Government spends billions on public education; investment does not pay off; teachers boycott in-person learning

[bob saunders]

I'm from one of the countries with the consistently highest PISA score and just now when I read that Abinader goes to Europe for whatever reason, why does he (or Fulcar) never visit any other country to learn how education is organized there??? That has never been on any agenda as far as I have seen... Tourism, dinners, other c**p but nothing to do with learning/education/you name it...

The previous government went to Finland and studied their school system and talked about trying to implement it here, but as far as I know nothing came out of it. My wife and I went to a private school meeting with the Minister of Education in 2017 and there was a lot of discussion on how to fix the Dominican education system, and the Minister agree with the proposals but again nothing came out of it. I believe the government needs to send a large group of their best teachers, or university professors in their pedology department on a year long ( train the trainer program) in a country like Spain ( which actually has a decent education system and speak Spanish) and once these people are trained in implementing a superior educational product to give them the power to both train the current teachers and future teachers. It will take several generations to notice a huge difference but a noticeable difference would be realized in just a couple of years. There are lots of intelligent Dominican students but with poor teachers, and a poor system of teaching they don't get the basics to succeed or the ability to advance to more complicated mathematics, science...…etc.

 

[josh2203]

, but as far as I know nothing came out of it. ...... but again nothing came out of it.

I did not actually know about what you wrote, so definitely interesting... Yes, I agree with everything you said above, but the parts I quoted... There's the main problem... So visits etc. are fine but the purpose of the visits would to learn and bring back home, so if those two parts are missing, it's just traveling, flying, eating and having a good time... Way to spend tax money...

 

[bob saunders]

Bob, you probably should elucidate some on that. Not understanding what or how it happened.

For years the government paid the Catholics schools a fee per student, and this paid for the teachers. The school then also charged a fee per student and was quite selective on what students they would allow to attend. Many of our students went there after finishing at our school, since we only went to Grade nine. At this time the Salesianos had complete control of the program, hiring and firing teachers....etc. About five years ago they became a semi-public school , giving over control in most ways to the education ministry in return for even more money. This is when their product started to go down hill.

 

[El Hijo de Manolo]

The previous government went to Finland and studied their school system and talked about trying to implement it here, but as far as I know nothing came out of it. My wife and I went to a private school meeting with the Minister of Education in 2017 and there was a lot of discussion on how to fix the Dominican education system, and the Minister agree with the proposals but again nothing came out of it. I believe the government needs to send a large group of their best teachers, or university professors in their pedology department on a year long ( train the trainer program) in a country like Spain ( which actually has a decent education system and speak Spanish) and once these people are trained in implementing a superior educational product to give them the power to both train the current teachers and future teachers. It will take several generations to notice a huge difference but a noticeable difference would be realized in just a couple of years. There are lots of intelligent Dominican students but with poor teachers, and a poor system of teaching they don't get the basics to succeed or the ability to advance to more complicated mathematics, science...…etc.

This looks good on paper Bob, but I bet they could get a lot of the low hanging fruit with existing resources. It's just common sense. A big issue is the education minister is a politician and they are really only concerned with photo ops and self advancement. That's why they put all these paint jobs on the schools and chose color coordinated uniforms. All the pictures of the minister eating lunch with kids and captioned with Tony Robbins-like rhetoric does nothing more than further a political agenda. There's enough smarts within n DR circles to make significant improvements now. Sending the brain trust to Spain will do nothing more than fill heads with visions of grandeur with no way to implement and measure.

 

[Auryn]

I'm from one of the countries with the consistently highest PISA score and just now when I read that Abinader goes to Europe for whatever reason, why does he (or Fulcar) never visit any other country to learn how education is organized there??? That has never been on any agenda as far as I have seen... Tourism, dinners, other c**p but nothing to do with learning/education/you name it...

He does not visit because he does not care. His station and the station of his children is guaranteed and secured. Educating the masses does not serve his interests nor the interests of those he associates with.

 

[Auryn]

My former teacher, colleague, and still good friend did a semester in Finland as part of her Master’s degree.
She and another teacher have since done professional development sessions about their experience there and what they learned.
The biggest takeaways or comparisons to our Canadian education model is that high school students are basically streamlined into either academic or trades based classes (vocational focus). This approach is being tested to varying degrees in Canada.

There is also very little standardized testing in Finland, a big difference from many Asian countries.
Teachers must have a Masters degree and there is no testing requirement for teachers.
At an elementary level, Finnish kids don’t even begin school until the age of seven. This has been based on evidence that starting academic learning younger has no direct correlation with later academic success, within reason. Play based learning in children from the ages of 2-7 has been found to have much more positive impact on academic success in children.

Those aspects of the Finnish education model would not be successful in the DR at present, perhaps with the exception of more emphasis play based learning as a potential starting point.

Education in Finland

 

[zoomzx11]

My former teacher, colleague, and still good friend did a semester in Finland as part of her Master’s degree.
She and another teacher have since done professional development sessions about their experience there and what they learned.
The biggest takeaways or comparisons to our Canadian education model is that high school students are basically streamlined into either academic or trades based classes (vocational focus). This approach is being tested to varying degrees in Canada.

There is also very little standardized testing in Finland, a big difference from many Asian countries.
Teachers must have a Masters degree and there is no testing requirement for teachers.
At an elementary level, Finnish kids don’t even begin school until the age of seven. This has been based on evidence that starting academic learning younger has no direct correlation with later academic success, within reason. Play based learning in children from the ages of 2-7 has been found to have much more positive impact on academic success in children.

Those aspects of the Finnish education model would not be successful in the DR at present, perhaps with the exception of more emphasis play based learning as a potential starting point.

Education in Finland

Refreshing to hear your reply.

Teacher testing for competence is a hot potato.
I always thought the students knew the good teachers.
The problems facing the DR school system are enormous and likely beyond the abilities of the politicos to fix especially as they are the people who excelled in the DR system.
The US is still spending a ton of money on pre school despite the evidence it is ineffective in predicting later academic success.

No doubt about the success of Finland in education. They know what works for them.
One take away from Finland is there is no forcing the students into anything.
The system is all about the students being given free choices to follow their inclinations.

 

[NanSanPedro]

For years the government paid the Catholics schools a fee per student, and this paid for the teachers. The school then also charged a fee per student and was quite selective on what students they would allow to attend. Many of our students went there after finishing at our school, since we only went to Grade nine. At this time the Salesianos had complete control of the program, hiring and firing teachers....etc. About five years ago they became a semi-public school , giving over control in most ways to the education ministry in return for even more money. This is when their product started to go down hill.

Thanks. Another great argument for separation of church and state.

 

[bob saunders]

Refreshing to hear your reply.

Teacher testing for competence is a hot potato.
I always thought the students knew the good teachers.
The problems facing the DR school system are enormous and likely beyond the abilities of the politicos to fix especially as they are the people who excelled in the DR system.
The US is still spending a ton of money on pre school despite the evidence it is ineffective in predicting later academic success.

No doubt about the success of Finland in education. They know what works for them.
One take away from Finland is there is no forcing the students into anything.
The system is all about the students being given free choices to follow their inclinations.

Examining the Data: State Per Pupil Expenditures and State Graduation Rates

www.newamerica.org

 

[La Profe_1]

I just spent 20 minutes trying to clean up this thread. The topic revolves around education in the DR, not in the US or Canada. It certainly is not the bickerfest between Bob S and Zoom!

Think before you post and stay on topic.

 

[El Hijo de Manolo]

Update - Cabarete Public School
So, kid comes in from school today. The new covid-modified schedule consists of 2day/week classes, 8am-4pm. Kid says they had 2 recreational periods, one "gym" period, and of course the usual lunch period given on full days. Class notebooks from today virtually empty upon inspection. Teacher wanted nothing to do with any questioning of this when asked in the whatsapp number they provide. You decide.