Another Dominican drowns - Ode to Miguel

[Lambada]

And CCcc sounds like he knows exactly how it feels. The Kid is not ashamed.

Nor should anyone be ashamed, it can happen to any of us, but it does take courage to publically acknowledge one's experience with depression and such acknowledgement is one of the markers of recovery.

When we first moved here I thought along the lines of Mirador that there was far less mental illness here than in my country of origin UK. (I won't comment on US because I'd tend to agree with Mirador that there is a greater readiness to define a situation as needing psychiatric intervention there than here in DR). But now I'm not so sure whether my first perceptions were accurate. Maybe because many Dominicans don't open up until you've been here a long time as a foreigner and I now have so I'm hearing more, maybe because my understanding of the language is better now so I'm understanding more or maybe there are now more instances of reactive depression like TEHAMA's friend Miguel than there were 15 years ago. Certainly I'm aware of more now than I was then.

 

[TEHAMA]

Oh Boy!!

A friend just called to tell me of these new postings. Prior to a few nights ago, I hadnt been on DR1 in years. First, I want to say thank you to all the expressed sympathies. I do appreciate it. Secondly, I was very surprised to see that this thread was not closed, locked, or deleted for my rant and slam of the country.

Those of you who have been on DR1 a while might recall that I was the one to coin the term ADD Anti-Dominicano Days. I would have these days atleast twice a month and would lock the gate and not want to see ANY Dominican, including Miguel (he had his moments on my shtt-list too).

I grew up in the South as a second generation removed from sharecropping. I remember days slopping hogs and feeding the chickens. Some would say we were poor but didnt feel much like it. Because my country invests in education and betterment of all citizens (and also along with my desire and hardwork), I have a more prosperous exsistence today.

In short, Miguel as well as many others were me. It gets a little fizzy when one fails to recognize true conditions and behaviors of poverty versus those of any ethnic group or nationality. I dont know why and we will never know really why he jumped. When I was told of the suicide I wasnt surprised. The only part that did surpise me was the method. I just knew it would have been some atttempt to reach Puerto Rico.

Thank you for allowing me "yet again" to rant and stomp. There is a bit of comfort knowing that a few other people now know he existed.

You may now close this thread.
TEHAMA

 

[laurapasinifan]

we all develop our thoughts in our own life settings....and as such I can accept people thinking different than me. I know that I havent lived other peoples lives and i dont know their pressures and thoughts. I THINK I have an idea on most issues.....and as such I dont know how anyone can pick suicide if they are healthy. I have always thought it to be the lazy persons way of dealing with their problems. They dont want the responsibility or dont think they can take the mental pressure...so they cop out. That is just the way i feel about it.

Know that I feel bad for the person and more so I feel bad for the persons friends and family who now start their suffering.

I have had a friend and a few people I know good commit suicide.

I know the valleys and the peaks of life.. and the goal is to rise out if the valleys when you are in them...we all can go into that cycle....the people with good lives and a huge group of caring family and friends probably has peaks and valleys that vary little...nice life to have.

anyway i am sorry for you loss , and understand that you have this big quaetion mark in your mind, I hope you find peace trying to solve that question mark

bob

 

[manunut]

black clouds of the mind............

me too like c.colon have fought the demon that is clinical depression more than once in my life.
with me it was origionally brought on severley by a very traumatic event as a teenager.
i never had or recieved the "correct" counceling for this illness even though i was living through thelions share of it in europe.
out side of a big city and also at times within a city,the 'correct"counceling just cannot be found.
i went to see some national health physchiatrists (2)and they were useless i have to say.
i was on anti depressents,they helped for a while though i did suffer the side affects of a big gain in weight,night mares(terrifing ones,which i just learned to live with,EVERY night) and after my first visit to the shrink wher in my opinion all she did was ask me a bunch of inane questions.the majorety of which seemed to lean towards trying to find if i had been sexually abused as a child(which i was not,well apart from my encounters with the 5 fingered widow
at the end of the session,not once did she try to offer me any adviseon how to beat it or even ask me what 'i" thought sparked it.
it was real 'supermarket'physicatiry.
and i got NOTHING out of it.
my parting question was,(with both of us standing up to leave)was "well what do you suggest i do?".to which she replied,"get a life!!!".
this is why in my family we kind of shun these 'SO CALLED PROFFESSIONALS".
and find a good talk with a family member or a pair of ears from a concerned friend helps more than any of these guys who are getting paid to 'help"you.
i have had a nbr of friends/accuantinces who have taken their lives as they just couldent see any light at the end of the tunnel.
again imo,lonlieness is the biggest killer of all amongst ANY age group.
thats why i give and still to this day need the moral support of family or a genuine good friend."man was not ment to be alone".
and although,after the fact,it can seem a little........hurtfull???...for want of a better word to speculate why a human being makes this FINAL choice,MY hunch is that the majorety who do,feel terribly,terribly lonely and that nobody will miss them and life alone just aint worth living.
hence,if they want it i ALLWAYS have time for a word with anybody i encounter.as my dear old mother says,"you never really know whats going on in a persons head".and more so if you never take the time to ask!
may God rest the souls of all those who have taken this very sad and LONELY way out.R.I.P.all.............

 

[Mirador]

As a practicing folk healer, with extensive empirical knowlege working with people suffering from mental and emotional dissorders, and considering the interest this current thread on suicide and depression has inspired, I would like to suggest starting a separate thread on mental health issues in general in the DR. Any takers?

 

[Chris]

Put it in living Mirador. We seem to have everything from curtains to cars to crazies there. If it turns to a debate, I'll turn it over. :speechles

 

[Lambada]

at the end of the session,not once did she try to offer me any adviseon how to beat it or even ask me what 'i" thought sparked it.
it was real 'supermarket'physicatiry.
and i got NOTHING out of it.
my parting question was,(with both of us standing up to leave)was "well what do you suggest i do?".to which she replied,"get a life!!!".

That is quite atrocious. Was this in UK? The psychiatrist not asking you what you thought caused it is incredibly stupid and a waste of resources since you would know better than anyone else what caused it. As for 'get a life'..........well, I'm speechless. That sort of flip remark could easily have driven you over the edge. Sounds like she was totally unprepared to feel any of your pain and that is a very basic requirement in someone who is in a 'helping' role.

Yes Mirador I'd be interested. Particularly in hearing what it is you do. I know a little about mental health issues but next to nothing about the types of healing you might use, other than reaching out as a fellow human being, of course. And I do feel woefully lacking about setting that in its cultural context.

 

[Motorcycler]

Nor should anyone be ashamed, it can happen to any of us, but it does take courage to publically acknowledge one's experience with depression and such acknowledgement is one of the markers of recovery.

Lambada you are definitely correct. One has to face it and in public. Many years ago I went through an extended time in these proceedings, then I got my bike and that helped me to get off the bandwagon as I began to look at life different.

Now I say like Geronimo...."Es mejor joder que estar jodio"... Geronimo is a local street philosopher whose wit is unequivocal. Translated for the benefit of those that might be wandering it means...it is better to "joder" (have fun, make havoc, life live to the max) than is it to be "jodio" (to be down in the dumps, screwed up, or out of sync). It's all about the decisions we make...

 

[Mirador]

I just read the description of Manunut gave of his encounter with the ?supermarket shrink?, as he mentioned, including the interpretation of the shrink?s useless banter, insensitivity, and parting remark of ?get a life!?, that he got in lieu of ?therapy?. A also read Lambada?s ?quite atrocious? reaction to it all. This brought to memory an incident when my then teenage son, Alan, witnessed his best friend placing the barrel of a gun into his mouth and pulling the trigger. As a result, Alan lost the ability to speak. He carried on like this for over two weeks, writing down on a pad whatever he needed to communicate. Suffice to say he could not even go to school. In the meantime, I researched all the available shrinks in town, and was recommended a psychiatrist who worked mostly with small children but had experienced with this sort of cases. I called the doctor and set up an appointment. Upon the appointment, I ushered Alan into the doctor's office, and sat down in the waiting room. Thirty minutes had not passed, when Alan stormed out of the doctor's office, swearing, and cursing bloody murder, things like ?what a f****ng s.o.b. the doctor was", etc., etc... I was astounded, no, more like ecstatic!. Alan was speaking!!! To this day, Alan denies the fact that the shrink had anything to do with his cure.

 

[manunut]

si.

That is quite atrocious. Was this in UK? The psychiatrist not asking you what you thought caused it is incredibly stupid and a waste of resources since you would know better than anyone else what caused it. As for 'get a life'..........well, I'm speechless. That sort of flip remark could easily have driven you over the edge. Sounds like she was totally unprepared to feel any of your pain and that is a very basic requirement in someone who is in a 'helping' role.

Yes Mirador I'd be interested. Particularly in hearing what it is you do. I know a little about mental health issues but next to nothing about the types of healing you might use, other than reaching out as a fellow human being, of course. And I do feel woefully lacking about setting that in its cultural context.

yes this was in the U.K.
on that particular day it did not drive me over the edge.i just felt i had wasted my time that day,and felt nothing more than comtempt for the fat smug bitch as i saw her leave in her big fat car.
a couple of months later however i did try and ?fast track?my way to my maker.
got pulled out of a river and was sent to a mental institution where i had a sitting with some African,what seemed like teenage shrinks.i told them what had happened when i visited this ?tough love?,?give yourself a shake?cow,and low and behold she was the senior at this hospital.
next day i came face to face with this idiot after the student shrinks reported to her and she tried pulling me up on what i said saying she never said it.in front of them all i told her not to lie and that?get a life is EXACTLY what she said.
to which she retorted,?well i dident mean it in the context you took it?.
she knew she said it and was trying not to look bad in front of the,excuse me,but useless African kid shrinks.
the hospital facility stank too and i was glad to leave.they were glad to see me go too as IT IS a nbrs game with these inadequite incompassionate fools.and my bed was free for another lost soul.
gladly whith the help of family ALONE and a little will power from myself the clouds lifted.
but with absolutley NO THANKS to the so called ?medical staff?.
and yet we wonder why suicide accounts per anum, for more deaths than corony disese and road accidents combined in numerous european countries.:angry: :angry:

 

[Mirador]

....Yes Mirador I'd be interested. Particularly in hearing what it is you do. I know a little about mental health issues but next to nothing about the types of healing you might use, other than reaching out as a fellow human being, of course. And I do feel woefully lacking about setting that in its cultural context.

Lambada, I don't think I'm capable of explaining to you what it is I do, as a "folk healer". Those in my rural social milieu, would say I'm a "mellizo" (which has nothing to do with twin births...) or I have the "Misterios". However, I've surprisingly discovered that some of my procedures and methods correspond to elements originating in the Tungus, Siberia, and observable in certain Amazonian tribes. Notwithstanding, methodologically, I consider myself more scientific that intuitive. In my healing, I don't "reach out to fellow human beings", I'm actually unmerciful. However, I would spend hours (or days) with a person to avoid his taking his life, or that of others, the later being the most exhausting and challenging for me...

 

[Lambada]

Lambada, I don't think I'm capable of explaining to you what it is I do, as a "folk healer". Those in my rural social milieu, would say I'm a "mellizo" (which has nothing to do with twin births...) or I have the "Misterios". However, I've surprisingly discovered that some of my procedures and methods correspond to elements originating in the Tungus, Siberia, and observable in certain Amazonian tribes. Notwithstanding, methodologically, I consider myself more scientific that intuitive. In my healing, I don't "reach out to fellow human beings", I'm actually unmerciful. However, I would spend hours (or days) with a person to avoid his taking his life, or that of others, the later being the most exhausting and challenging for me...

OK let me try a different question: do you receive special insights which enable you to diagnose? And how much is the patient/subject/person afflicted an active tool in the treatment/healing?

Maybe this should go on the mental health thread you were thinking of starting........?