Chinese in the DR

[Ogre of the Caribbean]

Gorgon, in what condition would have been Curacao, Aruba and our beloved Jamaica without ....

This isn't 1910. But, China still acts like it is. The UK doesn't treat its subjects in Bermuda the way it did in the 1700s; the British government doesn't treat the native white British population like it did in the 1700s, but the Chinese do treat people (including their own) like it was.

People who don't really know history are the first to weaponize it.

Try these crybaby antics with the Chinese and see where it gets you. Most likely you would end unemployed and homeless, but not before the Chinese punished you physically...

 

[Ogre of the Caribbean]

I would like to add, that if you look at ex-British colonies, the British granted most of them independence in the 1940s, 50s, and 60s. The British left behind a modern infrastructure, universities, public schools, hospitals, power plants, etc. These colonies were cut loose and allowed to keep the infrastructure (even though many ex-colonies have failed to maintain it properly, if at all) and government institutions like a civil service, legal system, and police (fully staffed by the locals).

The Chinese have zero intention of ever letting go. And this is 2018. Do the Chinese really behave the same as the Americans and the British? Trying to paint certain countries in the same light is idiotic. The attempt to do so only shows a complete lack of knowledge and intelligence.

You have been warned(repeatedly). I can't believe some people still harbor illusions about the Chinese government. It's not just ridiculous, it's dangerous.

 

[RDKNIGHT]

what do you imply when you say ''mess with''? in respect to what? politically? economically? socially? militarily?

what?

Econmicall for sure than Miltarily they will run threw DR in 1 hour if not for the USA

 

[SteveK]

Wow....you hammered it

 

[CristoRey]

This weekend some delegation of senators from NY are visiting the DR to ‘update themselves’ on the Haitian issue. When was the last time the politicians of any country made special visits to the US to monitor the treatment of illegals? Exactly, that’s a foreign intromission the US wouldn’t tolerate.

China doesn't care about social justice warriors or human rights issues. This is common knowledge for
anyone who's ever lived on that side of the planet. Cambodia's Prime Minister Mr. Hun Sen recently got so ****ed off at the US over their meddling in Cambodia's domestic affairs (politics and human rights) that he told them they are not going to repay the remaing $295 million left over from the $500 million loan they received during the Vietnam era. In turn Hun Sen has welcomed the Chine$e into the country with open arms.

Now the entire country is being raped and pillaged by the Chinese and only a hand full of corrupt politicians are reaping the benefits while most of the general population is suffering huge losses due to his decision.

I don't want to sound paranoid but the political atmosphere down here makes this county ripe for the Chinese pickins.

 

[cbmitch9]

China doesn't care about social justice warriors or human rights issues. This is common knowledge for
anyone who's ever lived on that side of the planet. Cambodia's Prime Minister Mr. Hun Sen recently got so ****ed off at the US over their meddling in Cambodia's domestic affairs (politics and human rights) that he told them they are not going to repay the remaing $295 million left over from the $500 million loan they received during the Vietnam era. In turn Hun Sen has welcomed the Chine$e into the country with open arms.

Now the entire country is being raped and pillaged by the Chinese and only a hand full of corrupt politicians are reaping the benefits while most of the general population is suffering huge losses due to his decision.

I don't want to sound paranoid but the political atmosphere down here makes this county ripe for the Chinese pickins.

Sadly, the DR politicians from the ruling party will be ok with that as long as they get their little "propinas".

 

[cbmitch9]

mitch, i would be the last guy to root for the Chinese, because i get reports of how they operate in places like Jamaica. however, i do not see any evidence of any developed country doing the right thing by any developing country, or having done the right thing in the past.

Again G, you are correct. The only portion of the developed countries that are benefitted are the World Bank, IMF, and big foreign businesses. I am sure you are aware of what happened to the Jamaican dairy industry a few years ago due to an IMF deal. I am also sure you are aware of what happened in JA a few decades ago also, where the importing of Chinese workers caused an issue ( I think it was in the garment industry if memory serves me well). So, you are correct. It's a free for all in the sense that most developed countries only look after their interests and nothing is done due to their overwhelming benevolence. I truly mean it when I say that I hope that the DR fares better than the other the countries that have had bad experiences with the Chinese goverment, but I doubt it very much and I would very much love to be proven wrong.

 

[the gorgon]

Again G, you are correct. The only portion of the developed countries that are benefitted are the World Bank, IMF, and big foreign businesses. I am sure you are aware of what happened to the Jamaican dairy industry a few years ago due to an IMF deal. I am also sure you are aware of what happened in JA a few decades ago also, where the importing of Chinese workers caused an issue ( I think it was in the garment industry if memory serves me well). So, you are correct. It's a free for all in the sense that most developed countries only look after their interests and nothing is done due to their overwhelming benevolence. I truly mean it when I say that I hope that the DR fares better than the other the countries that have had bad experiences with the Chinese goverment, but I doubt it very much and I would very much love to be proven wrong.

just look at what happened to the Haitian rice industry if you want an example of developed country ''benevolence''. as far as the Chinese are concerned, when they do an infrastructure project, they want 50% of the workforce to be Chinese.

 

[NALs]

just look at what happened to the Haitian rice industry if you want an example of developed country ''benevolence''. as far as the Chinese are concerned, when they do an infrastructure project, they want 50% of the workforce to be Chinese.

In countries where construction workers are mostly nationals that could be a problem, but the DR denationalized its construction workers a few decades ago.

 

[Ogre of the Caribbean]

In countries where construction workers are mostly nationals that could be a problem, but the DR denationalized its construction workers a few decades ago.

If you are worried about Haitian immigration, it is because you are worried about national sovereignty and maintaining cultural identity. These are valid concerns. However, striking a Faustian Deal with the Chinese government is not the way to deal with it.

 

[Juan Bosch]

Many miss the point that the problem is not the new diplomatic initiative with China or whomever....it's the pervasive political corruption that already exist here.....yesterday it was the Brazilians....

 

[Ogre of the Caribbean]

Many miss the point that the problem is not the new diplomatic initiative with China or whomever....it's the pervasive political corruption that already exist here.....yesterday it was the Brazilians....

I think most of the posters on this thread are very aware of the corruption in the DR. That's why so many people are deeply concerned that the corrupt political class in this country will not be able resist lining their pockets at the expense of the country. And this time the damage will be much greater than any other previous scandal. This could all lead to a lose of territory and inflict permanent damage to the country's national sovereignty.

 

[NALs]

El Salvador is the newest country to see the light.

[video=youtube;1_VXHO_P-zI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_VXHO_P-zI[/video]

 

[NALs]

Not surprisingly, a month ago the American ambassador to El Salvador bad mouthed China's investments and claims they will not benefit the U.S. colony, I mean El Salvador. Her arguments are the same ones expressed in this thread by some DR1ers that prefer U.S. colonialism to any other. I'm going to take a leap and guess that the U.S. ambassador is the only one in San Salvador that felt the need to say anything about the increasing China-El Salvador diplomatic relationship. Not the French, the Spanish, the Italian, the Mexican, etc ambassadors; only the US one. Hmm, wonder why...

[video=youtube;DPps4yV5uiE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPps4yV5uiE[/video]

In the 1970's the U.S. established diplomatic ties with mainland China and broke ties with Taiwan. No one was bothered by that. Now the U.S. is 'worried' for the 'good of the countries' the U.S. had all to itself in terms of being able to seriously influence and pressure to do what the U.S. wanted. China poses a threat to that power.

 

[NALs]

I remember posting the Spanish version of this interview, but I'm not sure if it was in this thread. Now there's a translated version. At about 1:40 the Representative of China's Commercial Interests in the DR responds to US criticisms of the established DR-China relationship. The video isn't long, so it makes sense to simply watch the whole thing.

[video=youtube;85MbiXos_gs]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=85MbiXos_gs[/video]

 

[Ogre of the Caribbean]

With Cambodia, Pakistan, Sri Lanka, and a string (or belt) of other nations already mired in debt traps, there is nothing to applaud here. I think one poster said it well when he said some of this countries thought they could trick China into giving away billions in free loans, when in reality, the citizens of these entrapped now realize what a terrible mistake it was to accept Chinese loans. All El Salvador is doing is sticking its head in the tiger's mouth.

A quick investigation of China's loan deals prove me right. That some countries are still willing to accept these loans is not proof of naivety, but of the gross corruption of the political classes and their complete disregard for the future of their own countrymen.

 

[Ogre of the Caribbean]

Sigh

It looks like the mega project that the ruling party wants is nothing but a white elephant--not to mention a license to steal for local politicians. Taiwan's foreign ministry spokesman had plenty to say:

He said El Salvador had been continuously asking for “massive funding support” since last year for a port development, but Taiwan was unable to assist with the “unsuitable project” after assessment.

Wu said Tuesday that El Salvador had repeatedly sought large amounts of funding from Taiwan for a port project that a Taiwanese team of engineers dispatched by the government thought wasn't economically feasible.

But wait, it gets worse. China is bankrolling the ruling political party in exchange for the county's (rapidly dimming) future.

El Salvador's decision also drew criticism from the domestic opposition.

"The position from Taiwan is that the government of the FMLN (Sanchez Ceren's political party) asked it for money to finance the campaign in 2019," said lawmaker Margarita Escobar of the conservative Arena party. "That is called selling sovereignty and allowing another state to intervene in the internal affairs of El Salvador."

"I do not support this erroneous decision," said Guillermo Gallegos of the Grand Alliance for National Unity. "I would qualify it as sad and regrettable."

Norman Quijano, a legislator from the conservative Arena party and president of the country's congress, called the move "a betrayal of a friendly country."

It appears Beijing hasn't paid off everyone-- yet.

So much for not interfering in a country's domestic affairs...

 

[CristoRey]

It appears Beijing hasn't paid off everyone-- yet.

Not a shread of doubt in my mind...
its happening as we speak.

 

[NALs]

Chinese and Chinese-Dominicans seem hopeful new relationship with China will produce benefits.

[video=youtube;HzSR7Z8uwSI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HzSR7Z8uwSI[/video]

 

[Ogre of the Caribbean]

What would Lando say?

[video=youtube;A-sA-NqMlvI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-sA-NqMlvI[/video]