF LIMITS" to all base personell Military and Civilian (dependants would be another matter)and the embassy would follow suit in fact it would most likely lead the way politictions seeking publicity and all.Just as now all places of prostution have been placed off limits to military personal in response to the Human trafficing uproar.No more Siagong/Tokoy/Soeul swinging and the bulkan/Russian trafficing BS is shutting down Europe even where legal the GI's ,they have to sneak into Amsterdamn . So as the outraged libertarian who started this post can see the actions of the Counsel is consistant with not only the liberal anti-racisium policy of the USA but the Jesus freak conservitive anti-Fun policy too....class dismissed. What I would like to know is if the club excludes African-Americans(I never thought that term would catch on) or all Black people? I would think that in the DR that would be a bad business move but I've never been to the city.
 

Chris

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..... the outraged libertarian who started this post...

LOL, the 'outraged libertarian' who started this post is the boss of this joint!

I generally agree with you ... same as MacDonalds ... even in countries where they call French Fries .. English Chips, they still call'em fries at MacDonalds. :laugh:
Yes Robert, the exportation of values seems to be alive and well!
 

Lambada

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I'm assuming that US Embassy personnel would visit this place during their free time and not during the working day? So if that's the case does the US Embassy have the right to 'prohibit' its workers from going anywhere on their own time? Strikes me as a little 'colonial' in attitude, what?, thinking that an employer has the right to control where employees go in their spare time. I mean, would they do the same to a State Dept. employee if that person was in the US, which is after all, the Land of the Free. :) I think if I was a US Embassy employee in Santo Domingo I would point out encroachment on my rights to choose where I went in my spare time, a type of infringement of my human rights................. I appreciate that Mr. Bullen is himself African American so may have a particular interest in this issue, but there are larger human rights at stake I would have thought.

And what of the Dominican employees of the US Embassy? Are they similarly 'prohibited'?
 

lewpo

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"...There are larger human rights at stake I would have thought."


Think again . In NYS a Corrections officer(prison Guard) was found to have ties to the KKK.Fired . In the US army persons found to have conections with street gangs or hate groups are routinely separated "for the good of the service" Employers are now able to fire smokers who smoke at home if they test positive for nicotine 3 times after being told to quit.A police officer(NYPD yet) poised nude for play girl . fired . The Bill Of Rights garantees "..Life,Liberty , and the Pursuit of Happiness..." not employment to the detrement of your employer. Those who seek more are free to join some of the greates US Citizens the self-employed . or the un-employed your freedom of choice.
 
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