writing skills of Dominicans

Princesa777 · Aug 15, 2008

I noticed that a lot of Dominicans have very poor spanish writing skills, I know this is to be expected from beach guys that dropped out of school when they were 12, but it is not just those guys. I noticed that a lot of well educated Dominicans (at least finished high school and attending university) have poor writing skills as well.
My old spanish teacher (a Dominican woman that has 2 university degrees of which one in spanish, even told me that when she attended university her TEACHER wrote vaca as baca...)

I know the DR is a poor country, but I've been to other poor Spanish countries as well (Guatemala, Mexico) and the educational systems wasnt so great there either, lots of drop-outs etc. But at least they could spell... (the ones that could read anyway)

So how come its so different in the DR?

Ezequiel · Aug 15, 2008

Princesa777 said:
I noticed that a lot of Dominicans have very poor spanish writing skills, I know this is to be expected from beach guys that dropped out of school when they were 12, but it is not just those guys. I noticed that a lot of well educated Dominicans (at least finished high school and attending university) have poor writing skills as well.
My old spanish teacher (a Dominican woman that has 2 university degrees of which one in spanish, even told me that when she attended university her TEACHER wrote vaca as baca...)

I know the DR is a poor country, but I've been to other poor Spanish countries as well (Guatemala, Mexico) and the educational systems wasnt so great there either, lots of drop-outs etc. But at least they could spell... (the ones that could read anyway)

So how come its so different in the DR?

I don't know where are you getting all that non-sense, a well educated Dominican has great writing still, even those who never finish high school have average writing skill.

Your old Spanish teacher went to the worst of the worst university if that is the case, i'll bet her writing skill is NOT that good either them.

BushBaby · Aug 15, 2008

May I refer the good Princesa777 to multitudes of posts here on DR1 where 'educated' people from many 'English Speaking' countries are also unable to spell? Punctuation, Grammar, ............. even CONTENT??? When I was in the United Kingdom last year I had the chance to see essays written by my nieces which were being compiled as 'Homework' - I was astounded at the spelling & grammatical mistakes they contained. When I queried same with my Mother (she wot brung me up proper like!!) she pointed out to me that this was now acceptable in schools, colleges & universities alike.

Bringing this back to the DR education system, it is hardly surprising that students don't learn to spell correctly - the teachers are paid a pittance which means only the HIGHLY dedicated few & the more uninspired become teachers, school books are often unavailable for students, classes work on the rote learning method ... i.e. word of mouth repetition system!!

Time for the 'elected' Government to invest the agreed amounts (4% of GNP) into the schooling system & try to encourage a desire to learn, integrity & the ability to use deductive reasoning from a very early age. That requires honesty & integrity on the Governments part I suppose so the chances of that coming to fruition is somewhat ..... BLEAK!! ~ Grahame.

The Virginian · Aug 15, 2008

We have seen both great and poor writing from Dominicans as well as Haitians. There is a mixture of quality. We have also learned that most Haitians are better educated than Dominicans. We hope the eductaion system here is improving. On a side note, Dominicans come to our home and ask for money, Haitians come and ask for work.

Ezequiel · Aug 15, 2008

The Virginian said:
We have seen both great and poor writing from Dominicans as well as Haitians. There is a mixture of quality. We have also learned that most Haitians are better educated than Dominicans. We hope the eductaion system here is improving. On a side note, Dominicans come to our home and ask for money, Haitians come and ask for work.

The Virginian, you have any proved that Haitians are better educated than Dominicans?

Who are the one in the intersection asking for money? HAITIANS

You don't know what you are talking about.

Bayx-** · Aug 15, 2008

Race has nothing to do with spelling….. come on. I had seen both Dominicans and Haitians in the intersection asking for money. I m not a good speller of English or Spanish and I attended school in both countries (DR & US). When it comes to spelling it has to do with ones ability to memorize, a lot of practice and one individual effort to become a better speller.

So it’s up to you to become a good speller …..

I’m still practicing

Princesa777 · Aug 15, 2008

Ezequiel said:
I don't know where are you getting all that non-sense, a well educated Dominican has great writing still, even those who never finish high school have average writing skill.

Your old Spanish teacher went to the worst of the worst university if that is the case, i'll bet her writing skill is NOT that good either them.

I got it from my own experience. I didnt say ALL Dominicans are bad spellers and certainly not that all well educated dominicans are bad spellers! But I think a surprising number has horrible writing skills, and I mean I dont speak perfect Spanish, so Im sure I make my share of mistakes too, but I know how to spell the easy words...

My spanish teacher went to a university in Santiago, I dont know which one, but she and her husband seem very intelligent and well educated, they run their own (semi-private) school and give spanish lessons to foreigners. I never catched her making any mistakes (but like I said, my spanish is not perfect)

I dont blame the Dominicans for their writing skills, its obviously a problem in the system of the public schools, but I wonder whats different about the educational systems in the DR then other poor spanish countries.
I had some friends in Guatemala, they were from the lower class, dropped out of school when they were 13 or so? But when I chat with them on MSN or something they write correct spanish. When i try to do this with a guy from the beach that is still going to high school or dropped out on a later age (like 15), its almost impossible to understand :ermm: (im not saying that the well educated people speak that bad, its just to show the difference in writing skills between 2 uneducated people in 2 poor countries.

I also agree its not surprising they dont learn how to spell correctly, I visited several (public) high schools for my thesis and taught english in one school too. (spend a lot of time on their spanish writing skills too...)
But I wonder what is do different about the DR educational system that it's so much worse than in other (poor) countries

Chip · Aug 15, 2008

BB, I hear what you are saying and I admit I have been guilty of misspelling. However, I think it is important to recognize that many who do post aren't the best "typer's" and are somewhat impatient in that they don't take the time to look up words in the dictionary that they are uncomfortable with.

To answer the op's question, I believe the problem is endemic and are the direct results of a substandard education system. To see what I mean check out this forum:

http://foro.univision.com/univision/board?board.id=republicadominicana

Alyonka · Aug 15, 2008

To write and spell properly one has to read a lot. For example, I don't read that much literature in English, and that is why I am not that good at creative writing in this language. I can only translate well, that is all.

I only met one Dominican who likes to read and write, and also does it well. Of course, there are some others on this board. The question would be: what percentage of Dominican population likes to read books and does it regularly?

dv8 · Aug 15, 2008

i'd say there are two reasons:
1. as alyonka mentioned - people do not practice enough, they do not read or write all that much.
2. they way native speakers learn the language. when i studied english i had to write short paragraphs every single day. letters of complain, reviews and so on. i never had to do half as much during polish classes.

margaret · Aug 15, 2008

Princesa777 said:
I got it from my own experience. I didnt say ALL Dominicans are bad spellers and certainly not that all well educated dominicans are bad spellers! But I think a surprising number has (have) horrible writing skills, and I mean I dont speak perfect Spanish, so Im sure I make my share of mistakes too, but I know how to spell the easy words...

My spanish teacher went to a university in Santiago, I dont know which one, but she and her husband seem very intelligent and well educated, they run their own (semi-private) school and give spanish lessons to foreigners. I never catched her making any mistakes (but like I said, my spanish is not perfect)

I dont blame the Dominicans for their writing skills, its obviously a problem in the system of the public schools, but I wonder whats different about the educational systems in the DR then other poor spanish countries.
I had some friends in Guatemala, they were from the lower class, dropped out of school when they were 13 or so? But when I chat with them on MSN or something they write correct spanish. When i try to do this with a guy from the beach that is still going to high school or dropped out on a later age (like 15), its almost impossible to understand :ermm: (im not saying that the well educated people speak that bad, its just to show the difference in writing skills between 2 uneducated people in 2 poor countries.

I also agree its not surprising they dont learn how to spell correctly, I visited several (public) high schools for my thesis and taught english in one school too. (spend a lot of time on their spanish writing skills too...)
But I wonder what is do different about the DR educational system that it's so much worse than in other (poor) countries

And you taught English in the Dominican Republic and wrote a thesis in English? :squareeye Sorry, but don't you think you should put more effort into your writing? Punctuation, capitalization, grammar. People who live in glass houses, shouldn't throw stones!

Ezequiel · Aug 15, 2008

Princesa777

I visited several (public) high schools for my thesis and taught english in one school too. (spend a lot of time on their spanish writing skills too...)

You spent time on your Spanish skill, not on their Spanish skill.

I don't believe you at all, you discredit yourself, with that comment (spend a lot of time on their Spanish writing skill too).

Public school in the DR are better than most private school, the best students are in public school on "Las pruebas nacionales" (Government administer national test) student from public schools scored higher than student from private schools.

People here speak about public school as if they know what are they talking about, but in reality 99% don't know nothing.

Princesa777 · Aug 15, 2008

margaret said:
And you taught English in the Dominican Republic and wrote a thesis in English? :squareeye Sorry, but don't you think you should put more effort into your writing? Punctuation, capitalization, grammar. People who live in glass houses, shouldn't throw stones!

Well, lol, I didnt say my English spelling is perfect either! Especially not typing on a forum. My thesis was not in English by the way (i dont think I said that?). I know a lot of people are not perfect in writing, but there is a difference between making typo's/just making some mistakes and not knowing how to spell a word.

My English teaching was as a volunteer, I have no degree in English, neither is English my first language.

@ Ezequiel Yes I spent time on my spanish skill as well and still have a lot to learn, which makes it only more shocking to me that I had to correct them so often on their spanish (writing). In particular they seemed to have a lot of trouble with the v/b and with putting the h (or not). To me thats pretty basic stuff???

Anyway I dont wanna waste this topic talking about me, I was just interested to know the reason why the spelling of some Dominicans was so bad (in comparison to people from other poor Spanish countries that had the same level of education). Some people gave some interesting suggestions already.

If you think 99% knows nothing about the public schools, then please inform me (us). I don't pretend to know everything about public schools, I can only speak from my own experience. I visited about 10 different schools (all on the north coast), but there are a 1000 (or more?) I didn't visit. And I'm always interested in new information and learning more, so come on

bob saunders · Aug 15, 2008

Ezequiel said:
Princesa777

You spent time on your Spanish skill, not on their Spanish skill.

I don't believe you at all, you discredit yourself, with that comment (spend a lot of time on their Spanish writing skill too).

Public school in the DR are better than most private school, the best students are in public school on "Las pruebas nacionales" (Government administer national test) student from public schools scored higher than student from private schools.

People here speak about public school as if they know what are they talking about, but in reality 99% don't know nothing.

How a student does on the nationals is more based on the student than where they went to school. Judging by the amount of students my wife has in her private school, and the amount of clients that she has that can barely rub two sticks together, most parents believe that her school is better than the public school. She has many clients that want her to expand to high school. It is true that there are private schools that are inferior to some public schools but this is not normally the case. Can you back up your statistics.

suarezn · Aug 16, 2008

I believe the biggest reason for the way we Dominicans do not write "well" has to do with the way we speak the language. People tend to write the way they speak...so for example Dominicans tend to leave the "s" out on words that end with it. We also substitute certain letters: B for v, S for z, for C and for X, etc...This probably explains why people from Guatemala even though poor would write a "better" form of Spanish.

Add to this the fact that different regions put their own spins on the language (i.e. People from El Cibao speak with the "i" everywhere - Lavai instead of lavar) and things get even more complicated.

So a typical Dominican says Baca instead of Vaca, asistensia instead of asistencia, se bende instead of se vende, etc...

Ezequiel · Aug 16, 2008

How a student does on the nationals is more based on the student than where they went to school.

It based both on the student and the school, if the students don't received the skills need it in Math, Science and Spanish, they will not preform well in the National Test.

Judging by the amount of students my wife has in her private school, and the amount of clients that she has that can barely rub two sticks together, most parents believe that her school is better than the public school.

Rich Dominican and middle/upper middle class Dominican just to say that they're paying an expensive private school will send their kids to the worst private school, you should know that if you live in the Dr.

It is true that there are private schools that are inferior to some public schools but this is not normally the case. Can you back up your statistics.

The majority of private school are not better than public school, most of the student in private school are rich kids that like to be pamper, and sometimes parents pay if the kid failed so the school pass their kids.

bob saunders · Aug 16, 2008

Ezequiel said:
It based both on the student and the school, if the students don't received the skills need it in Math, Science and Spanish, they will not preform well in the National Test.
------------ You are correct but it has been proven that the public schools in the DR are terrible at teaching math particularly and I'm still waiting for your proof that Public school s do it better than private.

Rich Dominican and middle/upper middle class Dominican just to say that they're paying an expensive private school will send their kids to the worst private school, you should know that if you live in the Dr.
--...... The majority of my wife's clients make 10,000 pesos or less per month, although a great deal receive money from relatives in Europe or the US. My wife's school is not expensive at 800 pesos per month, and that's with her including pencils, crayons, ....etc. I know there is a certain mentality in the DR that is pretentious and more concerned about appearances than results. Many of my wife's students have gone to those more expensive schools but when the child doesn't do well many of the parents will send them to her school because it has a reputation for teaching the basics well. Some parents will take their children out and put them in the Public school system because of money issues and most of them want to enroll them back with Yris the next year. I will be the first to admit, and she the second that there needs to be improvements within her own school in many aspects but like most private enterprises without government support, she has to make the changes when the money is available. She's not like the Catholic schools where they get subsidized by the government and still charge money to students. Many of Yris's Clients were students of hers who are now sending their children to be taught at her school.

The majority of private school are not better than public school, most of the student in private school are rich kids that like to be pamper, and sometimes parents pay if the kid failed so the school pass their kids.

This may happen in some private schools, it happens in public schools also. I know many teachers in the DR, Public and Private systems, as well as nuns and priests. The majority of Public schools are much better- I asked you for proof to back up your statements; where is it? No amount of money or pressure will make my wife pass a child that is not ready. If a parent tries that with her she will tell them to go away and take your child with you. It is obvious that you grew up poor and have a chip on your shoulder about it.
If you are going to make these statements back them up with proof.

A.Hidalgo · Aug 16, 2008

Ezequiel said:
It based both on the student and the school, if the students don't received the skills need it in Math, Science and Spanish, they will not preform well in the National Test.

Rich Dominican and middle/upper middle class Dominican just to say that they're paying an expensive private school will send their kids to the worst private school, you should know that if you live in the Dr.

The majority of private school are not better than public school, most of the student in private school are rich kids that like to be pamper, and sometimes parents pay if the kid failed so the school pass their kids.

You don't need a shovel you're doing quiet well.....keep digging.

Ezequiel · Aug 16, 2008

bob saunders said:
This may happen in some private schools, it happens in public schools also. I know many teachers in the DR, Public and Private systems, as well as nuns and priests. The majority of Public schools are much better- I asked you for proof to back up your statements; where is it? No amount of money or pressure will make my wife pass a child that is not ready. If a parent tries that with her she will tell them to go away and take your child with you. It is obvious that you grew up poor and have a chip on your shoulder about it.
If you are going to make these statements back them up with proof.

What better statistics that student from public school outpreform student from private school in the National Test admistered by the government.

What proved you have that student from private school do better than student from public school?

bob saunders · Aug 16, 2008

Ezequiel said:
What better statistics that student from public school outpreform student from private school in the National Test admistered by the government.

-------- I give up - prove by actually posting the statistics! Do you have the statistics to back up your statement.

What proved you have that student from private school do better than student from public school?

86% of my wife's students that start kindergarten with her finish Grade six at her school. This is the highest grade in her school. Many of her former students that went to her school who are now adults send their children to her school. This is pretty strong proof that at least her private school is doing the job well. I have talked to many students that go to the local Christian private school to learn English and I've been impressed at their language ability. Many of Yris's student leave to go to school in the USA where they do very well in school. Dominicans, especially poor ones, wouldn't spend their hard earned and valuable money on a private education if the public schools were as good - no further proof needed.

writing skills of Dominicans

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