From Today's DR1 News.....

Mr. Lu

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From Today's DR1 Daily News:

Leonel says crisis is lack of ethics
In La Romana, President Leonel Fernandez said that the financial problems that the world is experiencing are the result of a profound crisis of "ethical values in the markets and the rottenness of the system." As he presented the conclusions of the two-day "Emerging Global Financial Order: A Regional Perspective" seminar, held in Casa de Campo over the weekend, President Fernandez said that this crisis of ethical values is seen in the speculation in the futures markets and in the deregulation and lack of supervision in the markets. According to El Nuevo Diario, he argued that another proof of this is that auditing firms and risk assessment agencies were complicit in the fraud and manipulation of the markets. He said that this situation should never have occurred, and we will have to pay a high price because the planet will have an increased number of poor, unemployed and disoriented people.
As reported by El Nuevo Diario, the President said "Only greed, desire to accumulate wealth has been able to bring the world to this situation. For that, the return to ethical values is fundamental, to know that the markets do generate wealth, but they also are destined to satisfy the needs of society."
He said that in order to achieve a proper balance that permits the effective working of our societies, the "invisible hand of the State" is needed in coordination with the invisible hand of the markets.
The President suggested that 2009 would be very difficult for the world's economies, but he said that an optimistic point of view would say that a slow and gradual recovery would begin and the problems would be overcome by 2010.
At the same time the President warned the greater structural crisis related to the United States internal debt could become evident in the near future as a "credit card crisis," takes place, making things all the worse.
The President maintained that a new paradigm has to be sought, all the while discussing a capitalism that is in intensive care that requires new alternatives that combine the political with the economical and social needs.




Is the irony not lost here? Fascinating that Fernandez, in his position, would make such comments. Fernandez speaking on ethical values?

The same as Morales Troncoso talking religion at the UN and Fernandez saying the troubles of the DR's inability to fight drugs is because the US won't help in the policing efforts.


I was going to post in the Clown Bin, actually I might just do that.....


Out stealing like a Dominican, just like Fernandez taught me....







Mr. Lu
 

ExtremeR

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For how long have you been living here in the DR Mr. Lu??? It sure doesn't seem like much....(8+ years)
 

BushBaby

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For how long have you been living here in the DR Mr. Lu??? It sure doesn't seem like much....(8+ years)
I don't think it matters How Long one has been living here ExtremeR, some of us will never be able to get used to the Dominican ability to lay the blame off on someone else.

Without wishing to appear disrespectful to my hosts (I have many good Dominican friends & will continue to seek Dominican friendships) I recognise that the Dominican ability to deny any form of failure/wrong doing, is only surpassed by their ability to pass responsibility of any shortcomings on to someone else because of ....... 'whatever they consider the best excuse at the time'!

The Dominican saying "No Problem" does NOT mean it will not be difficult for me to overcome this slight inconvenience, it means ........ "Don't bring your problems to my doorstep - I can't handle blame, responsibility & problems & IF it is found to be my fault, I will turn that into blaming someone else!!" :paranoid: :ermm:

Recognising this, I still prefer their way of living to the British way of life in general terms!! Even this RAIN is better than British RAIN!! ~ Grahame.
 

Lambada

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Who writes Leonel's speeches? Can't he do better than a yahoo type summary of the world financial situation? I mean there are plenty of well written, sharply analysed pieces out there on this subject. This is the best he could do?
 

cobraboy

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Pimping for a UN-style job, so he needs to ~sound~ like them.:cheeky:
 

ExtremeR

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I don't think it matters How Long one has been living here ExtremeR, some of us will never be able to get used to the Dominican ability to lay the blame off on someone else.

Without wishing to appear disrespectful to my hosts (I have many good Dominican friends & will continue to seek Dominican friendships) I recognise that the Dominican ability to deny any form of failure/wrong doing, is only surpassed by their ability to pass responsibility of any shortcomings on to someone else because of ....... 'whatever they consider the best excuse at the time'!

The Dominican saying "No Problem" does NOT mean it will not be difficult for me to overcome this slight inconvenience, it means ........ "Don't bring your problems to my doorstep - I can't handle blame, responsibility & problems & IF it is found to be my fault, I will turn that into blaming someone else!!" :paranoid: :ermm:

Recognising this, I still prefer their way of living to the British way of life in general terms!! Even this RAIN is better than British RAIN!! ~ Grahame.
My point is that Mr. Lu has some kind of vendetta against Leonel Fernandez, he portraits Leonel like if he is the Trujillo version 2.0 and try to blame most of the the DR problems to him, he obviously hasn?t lived in the Balaguer years where freedom of speech was questionable, would commit fraud in every election possible (in 1990 is was pretty clear that Juan Bosch won) and the economy was pretty closed to the world, reporting sometimes very slim growth and some years even negative growth.

In 2000 people forgot that and had the same feeling that Mr. Lu has right now and voted for Hipolito Mejia and the PRD, the consequences of that decision made by the Dominican people still are lingering due to the disastrous administration led by Hipolito Mejia and his incompetent cabinet.

If you compare Leonel with politicians of developed countries where the infraestructure is set to stop clientelism in order to reach Power, well then yes he may be bad, but compared of what the DR have had to go through this last years Leonel is by far the best thing that has happened to this country.

In his 1st term there was a steady increase in economy growth every year and added to the infrastructure of the city by building the Elevados and Tunnels, obras which were harshed criticized at their time and now we woulnd?t want to imagine what the transit would be without them.

Of course Leonel has a share of bad things, (or his Cabinet..) but when you weight things out the good outweights the bad.
 
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Chip

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I have actually grown to respect more and more what Leonel has tried to do, however, it is really throwing salt in the wounds trying to speak with moral authority given that Leonel can't seem to reform the Customs house nor it's opulent wages and gifts the government gives to it's mostly useless and unaccountable politicians. Has anyone ever tried to call them to complain? Beers are on me if you can even find the phone number in the phone book.
 

Mr. Lu

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...

Pimping for a UN-style job, so he needs to ~sound~ like them.:cheeky:
The forum is yours. Please speak so the infidels may understand you. This is exactly what Fernandez is doing. He is preparing for his real career. He is gone far beyond the DR. He is now preparing his legacy and his ability to land a high level job outside the DR, in an international capacity, will be the icing on his cake.






Mr. Lu
 

Mr. Lu

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Ok...

My point is that Mr. Lu has some kind of vendetta against Leonel Fernandez, he portraits Leonel like if he is the Trujillo version 2.0 and try to blame most of the the DR problems to him, he obviously hasn?t lived in the Balaguer years where freedom of speech was questionable, would commit fraud in every election possible (in 1990 is was pretty clear that Juan Bosch won) and the economy was pretty closed to the world, reporting sometimes very slim growth and some years even negative growth.

In 2000 people forgot that and had the same feeling that Mr. Lu has right now and voted for Hipolito Mejia and the PRD, the consequences of that decision made by the Dominican people still are lingering due to the disastrous administration led by Hipolito Mejia and his incompetent cabinet.

If you compare Leonel with politicians of developed countries where the infraestructure is set to stop clientelism in order to reach Power, well then yes he may be bad, but compared of what the DR have had to go through this last years Leonel is by far the best thing that has happened to this country.

In his 1st term there was a steady increase in economy growth every year and added to the infrastructure of the city by building the Elevados and Tunnels, obras which were harshed criticized at their time and now we woulnd?t want to imagine what the transit would be without them.

Of course Leonel has a share of bad things, (or his Cabinet..) but when you weight things out the good outweights the bad.

Listen, I am right here. You got something to say, direct your comments to me. No need for this third person babble, where you off and espouse unsubstantiated comments by someone else as a way to defend your rhetoric. And before I go ahead and derail your obviously dubious comparisons let me assure you that YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT I AM THINKING!!!!!!!!!

Want to know what I am thinking? ASK!!!!

Don't ever assume anything about what I am thinking unless I have explicitly written or commented on the fact.

Don't conjecture, don't think, don't assume. I have written nothing to the likes in this thread, therefore your assumptions about my opinions are ludicrous at best, slanderous at worst. I have made no comparisons between The Great Goat and the Great Goat's sack. I have placed blame where blame is due and could care less about Balaguer. I am alive now, living through Fernandez 1.0. Balaguer can be playing poker with Jesus and the Devil, for all I care.

And don't worry I don't have to portrait Leonel like anything, he does that by himself.

Furthermore you have no idea what "I am feeling," so save yourself the trouble and don't think too hard about my thoughts. There are obviously a few things you need to be thinking about as you post, and what I think or don't think is not one of them.

And now for a bit of conjecture of my own, you are one of these "apologetics," eh? You look at the rosy stuff but fail to see the truth. "Oh hes bad, but better than the worst of them." This is the same attitude that is leading towards the road of disaster.

"Apologizers" like you aim for the lowest of standards. Are you sure you are not Dominican? As this seems a truly Dominican trait. "Let's not find the best politician, let's find the one who is comparably better than the worse guy, and then apologize for the load of shyt he dumps on us, but thank God, the load of shyt was lighter than the previous loads!!!"

You get shyt dumped on you, no matter how big, is still shyt.




Real progress, eh?





Mr. Lu
 
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BushBaby

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Listen, I am right here. You got something to say, direct your comments to me. No need for this third person babble, where you off and espouse unsubstantiated comments by someone else as a way to defend your rhetoric. And before I go ahead and derail your obviously dubious comparisons let me assure you that YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT I AM THINKING!!!!!!!!!

Want to know what I am thinking? ASK!!!!

Don't ever assume anything about what I am thinking unless I have explicitly written or commented on the fact.

Don't conjecture, don't think, don't assume. I have written nothing to the likes in this thread, therefore your assumptions about my opinions are ludicrous at best, slanderous at worst. I have made no comparisons between The Great Goat and the Great Goat's sack. I have placed blame where blame is due and could care less about Balaguer. I am alive now, living through Fernandez 1.0. Balaguer can be playing poker with Jesus and the Devil, for all I care.

And don't worry I don't have to portrait Leonel like anything, he does that by himself.

Furthermore you have no idea what "I am feeling," so save yourself the trouble and don't think too hard about my thoughts. There are obviously a few things you need to be thinking about as you post, and what I think or don't think is not one of them.

And now for a bit of conjecture of my own, you are one of these "apologetics," eh? You look at the rosy stuff but fail to see the truth. "Oh hes bad, but better than the worst of them." This is the same attitude that is leading towards the road of disaster.

"Apologizers" like you aim for the lowest of standards. Are you sure you are not Dominican? As this seems a truly Dominican trait. "Let's not find the best politician, let's find the one who is comparably better than the worse guy, and then apologize for the load of shyt he dumps on us, but thank God, the load of shyt was lighter than the previous loads!!!"

You get shyt dumped on you, no matter how big, is still shyt.

Real progress, eh?

Mr. Lu
I have something to say AND I will say it directly to you!!

I note from your 'Reason' for editing note at the bottom of your thread that you edited "to keep it civil". Might I respectfully suggest that you failed miserably & that your employer should send you on a modified/upgrade course or demand his money back from the last course!!

For those of us who like a good discussion, who would enjoy being involved in political debate ....... your style of response here is MOST off-putting. Whether ExtremeR's thoughts/conclusions were plausible or not now becomes totally mute & I for one would never be able to be dispassionate or objective in my responses to YOUR posts - I therefore will refrain from agreeing or disagreeing on the subject matter where you make such similar aggressive responses to people.

ExtremeR has a right to word his posts in whichever way HE deems correct or most suitable - 3rd person, fourth person or whatever. He has a RIGHT to conjecture what is in your mind too ........... YOU have the right to respond to his conjecture, not castigate him for writing in the style he chooses.

Ban me/delete me if you wish (or have the authority to) but for goodness sakes .............. learn to put your points in a civil & non aggressive manner. You'll have far greater success in getting your points across. ~ Grahame.
 

Robert

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Jan 2, 1999
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Might I respectfully suggest that you failed miserably & that your employer should send you on a modified/upgrade course or demand his money back from the last course!!
We build them well at DR1, almost a kinder, gentler version of myself.
One thing is for sure, his spelling and grammar is better than mine :)
 

BushBaby

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We build them well at DR1, almost a kinder, gentler version of myself.
One thing is for sure, his spelling and grammar is better than mine :)
Only a bit Robert. :cheeky: :surprised I ran my post through spellcheck prior to posting & the ONLY errors it picked up were for Mr. Lu's post!

Glad my overall intention has been accepted by you as being designed to be 'beneficial to DR1 posting standards as a whole'! ~ Grahame.
 

bienamor

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Apr 23, 2004
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Agree to a point,

My point is that Mr. Lu has some kind of vendetta against Leonel Fernandez, he portraits Leonel like if he is the Trujillo version 2.0 and try to blame most of the the DR problems to him, he obviously hasn?t lived in the Balaguer years where freedom of speech was questionable, would commit fraud in every election possible (in 1990 is was pretty clear that Juan Bosch won) and the economy was pretty closed to the world, reporting sometimes very slim growth and some years even negative growth.

In 2000 people forgot that and had the same feeling that Mr. Lu has right now and voted for Hipolito Mejia and the PRD, the consequences of that decision made by the Dominican people still are lingering due to the disastrous administration led by Hipolito Mejia and his incompetent cabinet.

If you compare Leonel with politicians of developed countries where the infraestructure is set to stop clientelism in order to reach Power, well then yes he may be bad, but compared of what the DR have had to go through this last years Leonel is by far the best thing that has happened to this country.

In his 1st term there was a steady increase in economy growth every year and added to the infrastructure of the city by building the Elevados and Tunnels, obras which were harshed criticized at their time and now we woulnd?t want to imagine what the transit would be without them.

Of course Leonel has a share of bad things, (or his Cabinet..) but when you weight things out the good outweights the bad.
Lionel's first administration, was heads and shoulders above the current situation. His first time around he really did fight corruption, not just talk about it. He also got rid of ministers, and other officials, not hire more of them If I remember correctly we even got rid of some Generals. There are more Generals here than in the US, what the hell is that.
 

cobraboy

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Jul 24, 2004
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There are more Generals here than in the US, what the hell is that.
Is there a more powerful group on men in the DR than the Generals? Seriously. I'm thinking not. Is ANY reform of the current political system even possible without their direct approval?
 

Robert

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Jan 2, 1999
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Only a bit Robert. :cheeky: :surprised I ran my post through spellcheck prior to posting & the ONLY errors it picked up were for Mr. Lu's post!
He's pretty fluent in 5 languages, so we cut him some slack on his spelling now and again :)
 

Robert

Stay Frosty!
Jan 2, 1999
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Is there a more powerful group on men in the DR than the Generals? Seriously. I'm thinking not. Is ANY reform of the current political system even possible without their direct approval?
Of course. The core group of families that run the country :)

Actually, I think you will find that the generals have very little say in what goes on.
They are not the power brokers here, they are more like pawns.