A Dominican That Hates The Dr!!

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NALs

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Yeup!! All MY FATHER talks about is that "ir a santo domingo e a sufri" "uno no se relaja, mejor irse a la florida" "oigan, que lla no se puede vivir en santo domingo" and then after he reads the newspaper with some dominican news on it ( it's always negative, when something negative doesn't happens in the DR, the newspapers don't print anything about the DR - Listin Diario) he says "tu cre que yo me voi a ir pa santo domingo con la cosa asi? bulsheet!" and then he curses the country up and down. He also be complaining that he is not happy in the U.S. either as well as complaining about the "bendito frio". I would like to what nice things about the DR would be "strong" enough to curve his excessive negative view of his own country, the country that made it possible for him to be born and have an education (he got all his education including graduating from high school in the DR, but he doesn't thank the DR for that, eventhough if he would've never had gotten those basic educations, he was not going to be able to attend the university here in the U.S.) What would you say?
 

Talldrink

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Jan 7, 2004
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He's and old Dominican Man...

There is NO changing his mind at this point. My suggestion to you is to first, take it all with a grain of salt, and second, express your views and feelings on his derogative comments about the land you love. But you are pretty much stuck with this viewpoint until....
 

GilbertArenas

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Nal0whs said:
Yeup!! All MY FATHER talks about is that "ir a santo domingo e a sufri" "uno no se relaja, mejor irse a la florida" "oigan, que lla no se puede vivir en santo domingo" and then after he reads the newspaper with some dominican news on it ( it's always negative, when something negative doesn't happens in the DR, the newspapers don't print anything about the DR - Listin Diario) he says "tu cre que yo me voi a ir pa santo domingo con la cosa asi? bulsheet!" and then he curses the country up and down. He also be complaining that he is not happy in the U.S. either as well as complaining about the "bendito frio". I would like to what nice things about the DR would be "strong" enough to curve his excessive negative view of his own country, the country that made it possible for him to be born and have an education (he got all his education including graduating from high school in the DR, but he doesn't thank the DR for that, eventhough if he would've never had gotten those basic educations, he was not going to be able to attend the university here in the U.S.) What would you say?
I have some relatives like that......if you are in NY or Boston......have him move to Miami. It's a perfect in between. A few of my relatives have made their way from NYC and Boston down there and they are a lot happier.
 

theartofbone

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Yep..

My father is the same way. He moved to the US in the 70s and went back to the DR to study medicine in the 80s and when he went back he was discontent to a certain point. I mean, he liked the women of course with their nice shapes and attitudes, the food, etc... But he casually jokes around now that I'm living here doing the same, studying medicine and goes, 'Mijo, how are the dumbinicans' and I just start laughing and tell him that he's mean. But oh well, what can I do... :)
 

daddy1

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theartofbone said:
My father is the same way. He moved to the US in the 70s and went back to the DR to study medicine in the 80s and when he went back he was discontent to a certain point. I mean, he liked the women of course with their nice shapes and attitudes, the food, etc... But he casually jokes around now that I'm living here doing the same, studying medicine and goes, 'Mijo, how are the dumbinicans' and I just start laughing and tell him that he's mean. But oh well, what can I do... :)
The problem with our older generation Dominican parents and so on can only remember and go back to the days of Trujillo and live scared to ever return and live in the island, on top of that Dominicans directly born and raised in the country are all 95% closed minded! :ermm: and as you can see they are never satified even when they have it good, From my observation and now that I recently moved there they are not open to changes, not in music, food, clothes, hair styles, etc. I can see that it is our generation the 20 or 30 something generation that can shape the future in that island because others have betrayed it :angry: these so called Dominicans living in the U.S. believe they have it good but there at the bottom of the food chain scrapping for dollars in an old tired *** job! these natives are the worst enemies that the island have. you see them with there D.R. flag on there car, you see them in Parades, but ask them what do they give back to the future and the children of the island and they can't say a damm thing, :angry: you see Dominicans believe that the U.S. is great because they will give them $6.00 an hour to sweep an office building, but there are people in the island today that are real survivers because they invest back into the D.R. community, you see what makes D.R. a third world country is not money, but the people is why D.R. is third world, :rolleyes: the U.S. was third world back in the day :rolleyes: especially during the great depression, but it was the people who said!! I will better myself I demand free education, I demand free enterprise, I demand laws to protect my children and my investment, I live here so I might as well make this the best place a better place to live, they did not go to china, Japan and bad mouth the U.S. they invested in the country, demanded laws to better govern themselves, and civilized there culture...Are Dominicans trying to do this in the island yes, has it been easy NO! and the one's who leave and abandon there people, culture and children are just as if not twice as bad :angry:because now in there little mined they believe that anyone going back to the D.R. is clinically insane, these people even have Dominicans in the home land believe this theory!! and these illusions are causing these people to lose hope and confidence in there country! look you cannot have 8 million Dominicans move to the U.S Dominicans must help Dominicans, that means even the one's living outside the country, that is insane!!, it's like leaving your country and sending a nuclear bomb and saying oh well it was a horrible country anyway :angry: you see, you are the problem :angry: not politicians D.R. is the envy of the carribean more advanced then any other carribean nation including those nations that are not carribean like Afganistan, Venezuela, Brazil, and the list is enlist this nation is a nation of fighters that is still open for direction don't try to kill it's spirit, but try in helping it improve it's economy and it's education... in closing God bless the Dominican Republic - and those who bad mouth there own country always looking for the negative ask what have you done to improve it!!! this is from a man born and raised in the U.S. now living in the island to make a freaking difference.....SEE YA.
 
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Forbeca

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Nal0whs said:
Yeup!! All MY FATHER talks about is that "ir a santo domingo e a sufri" "uno no se relaja, mejor irse a la florida" "oigan, que lla no se puede vivir en santo domingo" and then after he reads the newspaper with some dominican news on it ( it's always negative, when something negative doesn't happens in the DR, the newspapers don't print anything about the DR - Listin Diario) he says "tu cre que yo me voi a ir pa santo domingo con la cosa asi? bulsheet!" and then he curses the country up and down. He also be complaining that he is not happy in the U.S. either as well as complaining about the "bendito frio".





It sounds like your dad is just not happy with his life period. It's like whereever you go, there you are type of thing.

Te aconsejo paciencia pues no hay otra alternativa. Dile que en la Republica se vive muy bien, si uno tiene una economia, su casa y todo lo que necesita no hay porque alterarce tanto. Entiendo que las cosas han cambiado mucho desde "sus dias" pero todavia la Republica es un lugar maravilloso para retirarse y vivir tranquilo. Si el no esta retirado todavia, puede ser que este impaciente y incomodo. Buena suerte.
 

amigomexicano

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D.R. is the envy of the carribean more advanced then any other carribean nation including those nations that are not carribean like Afganistan, Venezuela, Brazil, and the list is enlist this nation is a nation of fighters
Why do you consider the DR to be more "advanced" than Brazil ? I have never been to the DR but I have been to Brazil and what you're saying looks to me as basically the same as saying The Bahamas is more advanced than the USA. I have never been to the Bahamas either but I have been to the USA and I think the size of a country and it's resources can give us a very good idea of how "advanced" a country may be. Here's some facts about Brazil:

"Brazil is the fifth largest country in the world.", http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brazil

"Brazil's GDP (PPP) outweighs that of any other Latin American country (except Mexico)", see Economy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brazil

"According to the CIA World Factbook Brazil had the eleventh largest economy in the world at purchasing power parity in 2004", See Economy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brazil
 

hansbert

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Unfortunately I must say that your father is partly right. Within the last thirty or fourty years there has not been any real progress in the DR: e.g. until now they have not been able to solve their electricity problem, streets are still full of holes, the education system is a complete desaster. Nothing works out like it should: It is a chaotic thirld world state and will never improve inspite of the nice words of the politicians: They do not care about their own people. ** sentence insulting Dominicans edited ** But it requires a change of their basic attitude to life what - if ever- will not change within the next decades.
 
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Criss Colon

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What a "TWO FACE" You Are "Naals"!!!

You "post" like you are here in the DR! Like you are a Wealthy Dominican living the "Good Life" on "Los Casicasgos"! When your reality is that you live "somewhere" in Conn.
If you disagree with your father so strongly,"Come On Down" There is a need for the Dominican's "Educated Elite"?;) to return home and make the changes needed to prove your father wrong!!!
CCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCC

ps. "WHAT HANSBERT SAID!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"
 

miguel

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Jul 2, 2003
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Ok, ok!!

AZB said:
CC, this thread is older than your marriage.
AZB
It seems that Nals can not and will not get a break!.

I hate to see what will happen to Sunnie if she comes back to post after all the things that "THE DUKE" and a former friend of hers are saying about her. God help her!.
 

amigomexicano

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Regarding what you said about the DR being more "advanced" than Brazil which I'm 100% sure it's totally incorrect if your concept of "advanced" is the same as mine, I would like to add that I think the DR may actually become an "advanced" civilzation if the people change their attitude. This also applies to Brazil, Mexico and all third world countries (I'm from Mexico by the way). I think a positive attitude and starting to value the richness of your culture is a good start. I do think your father is wrong such as mine has always been with his outdated negative way of thinking about Latin America. Latin America has big problems but it also has had big causes for these problems from colonialism to US imperialism. Latin America has been robbed and cheated by foreigners and by politicians imposed by foreigners for centuries. Latin America has never been able to be really free from its oppresors. People have been kept ignorant for centuries for oppresors to exploit them. It's so sad that your father calls his people "Dumbinicans". Latin Americans aren't dumb. We're just uneducated. You can be sure there are more geniuses in Latin America than you think but they may be cleaning toilets or collecting trash because they didn't have an education to show their potential. I think the DR has potential but we have to improve education and get rid of ignorance first. By the way, ignorance also includes the xenophobic attitude toward Haitians that many Dominicans are said to have. As long as the DR keeps discriminating Haitians, it will be hard for others to consider you "advanced" like you think the DR is.
 

bob saunders

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amigomexicano said:
I do think your father is wrong such as mine has always been with his outdated negative way of thinking about Latin America. Latin America has big problems but it also has had big causes for these problems from colonialism to US imperialism. Latin America has been robbed and cheated by foreigners and by politicians imposed by foreigners for centuries. Latin America has never been able to be really free from its oppresors. People have been kept ignorant for centuries for oppresors to exploit them. It's so sad that your father calls his people "Dumbinicans". Latin Americans aren't dumb. We're just uneducated. QUOTE]

A good part of the problem is refusal to accept responsibility for the problems of your countries. Always the Americans are blamed or other foreigners. I'm not saying that there hasn't been outside influences that have negatively affected Latin Countries, but it's time for Latin countries and Latin people to accept responsibility for their problems and realize nobody can fix their problems except they themselves.
 

amigomexicano

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A good part of the problem is refusal to accept responsibility for the problems of your countries. Always the Americans are blamed or other foreigners. I'm not saying that there hasn't been outside influences that have negatively affected Latin Countries, but it's time for Latin countries and Latin people to accept responsibility for their problems and realize nobody can fix their problems except they themselves.
History shows clearly how Latin America has been negatively affected since colonization by Europeans. Advanced civilizations like the Aztecs and Incas as well as many others were destroyed to build much less advanced civilizations where social inequality, racism, ignorance and a double moral were imposed on the natives and the enslaved Africans (that's another story of barbarism in itself). Exploitation of resources by Europeans continued for centuries. This made the European countries rich and left the Latin American countries poor. After a while, Latin America was able to achieve independence from the Europeans but power changed to Criollos (descendants of Europeans) in most countries. These people continued to spread poverty and ignorance among the non-criollos and got rich by exploiting them. Then the US and other European countries started taking advantage of Latin America though invasions and unethical actions. The USA also started to control the presidents and politicians in most countries in order to continue exploiting our resources and our people. These puppet politicians have also taken advantage of US protection and weren't afraid to steal billions of dollars from our countries. It's not that we don't take responsibility for our actions. It's just that we aren't really responsible of the corruption of US imposed politicians in Latin America or for the exploitation our countries have suffered for centuries. Even though we are not responsible for others stealing our land and resources by taking advantage of our vulnerability, we will be responsible for solving the problems left to us by these others. Latin America is changing and when I go to Brazil I feel they are much more awake politically than, for example, my country, Mexico is. Mexico has a puppet president right now and his politics will only create bigger problems for the poor. Only the rich will get richer. But guess what?? When the poor get to be too poor, they rebel against the rich. Just look at all the problems in Mexico right now, kidnappings, drug dealing, robberies, guerrilla in Chiapas, gangs, etc. It's the poor's reaction to social exclusion and that will affect the rich in the end. There is no better politics than those that help the majority. Until now, Latin American politics have been designed to help the elite minority only. Brazil is still in the same situation but the Brazilian people are now trying to change this. On the other hand, most Mexicans are too brainwashed politically and aren't even aware that Mexico is going in the wrong direction, in my opinion. Again, I don't see why we should be responsible for the ignorance imposed upon us. I am lucky to have had an education, have traveled and learned but not all Latin Americans can have this opportunity, specially not the people at the bottom of the social ladder. Maybe I should shut my mouth since I have good living conditions but I really think there are lots of injustices in this world that have to be told. I really wish NOT to offend anybody with this post. There is good people on the other side too.
 
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Chris

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To answer the original question, perhaps if you come and live here Nals, you would have some nice things to say about the Dominican Republic to your father.

Any more insults to Dominicans and this thread is closed!
 

NALs

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Oooh Aaaah, the revelations....

I think CC got his answer to a previous question he asked me.

His question was what was I doing in the US, the answer was within a quick search.

Everybody has their day, I suppose.

Now that we got this cleared up, let's see what's next....:squareeye

-NALs
 

NALs

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amigomexicano said:
History shows clearly how Latin America has been negatively affected since colonization by Europeans. Advanced civilizations like the Aztecs and Incas as well as many others were destroyed to build much less advanced civilizations where social inequality, racism, ignorance and a double moral were imposed on the natives and the enslaved Africans (that's another story of barbarism in itself). Exploitation of resources by Europeans continued for centuries. This made the European countries rich and left the Latin American countries poor. After a while, Latin America was able to achieve independence from the Europeans but power changed to Criollos (descendants of Europeans) in most countries. These people continued to spread poverty and ignorance among the non-criollos and got rich by exploiting them. Then the US and other European countries started taking advantage of Latin America though invasions and unethical actions. The USA also started to control the presidents and politicians in most countries in order to continue exploiting our resources and our people. These puppet politicians have also taken advantage of US protection and weren't afraid to steal billions of dollars from our countries. It's not that we don't take responsibility for our actions. It's just that we aren't really responsible of the corruption of US imposed politicians in Latin America or for the exploitation our countries have suffered for centuries. Even though we are not responsible for others stealing our land and resources by taking advantage of our vulnerability, we will be responsible for solving the problems left to us by these others. Latin America is changing and when I go to Brazil I feel they are much more awake politically than, for example, my country, Mexico is. Mexico has a puppet president right now and his politics will only create bigger problems for the poor. Only the rich will get richer. But guess what?? When the poor get to be too poor, they rebel against the rich. Just look at all the problems in Mexico right now, kidnappings, drug dealing, robberies, guerrilla in Chiapas, gangs, etc. It's the poor's reaction to social exclusion and that will affect the rich in the end. There is no better politics than those that help the majority. Until now, Latin American politics have been designed to help the elite minority only. Brazil is still in the same situation but the Brazilian people are now trying to change this. On the other hand, most Mexicans are too brainwashed politically and aren't even aware that Mexico is going in the wrong direction, in my opinion. Again, I don't see why we should be responsible for the ignorance imposed upon us. I am lucky to have had an education, have traveled and learned but not all Latin Americans can have this opportunity, specially not the people at the bottom of the social ladder. Maybe I should shut my mouth since I have good living conditions but I really think there are lots of injustices in this world that have to be told. I really wish NOT to offend anybody with this post. There is good people on the other side too.
Now, for a more "on topic" post:

The lack of extensive development in LA has been attributed to all things ranging from the colonization (which does not explains why the other areas of the world colonized by the Europeans developed into thriving economies) to corruption to what ever will be in vague of discussion among the intellectuals.

However, it's clear that the lack of extensive development in LA has been due to a lack in interest to create such development. Blame this on whatever anyone wants to blame it on, development or lack of such is the result of peoples desires in such society, by people I mean those in power.

This also begs the question to be asked: What exactly do people mean by development?

In many ways, a bohio was the ultimate in Taino living. Why would such lifestyle be considered backward today? Why would such lifestyle not be considered development? Does an entire society has to conform to eurocentric definitions of development in order to be considered developed?

Regarding Mexico, it's a 50/50. Mexico has gained tremendous advantages via the NAFTA. Most of Mexico's losses were mostly restricted in the agricultural sector and those sectors were directly affected by subsidies maintained in North American farms. An example of this would be the demise of the varieties of maize that was grown in Mexico by small and large landholders. Today, much of the maize being sold in Mexico is of the variation(s) used in the United States, which is overproduced due to subsidies that artificially keep the cost of farming in the US below its actual cost, thus increasing profitability.

Much of the over production in first world agriculture is later dumped into the international market, depressing food prices on a global scale. Guess what, developing nations have a greater advantage in farming and food products make the majority of exports in many developing countries. However, many of those countries are not able to reap the benefits of such, thanks in part to subsidies in the developed world allowing for overproduction of foodstuff that developing countries can do better, faster, and easier and gain from trade of those foods sold on the international market.

Why are farms in developed nations subsidized? A combination of special interest groups pressuring the governments to keep the subsidies and the average citizen in "love" with the countryside that they don't want to see those farm disappear. Southern France is able to look like Southern France at the expense of Mali, Nigeria, Haiti, etc.

Refering back to Mexico, Mexico gained well in the places expected. In the places where it did not gained, was mostly due to unfair practices beyond the realm of free market and free trade.

Free trade works, only when it really exist.
-NALs
 

Texas Bill

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iT'S ABOUT "SUBSIDIES"

That we continue to branch into discussions that are, while seemingly relevent, are not really germane to the subject of the threads as originaly proposed.
Like NALS, I could post a VERY LONG response regarding the history and reasons behind the farm subsidies in the USA and European community. But, we all know the reasons behind those subsidies and their effects on the world of "free trade". And, that "free trade" is a relatively new development in the economic theories that have existed in the past.
We are debating the issue during it's development and rightfully so. It is the vehicle and the platform of debate that the pluses and minuses relative to a new theory are eventually resolved and accepted by the world community.
Since we, here, are not privy to the decision making process regarding acceptance, or non-acceptance, of the new theory, it becomes academic as to acceptance of our thoughts and comments regarding the subject.
It does lend itself to invigorating and entertaining discussion, however.
I propose a NEW thread in which the pluses and minuses of "subsidies" and their relationship to the DR agriculture industry vis-a-vis the US and EU are discussed freely and openly.

Anyone want to start such a thread???
NALS where are you???
Get with the "program".
It should prove interesting. (and take up a lot of broadband).

Texas Bill
 

pkaide1

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All of you should read the following book "Manual del perfecto idiota latinoamericano" (Manual of the perfec latin american) by by Plinio A. Mendoza, Carlos Alberto Montaner, Alvaro V. Llosa and then mum the words
 
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