Hippo a hero? A major fraud took place

Golo100

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Now Hipolito is being made a hero for his early "quitting". The truth is he was forced by the state department on orders from Collin Powell due to the heavy pressure being put on by Congressman Robert Menendez. News coming from DR to Menendez showed that major fraud had taken place in Santiago and Santo Domingo voting districts and that the shortfall of this fraud was still too large to make it effective to steal the election for Hipolito, forcing the PPH to go to their plan "B", which was military take over of voting records ready to be sent to JCE(Junta Central Electoral). But this plan, which actually was carried over, in some cases without military force, but with help from local politicians like Mayor Lois and Batista, still came up with too few votes to turn the election around. By then, Menendez, as early as 6:15 pm had received results from exit polls indicating a huge Leonel victory exceeding 64% of the total vote and only 24% for Hipolito.

So four major generals who head the armed forces began to organize the action plan, which included mobilizing close to 50,000 armed men, many soldiers in civilian clothes, and as many as 200,000 altogether, including barrio thugs properly trained prior to the elections, to carry over an election coup. The plan collapsed as soon as Menendez made the call to Powell. Powell directed the U.S. ambassador, who reluctantly(since he is a PPH man who loves Hipolito)followed orders to put together the meeting where Monsignor Agripino Nunez Collado took the leading role. This was not Agripino's idea, but Powell's. The monsignor was chosen for appearances only, but the U.S. ambassador was told to stick next to him all the time.

PLD "generals" were ready on the other side to lead a rebellion just in case, with several key military posts already in place, with rebellious younger officers, who were 80% in favor of Leonel. Major bloodshed was prevented, but it would have been a very quick defeat for Hipolito's forces nevertheless, since the military power was on the side of the PLD.

This clown, Hipolito was not smart enough to concede. He did not want to do it. His men were reluctant to do it. But the pressure was on, and now he looks like a hero.

The three provinces Hipolito barely won in the border had 20,000 Haitians that were registered and voted for the PPH and nationwide there were close to 150,000 illegal Haitians who voted, mostly in Santo Domingo Norte, Santiago, Santo Domingo Este, Boca Chica, San Pedro de Macoris, Azua, and Monte Plata. Another 90,000 cedulas were stolen or bought and people voted twice .This accounted for almost 6% of the vote, which made the difference in the actual vote that Hipolito will get. Hippo legally had no more than 24-26.50% of the vote. But the fraud was not enough. Junta Central knew about the fraud, but did nothing to stop it. Guido Gomez Mazara led the civilian group of thugs who planned this whole thing, with help from Tomas Hernandez Alberto.

TW
 

AZB

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Jan 2, 2002
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Golo, your account is so true. here is what I saw:
on the day of elections, there were a bunch of gun tottling PPH thugs patrolling the streets of JCE building and voting escuelas. I knew there was somthing up. They were drunk and almost all of them armed (automatic rifles and 9mm hand guns. These folks had some secret plans to win or take over the elections, no matter what it took.
Then when Hippo announced his loss, there was almost a mutiny among the PHH thugs. many wanted to go ahead and cause the civil dosorder anyway but they were adviced to stay put and wait.
The next day a PPH guy come to my house in tears. He claims to have lost 4 years of his life and felt betrayed by hippo. Then he invites another PPH thug to my house without even asking for my permision. This young chap was a bit angry at hippo and felt also betrayed by him. He then goes to tell that how the whole military was on hippo's side and how they were going to take over the JCE and cease all the votes and have the plan in action. He was not sure why Hippo and PPH guys didn't do what they had planned. He put all the blame on Hippo.
So there you have it in Golo's words, there was a plan to take over the elections but it never took off the table.
AZB
 

Porfio_Rubirosa

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If One-Tenth of that Story is True ...

We should be thanking our lucky stars that a 1965 redux was avoided.

If 50% of the story were true, then trials for sedition would be in order.
 
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roca

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"This clown, Hipolito was not smart enough to concede. He did not want to do it. His men were reluctant to do it. But the pressure was on, and now he looks like a hero."

While I have never contested your posts, as a matter of fact I've always enjoyed them, I must do so at this new post. Not in all of it's parts as I cannot prove or dissprove what you are saying. However I must disagree with you in your assumption that Hipolito was reluctant. For reasons I cannot express here, I can tell you, two of the ambassadors standing next to Agripino, called Hipolito, after he accepted Leonel's victory, to comment to him that he had precipitated in saying he had lost. His response was that according to his results, the numbers were clear and that there was no need in keeping people nervous expecting the results. As a matter of fact to one of those ambassadors he even mention the following: "What are you complaining? Your ex-president had just done the same thing a few weeks ago."
 

BushBaby

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I only believe 10% of what Golo has stated as being FACT ............... But it wouldn't take much to convinvce me of another 70 or 80%!!!!!

I am SURE there was somrthing afoot to defraud the Voters of the rights! I am SURE the military & PPH thugs could/would be involved & I am SURE misdirecting/losing of ballot boxes would have been on the cards, but I have no PROOF of this. My view of Hippo's capitulation is that the OBSEVERS found a scam/fraud had been committed that was totally abhorent & were going to announce it to the press/media for the Voters to see & that would have caused total uprising against the PPH. Again, I don't know what it was & I doubt if we mere mortals would have been able to PROVE anything, but I am confident that the Observers could & WOULD have done.

Would LOVE to hear of any proof you have TW (& I don't mean that sarcastically - honest!!), so please put it here or PM me if you feel happier doing so. - Grahame.
 

Chirimoya

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Dec 9, 2002
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There must be an element of truth in this, but my problem with these scenarios it that it wildly inflates the importance of a small country like the DR in the scheme of things. Doesn't Colin Powell have much more pressing matters on his mind these days?

Chiri
 

frank alvarez

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Thank God For International Observers!

Golo's version is partially true and perhaps very close to the total truth. I think Hippo is not such a hero and was only forced by the circumstances of the international community watching closely and perhaps the U.S.'s last minute pressures. In any case, the people spoke clearly about wanting Hippo out and Leonel in and that has happened, finally! Had there not been tight supervision by international observers, led by the U.S., Canada and European Community, maybe we would be in the middle of the birth of a civil war since most of us would not take it lying down and would have had to go out on the streets to fight these PPH thugs! They are on their way out and need to be kept out, forever!!
 

frank alvarez

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The Back Door

Chirimoya said:
There must be an element of truth in this, but my problem with these scenarios it that it wildly inflates the importance of a small country like the DR in the scheme of things. Doesn't Colin Powell have much more pressing matters on his mind these days?

Chiri
You're forgetting that the DR is right at the back door of the USA and already there are problems in Cuba, Haiti and Venezuela and certainly the U.S. government doesn't want another one here. The DR has always been of strategic importance to the U.S. and has been a semi-colony forever!
 

Porfio_Rubirosa

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Here's another theory

Periodico Hoy reports parts of the story at http://www.hoy.com.do/(e4k1hae1mctfserwv3pus5fb)/aspx/article.aspx?id=13965

My theory is that Hippo allowed the first bulletin to be released so he wouldn't have to follow-through with the plan. I can practically hear him now:

"Look, I've got mine. I've taken everything. That's what power is all about. I've got more money in Miami and Zurich than Leonel will see in his lifetime. Ha! Sovereign bonds. That was Malkum's idea. Brilliant! Who knew that after you steal everything, the Yanquis keep on giving you more and more? All we had to do was sign papers. Ha! See this watch - it's a Movado. Leonel can only dream of a watch like this. My houses in Jarabacoa and Cambita are the finast in the country - better than anything Trujillo built. Why would I want to risk MY LIFE for the benefit of those PRD chopos who think they're entitled to my crumbs forever. You think I'd give up my life for that m----- Guido? Let him and his chopos die in the streets or be forced to flee to some hell hole like Ecuador. Listen, compadre, I've got a huge yaught tied up in Nice. It even has a pool. If I'm dead, who's going to enjoy it?"
 
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Chris_NJ

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Dec 17, 2003
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I could believe these events. Congressman Menendez (some of said that Menendez is on the long list of potential running mates for Kerry - so he could be influential) has definitely taken an interest in what is happening in DR (see the thread I did last week which has a link to the PLD website which shows a letter from Menendez to Colin Powell discussing Sunday's election - http://www.dr1.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31502).
 
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Robert

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KrackedKris said:
Regarding Powell demanding the solution?
I must admit, I found that a little hard to believe.
Then again, stranger things have happened???
I'm sure Powell was more than a little upset when the DR pulled out troops.

The truth is, we may never know...
 

Porfio_Rubirosa

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KrackedKris said:
Regarding Powell demanding the solution?
I'm also in disbelief about the importance of Menendez or Powell. Menendez is a single, minority party, politician in the US. I don't know if anyone else in the US government cared about DR elections. And it's hard to believe, based on track record, that the Bush administration would do anything proactive in this case.

I do agree that the US Ambassador seems to be a PPH opportunist chopo in his own right and has probably been sending glowing reports about Hippo to Washington anyway.

More likely the Canadian ambassador and the OAS were exerting the influence - and this is consistent with news accounts.
 

KrackedKris

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Chirimoya said:
There must be an element of truth in this, but my problem with these scenarios it that it wildly inflates the importance of a small country like the DR in the scheme of things. Doesn't Colin Powell have much more pressing matters on his mind these days?

Chiri
On the day of your elections, Powell was busy trying to save his own rear as his press aide moved a camera during "Meet the Press" with Tim Russert.

I just find it hard to believe Powell would have "ordered" anything like Golo gossiped.
 

Golo100

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Proof?????????

Let me just say this....in my family we have two recently retired generals,four colonels, one active general, a major general whose name I am not going to mention either, because he is so close to Hipolito(in job only) that it would be insane to throw his name here, and many younger officers coming up from my family. I am talking about brothers and cousins(not farther)

In addition, my "brother-in-law", not so brother in law because my woman is a live-in girlfriend, was graduated with honors from the academy last year and he is now a lieutenant serving the headquarters of a major ammo warehouse in a vicinity across one of the bridges in Santo Domingo(I will not mention it, except that it is famous for "chicharrones"). He is one of the best young officers coming up and is close to all the officers in his class, all now first and second lieutenants, and he kept me well informed thru cellular calls. They were ready just in case the top brass tried anything funny.

If you still think I am making this up, just read between the lines on comments made by former Colombian president Pastrana regarding events that were prevented with Hipolito's surrender. Just wait a few more days, or perhaps weeks, and this whole thing will unfold. That is, unless it is better for Leonel to keep it quiet to be able to govern better without the scandal being wide open.

And those who think a war was not ready to break out, just look at the parade at the Malecon all day long. It was just a parade, but the same crowds could have started a civil war easily. I can tell you right off hand, that the majority of the men at the Malecon were heavily armed and ready to fight if their celebration would have been thwarted. Just to give you an idea, even between PLD friends celebrating there were shots fired yesterday over simple arguments. People were gun happy. Hippo had no choice.

TW