haitian integration, while the island be unified once again, once and for all?

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Beatnut

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i dont think its a matter of if, but when.

you can give the process 50 years, a 100 years, maybe 300, but its going to happen. theyre flooding in at an uncontrollable rate, taking dominican jobs and overflowing its poor sector. soon they'll occupy 40% of the poor sector of the dominican republic, wich by then should make them (haitian descendants now dominican) about 1 million strong. they'll be the swing vote in elections and if history is repetitive (lol, damn right it is when it comes to DR), they'll cause many syndicate and rioting issues. its in their blood to fight and rebel, if theyre not suppressed.

the UN wont deal with haiti's misery cause their is nothing to gain but problems. they want us to deal with them, when we can barely deal with ourselves.

trust that if haiti had oil itd be the same peice of baron land it is today with the exception that it would be crawling with american soldiers.

integration...we're in for a big problem.
 

ZEUS

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Blood will flow..

Before this happens, my friend, blood will flow. They (the Haitians) belong in Haiti while Dominicans belong here. That's the way it will be. Period.



Zeus (primus inter pares)

PS. Got my heat ready !!!!
 

Larry

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Let's see how the ex-pat bleeding heart liberal Hatian lovers like living there in 10 years. Then they will be saying, "oh, remember what it used to be like here? Before the streets were covered with homeless Hatians and Hatian mothers holding their babies begging for food and Hatian gangs roaming the streets robbing everyone? Maybe we SHOULD have secured the border and kept them out back in 2004". Oh well, woulda shoulda coulda.

Larry
 

Beatnut

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blood will flow, people will die, the island will sink, but its going to happen unless we take extreme action (wich'd be a terrible desicion, making it not an option)

the un wants it to happen...only thing that can save us is an oil puddle.
 

DRsScarface

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Repeat

This topic is sounding familiar. It's because it has already been discussed before!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! There's already a thread responding to this topic.
 

wventura

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I think dominicans and haitians should just put all that **** in the past behind them, and cohabitate. DR, and haiti (BOTH very poor countries), could potentially benefit from being unified. Remaining devided is counter productive.

There is no legitamate justification for the anti-haitian atitudes of Dominincans. So if they could try to forget about all the predjudices, and preconceived notions, of haiti (as well as color issues), I think it would be easy to cohabitate. Dominicans always say things like "Quiqueya la bella", so why not make that again and forget about being so divided.
 

Beatnut

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wventura said:
I think dominicans and haitians should just put all that **** in the past behind them, and cohabitate. .
thats easy to say. but for gods sake, theyre over 100 years behind us. theyed drag us down with them.

economicly, we're floureshing (believe it or not people) more than ever since trujillo died. in the last 10 years alone we've made up for alot of lossed advance.

haiti is at the same place it was BEFORE papa doc rose.

haitians arent bad people at all, and they have nothing but love for dominicans. they were the first ones with food and supplies in Jimani. but we cant substantiate them when we can barely do it for ourselves.

besides, dominicans are too damn racsist, lmao. why you think pe?a gomez never won?
 

bobnoxious

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Mexico borders the United States. Mexicans pour across the border daily. They sap the infrastructure. Free healthcare. Free Education. Will they be the 51st State? Not a chance.

All the poor Hatians can come on over. Will it make a difference? No. Just more cheap labor for the Dominican elite. Every capitalist society needs labor for cheap. Thank you Haiti. You are the fuel for the growth of the DR. Just don't expect any equality.
 

Beatnut

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bobnoxious said:
Mexico borders the United States. Mexicans pour across the border daily. They sap the infrastructure. Free healthcare. Free Education. Will they be the 51st State? Not a chance.

All the poor Hatians can come on over. Will it make a difference? No. Just more cheap labor for the Dominican elite. Every capitalist society needs labor for cheap. Thank you Haiti. You are the fuel for the growth of the DR. Just don't expect any equality.
theres a difference in using people while youre the worlds #1 superpower and being a poor little country with an even poorer one spilling into you.
 

Chirimoya

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Dec 9, 2002
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Hmm, I thought this thread would be a train-wreck when I looked in but there are some interesting points to debate. Maybe it should go to DR debates to avoid the potential deterioration to excesses and personal attacks.

The army turn a blind eye to illegal migrants, and take bribes in return. Dominican employers use cheap Haitian labour. These are the only people who have anything to gain from Haitians entering the DR and they are not liberals, bleeding-heart or otherwise.

The best scenario for both sides of the island would be improved economic development in Haiti to avert mass migration, coupled with a Dominican army that does its job of policiing the border responsibly and effectively.

Which of these two is the greater pipe dream is, of course, open to debate.

Chiri
 

Beatnut

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Chirimoya said:
coupled with a Dominican army that does its job of policiing the border responsibly and effectively. .

Chiri
lmao, like they havent tried. if they do, we get accused of being inhumane for whatever reason. they WANT they merge to happen, they NEED it to happen to make us easier to use.
 

Narcosis

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Chirimoya said:
The army turn a blind eye to illegal migrants, and take bribes in return. Dominican employers use cheap Haitian labour. These are the only people who have anything to gain from Haitians entering the DR and they are not liberals, bleeding-heart or otherwise.
Do you really believe this? I do respect you Chirimoya but I don't know if you say this out of ignorance or you are in denial.
 

NALs

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It won't happen!

There are many Dominicans (me included) that will fight with our bare hands to make sure the DR remains independent, especially from the country that we fought ourselves out of!

Eventually a real Dominican will take control of the Palacio Nacional and close the border, stop any trade, deport haitians enmasse and those that don't want to leave will be killed. Then that president will be condemned by the international crowd and he will face crimes against humanity charges, convicted, and sentenced to death. No biggie, anything for the mother country!

Why haven't Canada merged with the U.S. yet?

Why haven't Venezuela merged with Colombia yet?

Why haven't Honduras merged with El Salvador yet?

Why haven't all of Africa merged together since they are all black and poor?

The DR is not going to join Haiti. Haiti was not even suppose to be a country! The island was first discovered by the Spaniards and the Spanish speaking side will rule the island forever, end of story. Haiti is the poorest country outside of Africa, the DR is just poor not the Poorest. Man, if Juan Bosch would have invaded in the 1980s it would have been a different island for sure. The U.S. and U.N. were showing signs of supporting Bosch if he invaded Haiti and ended their sovreignity. He should have done it, that way stupid daydreaming questions like merging would not have come up!!

By the way, are you Haitian or Haitian sympathetic or a Traitor? Just wondering.
 

wventura

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Nal0whs said:
There are many Dominicans (me included) that will fight with our bare hands to make sure the DR remains independent, especially from the country that we fought ourselves out of!

Eventually a real Dominican will take control of the Palacio Nacional and close the border, stop any trade, deport haitians enmasse and those that don't want to leave will be killed. Then that president will be condemned by the international crowd and he will face crimes against humanity charges, convicted, and sentenced to death. No biggie, anything for the mother country!
Standard hate, brought on by years of unjustified anit-hatian propaganda. This is what i was talking about before, there is no need for this. Dominicans need to let this sentiment go, because haitians are far from being their enemies.



Why haven't Canada merged with the U.S. yet?

Why haven't Venezuela merged with Colombia yet?

Why haven't Honduras merged with El Salvador yet?
Thats a rediculous comparison. The examples you listed are all of very large countries, in different climatic regions, and with different concerns and needs. This is not the case for haiti and the D.R

Quisqueya is too small of a place to be divided up in two, and in such close proximity. If unified, the island could combine resources, and workforces, and benefit in the long run. Haiti (under a different government) will have plenty to offer.



Why haven't all of Africa merged together since they are all black and poor?
You should at least TRY to not sound so racist, especially considering the fact that the dominican republic is of mostly african ancestry.
I wont even address this grose generalization.



Haiti is the poorest country outside of Africa, the DR is just poor not the Poorest.
The D.R is extremely poor. Dominicans need to stop with this superiority complex. Most dominicans are busted *** poor as well. Although the D.R does economically exceed haiti, its not as much as people would like to think.

And what is up with this "poorest outside africa" bull?? Hell the D.R is poorer than most african countries economically. You're delerious.



By the way, are you Haitian or Haitian sympathetic or a Traitor? Just wondering.
I'm an american of dominican decent (second generation).
 
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DRshooter

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wventura said:
I think dominicans and haitians should just put all that **** in the past behind them, and cohabitate. DR, and haiti (BOTH very poor countries), could potentially benefit from being unified. Remaining devided is counter productive.

There is no legitamate justification for the anti-haitian atitudes of Dominincans. So if they could try to forget about all the predjudices, and preconceived notions, of haiti (as well as color issues), I think it would be easy to cohabitate. Dominicans always say things like "Quiqueya la bella", so why not make that again and forget about being so divided.[/QUOTE

Sure, and after that happens, you still have a country to go to when this side goes to ****. This is my only country, everywhere else I go I'm an immigrant... so butt out. Enjoy the beach and the women...but leave the opinions on this matter to the people that love this place and who's ancestors have bled for what little we have.
Haitians are reaping what they sowed...
 

wventura

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DRshooter said:
Sure, and after that happens, you still have a country to go to when this side goes to ****. This is my only country, everywhere else I go I'm an immigrant... so butt out. Enjoy the beach and the women...but leave the opinions on this matter to the people that love this place and who's ancestors have bled for what little we have.
Haitians are reaping what they sowed...
How are you so sure that the country will go to ****, after being unified???? Please explain.


"but leave the opinions on this matter to the people that love this place and who's ancestors have bled for what little we have"

The D.R is my country as well, and my ancestry. I love the D.R and I think unification, will change Quisqueya for the better.

And what are you referring to when you say "whos ancestors have bled for what little we have".?? Do you have a specific historical event in mind when you say that??
 

DRshooter

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wventura said:
How are you so sure that the country will go to ****, after being unified???? Please explain.


"but leave the opinions on this matter to the people that love this place and who's ancestors have bled for what little we have"

The D.R is my country as well, and my ancestry. I love the D.R and I think unification, will change Quisqueya for the better.

And what are you referring to when you say "whos ancestors have bled for what little we have".?? Do you have a specific historical event in mind when you say that??
Do you live here...my guess is NO. I can see you have never lived here. Have you ever been to haiti?? I guess NO.... The event you are proposing is like telling americans they should join up with mexico.
For us it's very troubling because most people that have never been here, policy makers in the US and EU have this plan to unite us because they have no idea that our cultures are so diff. We don't speak the same language and don't see the world the same way.
It has been said that Clinton, after visiting this country said that if he knew then what he knows now about Dominican Rep and Haiti, his government would have done a lot of things diff.
 

Chirimoya

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Narcosis said:
Do you really believe this? I do respect you Chirimoya but I don't know if you say this out of ignorance or you are in denial.
I forgot the Haitians themselves, who are like any other immigrants in search of a better life. Is there anyone else?

Chiri
 

Narcosis

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Chirimoya said:
I forgot the Haitians themselves, who are like any other immigrants in search of a better life. Is there anyone else?

Chiri
The problem is we can't compare Haiti to any other country in our continent. Comparing Mexican imigration to that of Haiti is silly. Mexico is a nation actually a wealthy nation, in Mexio's case it is a "normal" form of imigration as is the case with Nicaraguans to Costa Rica, Nicragua is poorer than the DR but it is still a true nation and people leave because they aspire a better life.

Haiti is not a nation, it is a failed attempt of a nation so it must be treated as such by the international community and not left for the Dominican Republic to deal with.

Yes there are certain sectors in the DR that have cashed-in on Haitian labor and that does not have to be a bad thing at all. In the past there was a controlled and organized flow of migrant workers from Haiti and they would come and go as migrant workers. Today we see a permanent integration of these workers, this is wrong and unconstitutional. The PRD has opeanly used these people for political gain and is a part of international policy Pena Gomez planned and left that party as his legacy. This is what needs to be corrected.

Our best interests are that Haiti recovers and becomes a viable nation one that we can have normal trade relations with and help solve common problems with such as deforestation. If Haiti is left on it's own to solve it's problems or worse the current course is maitained, both countries will become failed nations.
 
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