What a great opportunity this kid is blowing!!
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/25/nyregion/25chance.html?th&emc=th
HB
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/25/nyregion/25chance.html?th&emc=th
HB
- Thread starter Hillbilly
- Start date
Not what we want to see
I guess the kid is Dominican. If we can hear all the feel good stories of Dominicans that have done well, I guess we can hear of the one's where they mess up.
No symphathy for this...
Justice Farber talked about his earlier decision and his lack of options now. ?If I give you another chance you will deal drugs,? he said. ?I know I am hurting you, I know I am hurting your parents. I know I am hurting every person who comes before me in your position asking for leniency.?
It is the kid himself who is hurting everyone around him.
Justice Farber talked about his earlier decision and his lack of options now. ?If I give you another chance you will deal drugs,? he said. ?I know I am hurting you, I know I am hurting your parents. I know I am hurting every person who comes before me in your position asking for leniency.?
It is the kid himself who is hurting everyone around him.
Listening to the audio clips the kid is very articulate but you get the sense that the street smarts have gotten the better of him. Sad story for all involved, and as much as I believe in giving people chances this guy more than qualifies for jail time. Will he come out a changed man, well that's another story.:ermm:
What a tough decision for a judge, but not many options because he's become drug dealer.
I think the mother knows why her son went down that self-distructive road when she refers to the divorce. There's a much higher incidence of substance abuse with kids coping with marriage breakdown and they struggle with a lot other emotional problems. Father's are often marginalized from their kids and it has a big impact.
No one really understands why some people become addicts (spiritual, emotional, environmental and possibilly genetic factors contribute). It's a disease and the judge knows very well that the prison system fails to rehabilitate criminals let alone heal sick people (addicts). There's plenty of cocaine and other drugs in the prisons. To top it all off the boy himself never really comes out and says that he's powerless over his problem, he only says that he's to blame for everything.
It's very sad to see people harm themselves like that, because while they hurt everyone around them, ultimately they are harming themselves even more. I think families and maybe even the courts should be able to hospitalize addicts who are in that rut, but many would see it as a violation of personal rights and freedoms.
Not getting treatment is almost glamourized in this culture.
YouTube - Amy Winehouse - Rehab
I think the mother knows why her son went down that self-distructive road when she refers to the divorce. There's a much higher incidence of substance abuse with kids coping with marriage breakdown and they struggle with a lot other emotional problems. Father's are often marginalized from their kids and it has a big impact.
No one really understands why some people become addicts (spiritual, emotional, environmental and possibilly genetic factors contribute). It's a disease and the judge knows very well that the prison system fails to rehabilitate criminals let alone heal sick people (addicts). There's plenty of cocaine and other drugs in the prisons. To top it all off the boy himself never really comes out and says that he's powerless over his problem, he only says that he's to blame for everything.
It's very sad to see people harm themselves like that, because while they hurt everyone around them, ultimately they are harming themselves even more. I think families and maybe even the courts should be able to hospitalize addicts who are in that rut, but many would see it as a violation of personal rights and freedoms.
Not getting treatment is almost glamourized in this culture.
YouTube - Amy Winehouse - Rehab
Rant time. Sorry but I can't help myself.
This young man has had more than his fair share of enablers, starting with this way too liberal judge.
If he would of thrown the book at him the first time maybe he wouldn't think the criminal justice system is such a joke.
Don't blame his poor choices on his parents' divorce.
This guy has no excuse aside from the main reason why people like him resort to dealing drugs-laziness and a sense of entitlement that borders on insanity.
Every fool living in the hood and dealing drugs wants to be Tony Montana. Well, real life doesn't work out that way.
I hope he gets all 8 years.
This young man has had more than his fair share of enablers, starting with this way too liberal judge.
If he would of thrown the book at him the first time maybe he wouldn't think the criminal justice system is such a joke.
Don't blame his poor choices on his parents' divorce.
This guy has no excuse aside from the main reason why people like him resort to dealing drugs-laziness and a sense of entitlement that borders on insanity.
Every fool living in the hood and dealing drugs wants to be Tony Montana. Well, real life doesn't work out that way.
I hope he gets all 8 years.
That's the problem, Berzin. He's a kid. A stupid child, who thinks he's smarter than the system, and that everyone around him will go out of their way to accommodate him.
Up to this point, he's more or less been correct. I agree that some jail time will likely get his attention, but don't think 8 years is appropriate.
All 8 years will do to him is teach him how to be a better criminal. Chances are that he probably got the hint after his first week in Riker's.
I would have sentenced him to a short period, then paroled him with the understanding that if he got caught with so much as a speeding violation, he'd serve his remaining time as someone's girlfriend.
But I don't think throwing the kid under the bus - even if that's what he did to others around him - is the ideal solution.
Up to this point, he's more or less been correct. I agree that some jail time will likely get his attention, but don't think 8 years is appropriate.
All 8 years will do to him is teach him how to be a better criminal. Chances are that he probably got the hint after his first week in Riker's.
I would have sentenced him to a short period, then paroled him with the understanding that if he got caught with so much as a speeding violation, he'd serve his remaining time as someone's girlfriend.
But I don't think throwing the kid under the bus - even if that's what he did to others around him - is the ideal solution.
I agree with legalizing, taxing and regulating illegal drugs and removing the profit motive. I think we have to keep in mind that prisons are also big business.
Despite Setbacks, a Boom In Private Prison Business - New York Times
I doubt that Rikers Island Prison Complex and Prison Health Services Inc. are going to help this kid either. I don't think we know enough about addiction to just shug our shoulders and let people harm themselves and others.
And Berzin, while I realize there's sometimes a fine line between enabling and supporting the individual, the sort of tough love approach (imprisonment) that you're advocating rarely rehabilitates anyone. So why not look for better methods? I think that's what the judge who sees hardened criminals ever day had in mind when this articulate kid from a semi-stable family appeared before him.
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I understand where everyone is coming from, but I see these monsters created every day. No one becomes like this in a vacuum.
This guy is outside at all hours unsupervised. His parents probably have no idea where he is or what hes' doing.
Worse, they probably DO know what he's up to, and as long as he brings money home they don't squawk.
There is something that y'all are missing here, and that is the level of permissiveness these kids grow up in. They live in a world where anything goes, any outrageous act can be justified and the only respect worth earning is that of your peers on the street corner.
You also have to understand how some latino parents raise their children.
Some take the approach that as long as they are out there working all day they can leave teenagers to their own devices as long as they put food on the table.
They come home tired, eat, sit in front of the tv with a beer, never speak to their kids about anything and then go to sleep. Rinse and repeat.
And don't get me started on the public school system. Because of potential lawsuits, there is no discipline in these places at all. So these kids grow up thinking they do not have to respect authority.
Then when its' time to pay for what they do out in the streets, here come the family members and girlfriends to defend them. I see them every day outside the Bronx courthouse waving good-bye to their sons as the blue correction buses take them away to Rikers Island.
And what are these little angels doing as they are being whisked away? Screaming obscenities at the very community they live in.
Just the other day I was crossing the street at a red light and there in front of me was one of these buses. One of the inmates screamed out "Hey white boy-why don't you suck my #@#$?"
To which I replied-"If you want to have sex with men you are going to the right place".
The state cannot be responsible for terrible parenting.
This guy is outside at all hours unsupervised. His parents probably have no idea where he is or what hes' doing.
Worse, they probably DO know what he's up to, and as long as he brings money home they don't squawk.
There is something that y'all are missing here, and that is the level of permissiveness these kids grow up in. They live in a world where anything goes, any outrageous act can be justified and the only respect worth earning is that of your peers on the street corner.
You also have to understand how some latino parents raise their children.
Some take the approach that as long as they are out there working all day they can leave teenagers to their own devices as long as they put food on the table.
They come home tired, eat, sit in front of the tv with a beer, never speak to their kids about anything and then go to sleep. Rinse and repeat.
And don't get me started on the public school system. Because of potential lawsuits, there is no discipline in these places at all. So these kids grow up thinking they do not have to respect authority.
Then when its' time to pay for what they do out in the streets, here come the family members and girlfriends to defend them. I see them every day outside the Bronx courthouse waving good-bye to their sons as the blue correction buses take them away to Rikers Island.
And what are these little angels doing as they are being whisked away? Screaming obscenities at the very community they live in.
Just the other day I was crossing the street at a red light and there in front of me was one of these buses. One of the inmates screamed out "Hey white boy-why don't you suck my #@#$?"
To which I replied-"If you want to have sex with men you are going to the right place".
The state cannot be responsible for terrible parenting.
One of the best methods I know is confinement in a residential facility staffed by ex-addicts. I used to send my addicted clients to onesuch years ago as a probation officer. Ex-addicts have heard all the excuses (because they've used them themselves) & they're a lot tougher on addicts than any helping professionals. And in a lot of cases it works. But...........only if the addict wants to kick the habit. Absent client motivation it's pointless even trying because they'll be back on the drug. Addicts are ace at lying to others but they're even better at lying to themselves, unfortunately.
But treatment for addicts is a world away from punishment for dealers. There are many who believe that when the addict crosses the line and becomes a dealer he/she puts themselves outside of the reach of helping efforts.
He's sorry he got caught. I doubt he's sorry he dealt and used drugs. Huge conceptual difference.
From a societal perspective, I disagree. Under the current laws, if he gets the full 8 years then maybe some other street punk selling poison to his peers will think twice before choosing that career. One thing is for sure: the drug trade and habit wouldn't be growing if coddling within the legal system and rehab worked. Forget the psycho-social reasons folks choose to light that first doobie/rock, snort that line, pop that pill or jab that vein-knowing damn well they might become an addict (because they KNOW folks who are addicts): they want to do it out of the human drive to search for pleasure. It feels good. We like our pleasure. It makes living worthwhile
. (But search for my solution to the drug problem. It ain't stricter enforcement. Au contraire...).
The kid needs to take responsibility for his life.... he needs to STOP hanging out with the old crowd... they are a bad influence.... I'm sure he blames EVERYONE else for his problems.... until he does that..... he WILL NEVER change! He will be OUR problem until he does.... He knows better than his mother, than the judge.. he is smarter than everyone... that's why he keeps doing it. I've seen it time and time again.
He'll be back. He'll be sentenced to 8 years in prision. What a shame. It seemed that he had everything going for him. Maybe he'll use his time wisely and get into a program.
We all have choices in life.
He'll be back. He'll be sentenced to 8 years in prision. What a shame. It seemed that he had everything going for him. Maybe he'll use his time wisely and get into a program.
We all have choices in life.
He's sorry he got caught. I doubt he's sorry he dealt and used drugs. Huge conceptual difference.
From a societal perspective, I disagree. Under the current laws, if he gets the full 8 years then maybe some other street punk selling poison to his peers will think twice before choosing that career. One thing is for sure: the drug trade and habit wouldn't be growing if coddling within the legal system and rehab worked. Forget the psycho-social reasons folks choose to light that first doobie/rock, snort that line, pop that pill or jab that vein-knowing damn well they might become an addict (because they KNOW folks who are addicts): they want to do it out of the human drive to search for pleasure. It feels good. We like our pleasure. It makes living worthwhile
(But search for my solution to the drug problem. It ain't stricter enforcement. Au contraire...).
I understand Berzin's point about bad parenting, and agree that is a large part of the cause. Frankly, I think a major reason for the issues in the African-American community is our lack of decent father figures - many of whom are in jail themselves. However, bad rearing or not, lousy attitude or not, 8 years represents and awfully long time - almost half the time this kid's actually been alive. I don't know if being a guest at Riker's will do anything other than turn this juvenile delinquent into a hardened criminal.
To CB's point, there are only two realistic solutions for the drug trade - meaning, options that will actually result in lessened drug use.
First, as CB is alluding, is to legalize the trade. that won't happen in a society largely based on and governed by a mindset that has a basis in puritan roots. Remember, these are the descendants of the same people/mindset who heavily regulated tobacco, banned alcohol at one point, and justified slavery because it introduced christianity to new people - not that they were people, of course. :/
Second is to stop pursuing the sellers, and to go after the buyers. The problem with supply-side enforcement is that there's always someone there to take the place of whoever got busted. We all know that before this kid was booked, his replacement was serving his new clientele.
Instead of pursuing the pushers - which has never worked - law enforcement should go after the buyers, the "Brad and Tammys" looking to have a little fun over the weekend.
I guarantee you if NYU and Duke are empty this upcoming semester because most of their students are locked up, there will be a sea change in the drug war.
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What this kid needs are strict parents that are going to be watching him like a hawk and not allow him to be hanging out in the streets. Where does his mother think he was getting all the new clothes and money from? This is all due to bad parenting.
Legalizing drugs is not going to solve the problem. oxycoton (sp?) is legal and yet there are people selling it illegally and people abusing it.
Legalizing drugs is not going to solve the problem. oxycoton (sp?) is legal and yet there are people selling it illegally and people abusing it.