Coronavirus - In the DR

windeguy

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Jul 10, 2004
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My understanding of herd immunity is all safeguards are removed and its basically let it kill those it will and the animals left get herd immunity.
Respected experts have denounced herd immunity as "dangerous and nonsense".
It is a 100 year old theory misapplied from agriculture.
I am not aware it has ever worked as theorized in humans.

People who reject masks, curfews, social distancing, hand washing and demand immediate reopening of business in general are herd immunity supporters whether they realize it or not.

In order to be in the testing process the vaccines must have already shown they are effective.
The trials are not to determine effectiveness but to ensure safety.
Imagine a vaccine that protects you against CV19 but leads to increased heart disease.
They know the vaccines work or the companies would not be spending millions of dollars to test.

Even when a vaccine has proven to work without any side effects there will always be naysayers who refuse to take it.
Annual flu vaccine is only taken by about 50% of the population and its safety and efficacy is beyond question and there are years of problem free experience as proof.
It will be very interesting to see how many people will get a CV19 vaccine shot.
It may well be that we will need much less of the vaccine than anticipated which will facilitate distribution.

The world will always have those that row upstream.
Look at how many people in the DR that smoke in the face of the overwhelming evidence.

People are fascinating.
No that is not the only truth about herd immunity. It is reached by a combination of those infected by the disease who develop long term immunity and those inoculated by an effective and long lasting vaccine. It could be just those infected, but that is not what we are talking about now.

They actually do not know how long vaccines will last because it takes more than one year to know if a vaccine lasts for one year. Nobody has a time machine to shorten that period. They can make educated guesses and hope they are correct. We have not found a way to shorten time.

Because CV19 is so infectious, estimates I have seen to reach herd immunity are in the 65% range to contain the further spread. Higher than the common flus. So more vaccines will be needed to the tune of 65% of the world's population. Quite difficult that will be.

That said, we will have no idea how long any immunity will last for a couple of years.
 

Squat

Tropical geek in Las Terrenas
Jan 1, 2002
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I'm sure you're aware a very large wedding in Punta Cana is considered to be one of the original sources for the pandemic here in the DR, right?
While I am indeed aware, something doesn't seem right. Here in LT, no one respects measures, and no one gets sick. You see all those Capitaleños, also people from SF de Macoris, they show up like crazy for booze parties, all the time, non-stop... No mask, no measures. No sick people, no one b!tches about how they got the virus in LT. Something I just don't understand, it's like a mistery...
 
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JDJones

Moderator - Covid 19 in DR & North Coast
Jan 7, 2016
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While I am indeed aware, something doesn't seem right. Here in LT, no one respects measures, and no one gets sick. You see all those Capitaleños, also people from SF de Macoris, they show up like crazy for booze parties, all the time, non-stop... No mask, no measures. No sick people, no one b!tches about how they got the virus in LT. Something I just don't understand, it's like a mystery....
I don't have an answer for you. But we all know it takes a few days for symptoms to manifest themselves.

Maybe they come and party all weekend, go home then the following week it strikes. Maybe the majority of them are asymptomatic.

And it's not a reach to think some did get sick and are keeping quiet about it to avoid being splashed all over the dailies.

Your guess is as good as mine.
 
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zoomzx11

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Jan 21, 2006
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As far as I know the Regeneron "cocktail" is not available to the general public in any country. It is available to certain Presidents.

As the virus vaccines become closer to available there is some news over the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines and what may well cause problems for poorer countries like the DR.
Both of the above vaccines require they be stored at minus 95 degrees.
This is going to make distribution and transportation difficult.


Does the DR even own a freezer capable of negative 95?
Adding to the problem is that these two vaccines require two injections with a time in between shots.
The additional time between shots will mean the vaccines will have to be stored longer requiring more special freezers.

Hopefully some of the other producers will have a vaccine that is one injection only and does not require extreme cold storage.

It may well be that the minus 95 requirement will mean that the cost of administering the vaccine will be much greater than the cost of producing it.
 

zoomzx11

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Jan 21, 2006
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No that is not the only truth about herd immunity. It is reached by a combination of those infected by the disease who develop long term immunity and those inoculated by an effective and long lasting vaccine. It could be just those infected, but that is not what we are talking about now.

They actually do not know how long vaccines will last because it takes more than one year to know if a vaccine lasts for one year. Nobody has a time machine to shorten that period. They can make educated guesses and hope they are correct. We have not found a way to shorten time.

Because CV19 is so infectious, estimates I have seen to reach herd immunity are in the 65% range to contain the further spread. Higher than the common flus. So more vaccines will be needed to the tune of 65% of the world's population. Quite difficult that will be.

That said, we will have no idea how long any immunity will last for a couple of years.
It looks like the US with the worlds worst response to the virus has herd immunity as the unofficial policy.
Quite clear as to what does not work.
The virus caused the near world wide economic collapse except for China which is seeing an economic upswing between 3 and 4 percent.
Any rational person think China stopped the virus by opening the bars , schools and public gatherings asap?
Naw, they watched others fail then did the opposite.
I am buoyed up by the DR response and think we may well see a healthy uptick in tourism.
Lot of people worldwide in desperate need of a vacation and it looks like the airline industry is banking on the DR.
Hope they got it right.
 
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bob saunders

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Jan 1, 2002
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It looks like the US with the worlds worst response to the virus has herd immunity as the unofficial policy.
Quite clear as to what does not work.
The virus caused the near world wide economic collapse except for China which is seeing an economic upswing between 3 and 4 percent.
Any rational person think China stopped the virus by opening the bars , schools and public gatherings asap?
Naw, they watched others fail then did the opposite.
I am buoyed up by the DR response and think we may well see a healthy uptick in tourism.
Lot of people worldwide in desperate need of a vacation and it looks like the airline industry is banking on the DR.
Hope they got it right.
China hasnt stopped the virus.
 

CDNBear

Banned
Sep 29, 2020
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As the virus vaccines become closer to available there is some news over the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines and what may well cause problems for poorer countries like the DR.
Both of the above vaccines require they be stored at minus 95 degrees.
This is going to make distribution and transportation difficult.


Does the DR even own a freezer capable of negative 95?
Adding to the problem is that these two vaccines require two injections with a time in between shots.
The additional time between shots will mean the vaccines will have to be stored longer requiring more special freezers.

Hopefully some of the other producers will have a vaccine that is one injection only and does not require extreme cold storage.

It may well be that the minus 95 requirement will mean that the cost of administering the vaccine will be much greater than the cost of producing it.
Some info in below thread about the vaccine candidates the DR government will get access to, if and when they are available.
Not all vaccines under evaluation have requirement of very low storage temperature.

 

Cdn_Gringo

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Apr 29, 2014
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The vaccine when there is one should be made available to the public in every hospital, private clinic, doctor's office in the country. Getting the jab needs to be quick, easy and uncomplicated and available to everyone who wants it without bureaucratic hurdles to hop over. Of course this country will probably make it difficult and complicated cuz that's what they generally do with every process they set up.
 

windeguy

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Jul 10, 2004
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It looks like the US with the worlds worst response to the virus has herd immunity as the unofficial policy.
Quite clear as to what does not work.
The virus caused the near world wide economic collapse except for China which is seeing an economic upswing between 3 and 4 percent.
Any rational person think China stopped the virus by opening the bars , schools and public gatherings asap?
Naw, they watched others fail then did the opposite.
I am buoyed up by the DR response and think we may well see a healthy uptick in tourism.
Lot of people worldwide in desperate need of a vacation and it looks like the airline industry is banking on the DR.
Hope they got it right.
You would have to look at each state in this case because it is a matter of state rights how human rights are restricted.
I realize even US citizens don't understand this.

Here in the DR , a state of emergency is needed to violate human rights.

Keeping people apart can flatten the curve for the next several years if they don't die from other causes like starvations. When they get together, there will be a surge. Take a look at the EU for that right now. Surging like there is no tomorrow.

Having a vaccine that needs to be stored at -95C is like having no vaccine at all in most of the world. Imagine the hope that gives a place like the DR.
 

CDNBear

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Sep 29, 2020
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You would have to look at each state in this case because it is a matter of state rights how human rights are restricted.
I realize even US citizens don't understand this.

Here in the DR , a state of emergency is needed to violate human rights.

Keeping people apart can flatten the curve for the next several years if they don't die from other causes like starvations. When they get together, there will be a surge. Take a look at the EU for that right now. Surging like there is no tomorrow.

Having a vaccine that needs to be stored at -95C is like having no vaccine at all in most of the world. Imagine the hope that gives a place like the DR.
Mr. Positive view strikes again. Apart that several vaccine candidates does not need this cooling, it might not be that hard to do.

E.g


This liquid nitrogen container is light weight, easy to carry, has a long holding time, and widely used for medical and scientific purposes. Such as: For the conservation of semen, embryos, spawn, vaccines, skin, organ and other biological material.
For industrial cryogenic processing, cold assembly, instruments and components of cooling, cold therapy etc.
 

windeguy

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Jul 10, 2004
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Mr. Positive view strikes again. Apart that several vaccine candidates does not need this cooling, it might not be that hard to do.

E.g


This liquid nitrogen container is light weight, easy to carry, has a long holding time, and widely used for medical and scientific purposes. Such as: For the conservation of semen, embryos, spawn, vaccines, skin, organ and other biological material.
For industrial cryogenic processing, cold assembly, instruments and components of cooling, cold therapy etc.
I am a realist. The challenge of coming up with a vaccine that works is the first one. One that needs liquid nitrogen will not be practical in the DR.
In a few years we will know more.
 

CDNBear

Banned
Sep 29, 2020
337
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I am a realist. The challenge of coming up with a vaccine that works is the first one. One that needs liquid nitrogen will not be practical in the DR.
In a few years we will know more.

Somebody may make money thinking solutions instead of problems, e.g

Reflect Scientific Awarded Patent for COVID Vaccine Capable- Self Powered, Low Temperature Controlled Bulk Shipping System

Next months and year we will know more, and of course in one hundred year too...
 

windeguy

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Jul 10, 2004
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Somebody may make money thinking solutions instead of problems, e.g

Reflect Scientific Awarded Patent for COVID Vaccine Capable- Self Powered, Low Temperature Controlled Bulk Shipping System

Next months and year we will know more, and of course in one hundred year too...
Patents for many things are awarded. Few of them are realized. As far as CV19 is concerned, it will take a couple of years, at least, to "control" if there is an effective vaccine to grant herd immunity. It took over 8 year to control polio.