Government considers Spanish and Israeli technology for fence with Haiti

Dolores

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Israel border wall / Wikimedia Commons



Foreign Minister Roberto Alvarez says the Dominican government is in talks with Spanish and Israeli companies for the construction of a fence on the border of Haiti and the Dominican Republic. The border is over 300 km. The fence construction would have a length of 190 kilometers, and is estimated to cost more than US$100 million, or about RD$6 billion. Right now, there are only small stretches of border construction, primarily at the Jimaní and Dajabón.



Alvarez said the 180 km extension is a long-term project for the government. He said the government has contracted for the construction of 23 kilometers of fence between both countries. He said by the end of the year, there should be around 30 km of border fences in places of easy access. Alvarez said the project calls for the construction of a “technological and...

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Yourmaninvegas

I am here to protect and serve
Feb 16, 2016
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Is illegal immigration about economics ❓

I ask because DRGOV is going to drop a 100 sticks on this project.
If you are going to drop a 100 sticks to stop something.
That something better be costing you more than 100 sticks over the life of the project.

Unless it is not about economics...
Because then it does not matter what it costs.
Like the commercial says...
Priceless‼️
 

windeguy

Platinum
Jul 10, 2004
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Illegals will work for less than those legally in the country.

It is illegal to hire those that are illegal in this country. Severe fines can be imposed on those that do such hiring.
Someone will of course repeat comment that Haitians will do jobs Dominicans won't.
My response is: If Haitians do those jobs, they should be legal Haitians.

Haitians have children frequently due to a lack of birth control. I understand the DR government will build a hospital in Haiti at the DR border to
try and control the number of Haitian women that cross the border to giver birth in a hospital. The numbers are overwhelming the resources available in some areas.

Is it economic? Yes
Is it based upon laws to try and enforce legal immigration? Yes
Is it in addition something else? Probably.
 

Yourmaninvegas

I am here to protect and serve
Feb 16, 2016
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Illegals will work for less than those legally in the country.
They work for Dominicans.
It is illegal to hire those that are illegal in this country. Severe fines can be imposed on those that do such hiring.
I am not aware that is being done.
After all this country is controlled by the rich.
And it is the rich who benefit from illegal immigration in this country 🇩🇴
Someone will of course repeat comment that Haitians will do jobs Dominicans won't.
I do not need to repeat your comment and I do not know who might.
I but I can state that I have been on many of a construction site.
And I have not seen 👀 a single Dominican out in the sun doing heavy unskilled labor.
Now in campo it is different.
Dominicans in campo have a completely different attitude towards work.
They are willing to roll of their sleeves.
And work long hours in the hot sun doing back breaking labor.
My response is: If Haitians do those jobs, they should be legal Haitians.
Of course they should be legal.
This is not my country 🇩🇴.
I have no dog in the fight.
But I do not advocate illegality in a country where I am their guest.
Haitians have children frequently due to a lack of birth control.
As do many Dominicans.
Lots of single mothers in this country.
And where are the fathers❓
I understand the DR government will build a hospital in Haiti at the DR border to try and control the number of Haitian women that cross the border to giver birth in a hospital. The numbers are overwhelming the resources available in some areas.
That is what has been announced.
So, you have a good understanding of that.
Is it economic? Yes
Not sure about that.
Is that your opinion or you have some facts to back it up.
Is it based upon laws to try and enforce legal immigration? Yes
Of course every country has a right to decide who visits and lives in their country.
Is it in addition something else? Probably.
In my opinion the answer to that question is: YES‼️
 

Yourmaninvegas

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Feb 16, 2016
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It's about Sovereignty. RD has every right (and responsibility) to stop an invasion.
I just really enjoy how some people choose to use language.

Now let us review what the Foreign Minister had to say:

"Alvarez made it clear that the perimeter fence’s objective is to facilitate trade with Haiti, avoid irregular migration, stop the smuggling of all kinds, and guarantee peaceful coexistence between the two nations."

:unsure:
 

Naked_Snake

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Sep 2, 2008
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I just really enjoy how some people choose to use language.

Now let us review what the Foreign Minister had to say:

"Alvarez made it clear that the perimeter fence’s objective is to facilitate trade with Haiti, avoid irregular migration, stop the smuggling of all kinds, and guarantee peaceful coexistence between the two nations."

:unsure:
It is a simple equation. An increasingly Haitian demographic will bring increasingly Haitian economic/social/political results to this country. Nothing more, nothing less. In other words, eternal instability and dysfunction, one Jacquerie* at a time.

* = This was the name for the peasant rebellions in medieval France.
 
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Yourmaninvegas

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It is a simple equation. An increasingly Haitian demographic will bring increasingly Haitian economic/social/political results to this country. Nothing more, nothing less.
Using your logic the same will happen to the 🇩🇴 with influx of other immigrants to the country:
Canada for example...
"An increasingly (put name of country in here) demographic will bring increasingly (put name of country in here) economic/social/political results to this country".

So, is it really that simple❓
Put into a mathematical formula and help me understand.
I have a background in quantitative sociology.
 

Naked_Snake

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Sep 2, 2008
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Using your logic the same will happen to the 🇩🇴 with influx of other immigrants to the country:
Canada for example...
"An increasingly (put name of country in here) demographic will bring increasingly (put name of country in here) economic/social/political results to this country".

So, is it really that simple❓
Put into a mathematical formula and help me understand.
I have a background in quantitative sociology.
Demographics are destiny, so yes, those countries should tighten their borders. I am an equal opportunity immigration restrictionist.
 
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malko

Campesino !! :)
Jan 12, 2013
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It's about Sovereignty. RD has every right (and responsibility) to stop an invasion.
Right up until that moment where the DR government has to whore themselves to the international community and/or foreign banks to secure the funding.... From there on it will all be about economics.
 

Yourmaninvegas

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Feb 16, 2016
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Demographics are destiny, so yes, those countries should tighten their borders. I am an equal opportunity immigration restrictionist.
You missed it completely...
I was speaking about immigration of people from Canada to 🇩🇴 .
I believe in legal immigration.

But Dominicans cannot would starve, be homeless and if they had a house live in a dirty one if no legal Haitians were in the country.
 

Yourmaninvegas

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Right up until that moment where the DR government has to whore themselves to the international community and/or foreign banks to secure the funding.... From there on it will all be about economics.
Follow the money 🤑
If you are going to drop 100 sticks on the project...
It better be worth it‼️

But I am sure the DRGOV knows that as long as the government of Haiti is not doing the most basic things a nation state needs to do for its people.
🇩🇴 will be the land of opportunity...
 

NALs

Polls Forum Moderator
Jan 20, 2003
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The government of Haiti met with Dominican authorities a few months ago and became aware of the plan and agreed to the increase of security on the border. In itself it has a positive effects for them too, because it further makes contraband and tax evasion more difficult.

They also agreed to other things such as the hospitals the DR wil build all over Haiti to end pregnant Haitian women from crossing the border to give birth in Dominican hospitals. The first hospital will be built in Juana Méndez across the border from Dajabón. They already have the plot where it will be built. I'm not sure if the search for a plot in Port-au-Prince has been stalled due tomthe political instability, but tthey were searching for one in the Haitian capital.

All in all, Haitian authorities are well aware of the increasing measures on the border and basically is in agreement.
 
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Yourmaninvegas

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The government of Haiti met with Dominican authorities a few months ago and became aware of the plan and agreed to the increase of security on the border. In itself it has a positive effects for them too, because it further makes contraband and tax evasion more difficult.
Of course they are.
They do not have to drop 100 sticks.
They also agreed to other things such as the hospitals the DR wil build all over Haiti to end pregnant Haitian women from crossing the border to give birth in Dominican hospitals. The first hospital will be built in Juana Méndez across the border from Dajabón. They already have the plot where it will be built. I'm not sure if the search for a plot in Port-au-Prince has been stalled due tomthe political instability, but tthey were searching for one in the Haitian capital.
Who is paying for that ❓
All in all, Haitian authorities are well aware of the increasing measures on the border and basically is in agreement.
Makes sense to me.
It is a win-win transaction for both DRGOV and the government of Haiti.
The finance minister made it clear and immigration was only one of 4 purposes given for the increased border security.
And a "wall" is only PART of the over all border security plan.

But it needs a name.
I think it should be called The Peacenoimsmugobaby project.
 

windeguy

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Jul 10, 2004
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They work for Dominicans.

Really, who knew. I thought they worked for Eskimos here in the DR. Geez I learn something new every day.
I am not aware that is being done.
After all this country is controlled by the rich.
And it is the rich who benefit from illegal immigration in this country 🇩🇴
That is the law, been posted on DR1 and in the news. Ignorance is no excuse.
I do not need to repeat your comment and I do not know who might.
I but I can state that I have been on many of a construction site.
And I have not seen 👀 a single Dominican out in the sun doing heavy unskilled labor.
Can't argue on what you saw. If they were not illegal there should be no problems. Problem is, they might be illegal and working cheap.
Now in campo it is different.
Dominicans in campo have a completely different attitude towards work.
They are willing to roll of their sleeves.
And work long hours in the hot sun doing back breaking labor.

Of course they should be legal.
This is not my country 🇩🇴.
I have no dog in the fight.
But I do not advocate illegality in a country where I am their guest.
We agree that being illegal is incorrect. The wall is one way to cut down on illegals.
As do many Dominicans.
Lots of single mothers in this country.
And where are the fathers❓
Many irresponsible men, nothing to do with the fence or prevention of illegal workers.
That is what has been announced.
So, you have a good understanding of that.

If you mean the fines on employers and even those who house illegals, it is common knowledge and has been posted on DR1.
Not sure about that.
Is that your opinion or you have some facts to back it up.

Of course every country has a right to decide who visits and lives in their country.

In my opinion the answer to that question is: YES‼️
Not sure why the quote process didn't work correctly. Hard to reply to all the questions that way.

Bottom line is that it is a good idea to have a way to restrict the large numbers of illegal people from anywhere, including Haiti. The wall should help that. Better enforcement of the labor and housing laws will also go a long way to cut back on illegals working illegally.
 

windeguy

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Jul 10, 2004
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For the argument that if no Dominican will work the job, then give the proper work visa to those that will.
 
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Yourmaninvegas

I am here to protect and serve
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Really, who knew. I thought they worked for Eskimos here in the DR. Geez I learn something new every day.
Well then I am glad you learned something from me today
That is the law, been posted on DR1 and in the news. Ignorance is no excuse.
I know the law.
But is it being enforced.
There are many laws.
Not all are enforced.
Can't argue on what you saw. If they were not illegal there should be no problems. Problem is, they might be illegal and working cheap.
But, you really do not know anyway.
If they were illegal they were working for Dominicans.
That means Dominicans were benefiting.
We agree that being illegal is incorrect. The wall is one way to cut down on illegals.
Finally a point of agreement ‼️
Many irresponsible men, nothing to do with the fence or prevention of illegal workers.
You brought up the point about irresponsible Haitian females having babies in 🇩🇴
If it has nothing to do with the subject at hand...
Why did you bring it up❓
If you mean the fines on employers and even those who house illegals, it is common knowledge and has been posted on DR1.
There has not been one article posted here about a enforcement action occurring based on these laws.
Post the article from a new source here in the Dominican Republic.
Not hearsay‼️
Not sure why the quote process didn't work correctly. Hard to reply to all the questions that way.
Not my system.
Contact a moderator if you feel I am not using the system properly.
Remember this is a discussion not a debate.
So, discuss...
Bottom line is that it is a good idea to have a way to restrict the large numbers of illegal people from anywhere, including Haiti. The wall should help that. Better enforcement of the labor and housing laws will also go a long way to cut back on illegals working illegally.
The bottom line is that DRGOV is prepared to drop 100 sticks on this program.
Since that is not chump change 🤑
My thought is that it better work...
I case you do not understand
The topic is about the border protection system
Not the Haitians that are already in the country.
The finance minister made it clear and immigration was only one of 4 purposes given for the increased border security.
And a "wall" is only PART of the over all border security plan.
Anyone want to discuss the 3 other parts that the finance minister spoke about❓
It shows DRGOV is not as narrow minded as some posters are here on DR1.
 

Yourmaninvegas

I am here to protect and serve
Feb 16, 2016
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For the argument that if no Dominican will work the job, then give the proper work visa to those that will.
I am not here to argue like you are‼️
But for the purposes of discussion...
If employers are not incentivized to change their hiring habits.
Then the border protection program is not going to make a bit of difference.

For the sake of discussion,
If the human element of the system fails💰💰💰💰💰💰
All of the physical elements are going to be irrelevant.
 
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Tarheel

Well-known member
Dec 19, 2005
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Illegals will work for less than those legally in the country.

It is illegal to hire those that are illegal in this country. Severe fines can be imposed on those that do such hiring.
Someone will of course repeat comment that Haitians will do jobs Dominicans won't.
My response is: If Haitians do those jobs, they should be legal Haitians.

Haitians have children frequently due to a lack of birth control. I understand the DR government will build a hospital in Haiti at the DR border to
try and control the number of Haitian women that cross the border to giver birth in a hospital. The numbers are overwhelming the resources available in some areas.

Is it economic? Yes
Is it based upon laws to try and enforce legal immigration? Yes
Is it in addition something else? Probably.
As you know very well, Haitians pay corrupt customs/immigration officials to come into the DR. So the fence/wall will stop no one. It might stop a few cows however.