Is it necessary to learn Spanish in order to live in the DR?

[SantiagoDR]

Learning Spanish when moving to this country is particularly important since the local impression is that every foreigner is rich and therefore welcome prey for exploitation and exorbitant charges for goods and services which have no fixed prices.

I have to disagree some with this part.

YES, the better your Spanish, the better off you are, BUT, that is only part of the answer.
You can get ripped off speaking Spanish just as easy, you are still a foreigner!

Which reminds me of my English speaking "Dominican" friend back in 1991. We were going to his home town of Rio San Juan from Sosua to visit and he said let him pay the fare else they will charge me more because I am an American. I let him, but as we were traveling I watched the other passengers to see what they were paying. For the return trip "my friend" asked me for the money to pay.

I said "No Thanks", that was the last time I trusted "my friend".

You also have to be street wise in this country (Very Important here).
Don't for a minute think that just knowing Spanish is going to always protect you.

Spanish or not, I am usually smart enough to know what I should pay.
I always translate the prices to U.S. dollars automatically on everything.

Just remember that "My friend", "Today Only" means they are dangling the hook in front of you.

Speaking Spanish is not what will save you from exorbitant charges.
Being street wise is what will save you.

The answer to the question is:
You should know at least SOME Spanish and be very street wise to live in this country.


Don

 

[J D Sauser]

....
The answer to the question is:
You should know at least SOME Spanish and be very street wise to live in this country.
Don

Yes, at least, one should.

However, you need to know the lingo to be able to acquire the street smarts to a particular country.
While being street wise is in PART a mindset, street wisdom acquired in one country can't necessarily apply to every place of this world.

My demeanor in Ecuador is NOT the same as it is HERE, and very different than when I go to Dallas, Miami or NYC. The issues, cultures and threats are different, and so are the lessons learned.

... J-D.

 

[jrhartley]

that is very true .. Im a soft touch in any country, even when I DO speak the language, not understanding makes it easier to say no for me

 

[laurajane]

I would have thought it is quite simple...

Yes you can live in the DR without speaking spanish, but obviously it means that you can not understand nor converse with anyone who does not speak english i.e rather alot of people!!

Not many of us came here already fluent in spanish, but you HAVE TO make the effort to learn unless you only want to converse with expats. And even everyday trips to the bank or understanding a simple sign can still be hard work.

Yes you can get by for a while by pointing at things and doing strange impressions to get by at the corner shop, but that gets boring for everyone pretty quickly!!

 

[jrhartley]

I suppose the telephone would be the worst thing here , I mean picking things up and paying for them without speaking is second nature- i did that in the uk, who actually wants to speak to shop assistants or they you.
as soon as i try some mangled spanish on the telephone it suddenly goes dead.....whats that all about ?

 

[Lambada]

as soon as i try some mangled spanish on the telephone it suddenly goes dead.....whats that all about ?

You have a soft, gentle sort of voice and, chances are, a diffident manner of speaking. They probably can't HEAR you......... Try speaking a bit more forcefully & see if that makes any difference.

 

[jrhartley]

was that you calling me to test lol

 

[Marianopolita]

Dominican Spanish and learning how to bargain...

In my experience countries that rely on tourism as their principal industry or one of their main industries for income has this problem of what I call fluctuating prices or pricing for everything. There's no price until they 'see' you and then an arbitrary price comes to mind. They pick a high number because they know people will try to bargain for a lower price (this is for tourists, repeated visitors and foreigners who reside in the country that know the price is elevated or fabricated just because they are the customer). Or in a general sense it’s the mindset of the less fortunate which is to try to rip people off. I have seen this in a few other Latin countries I have been to and some other non Latin ones as well. Knowledge of Spanish and street Spanish will give tourists and foreigners the edge over their counterparts who don't speak the language but that's only part of it in my opinion. It comes down to one word- REGATEAR and the art of knowing how to do it to avoid getting ripped off.


Dominican Spanish

There are many comments in this thread and in a poll I requested last year about Spanish in the DR. Without a doubt, it's a challenge for many but I also wonder about the type of Spanish people expected to hear because some comments indicate complete disillusion or shock as compared to the Spanish they have heard spoken by other Spanish speakers or learned via studies. I think to a certain extent this happens to many people with languages especially if people really don't interact with native speakers during their studies, listen to the spoken language via television or music or even have a different teacher. All these factors influence a person's perception about how language is spoken in everyday life. It well never sound like the classroom version even with native speakers in the class (yes, native speakers take university Spanish courses too). Spanish in the DR is just one example of the many spoken varieties and bottom line is you do not have to change your way of speaking. You will be understood and eventually you will understand most of what people say over time.

Colonialism changed the language and linguistic dynamic in the Caribbean. It is heard in all forms. The slaves brought their language(s) to the Caribbean while the existing populations spoke theirs and of course via colonialism European languages were imported be it English, French, Spanish, Dutch, or Portuguese. The linguistic dynamic is what makes the Caribbean- Greater and Lesser Antilles and the Netherland Antilles fascinating areas of study for all those who are interested and knowledgeable about language (in general) and languages. What happened to Spanish in the DR happened to all the islands in the Caribbean. In some cases even Creoles formed and are still spoken today in some islands. As well French in the Caribbean is different (accent, grammatical structure, speech patterns and vocabulary) as compared to French spoken in France, Switzerland and French-speaking African countries etc but at the end of the day- c'est la m?me langue !

For those who have not seen this poll on Dominican Spanish. Here it is: http://www.dr1.com/forums/polls/88348-dominican-spanish.html


~MP.

 

[JustmeJeff]

I've lived here for a year. I don't speak much Spanish at all, I work in an English-speaking environment (read: call centre) and congregate with those people that speak English.

I find that (for whatever reason) if you speak more then one language (regardless if English if your first language or not), you are likely to have a personality and attitude that I get click with.

My roommates are Dominican, although both have lived in the USA longer than here. My partner is Dominican and never lived anywhere else. Their attitudes and lifestyles mesh with mine.

My friends are Dominican, and their friends typically speak English (or Russian) as well.

I understand most Spanish if I understand the context first. I've had many conversations where I speak English and the other person speaks Spanish.

Of the people I know here that only speak English (a handful) I generally dislike them on a few levels for whatever reason. Mainly due to the American/Canadian divide.

All this "luck" in my life here may be due to my age (26) and the fact that I am rarely every alone. If I do need to go out by myself (I can't even think of a good example) I don't really need to speak to anyone anyways. I didn't have conversations with the cashier when I bought groceries when I lived in Canada, there isn't any reason to here.

I don't believe you need to speak an of the native language in any country to enjoy it and love its culture and customs.

Just my two cents

 

[belgiank]

- lesson nr1: when you arrive... you look pale and look like a foreigner... and therefore you are rich and easy prey...
- exactly the same, even in Europe and the US, although they are more refined about it... I have yet to discover a hotel in the US, from 3star to 5star, or a car rental company, where they did not try to cheat me on my bill. Surprisingly, it works in most of the cases. As example, we went to the official World Championship hotel (for Canine Disc Sports) as participant (and therefore special rates), and arrived 9 days prior to the championships... when we got the bill they tried to charge us full price for the 9 days prior to the competition, and for some movies we did not see, etc... I politely pointed this out to them and they immediately changed the bill. A friend of ours arrived 2 days prior to the competition and was also charged the full amount for all the days he stayed there... he paid without complaint...:squareeye
- lesson nr2: every friend here will be glad to help you, and will take a kickback on this help... your question should be "is the kickback still worth the help?", and not the indignified exclamation... "the a****e is cheating me!"
- example: I want to buy a moto here... my price is 78,000, his price is
65,000. So what if he gets a kickback? I'm willing to pay him another 1,000 as this still saves me 12,000!!! Here, it is a world of live and let live... and the worst... frequently... are the expats... sorry... DAMN... can you take points away??? :cheeky::cheeky:

So yes... being streetwise is the first answer.... common sense is the second one...

knowing some Spanglish... and using it... is the thirth answer...

blending in, becoming part of the community, being respectful to the local customs, giving business to the local people, etc... is the fourth... and probably the most important factor of NOT GETTING CHEATED TOO MUCH... :bunny::bunny:

 

[Africaida]

it is not comparable

Colonialism changed the language and linguistic dynamic in the Caribbean. It is heard in all forms. The slaves brought their language(s) to the Caribbean while the existing populations spoke theirs and of course colonists imported their European languages be it English, French, Spanish, Dutch, or Portuguese. The linguistic dynamic is what makes the Caribbean- Greater and Lesser Antilles and the Netherland Antilles fascinating areas of study for all those who are interested and knowledgeable about language (in general) and languages. What happened to Spanish in the DR happened to all the islands in the Caribbean. In some cases even Creoles formed and are still spoken today in some islands. As well French in the Caribbean is different (accent, grammatical structure, speech pattern and vocabulary) as compared to French spoken in France, Switzerland and French- speaking African countries etc but at the end of the day- c'est la m?me langue !

For those who not have not seen this poll on Dominican Spanish. Here it is: http://www.dr1.com/forums/polls/88348-dominican-spanish.html


~MP.

I love your posts as I find them very informative, but I disagree with a couple things.

I don't think you can compare Spanish in the DR to the evolution of French in the Carribean. In Martinique, Guadeloupe or Haiti is not French, it is Creole. It is absolutely not the same language as French. The grammar, the words and more are totally different. Someone from Haiti can be talking next to me and I won't have a clue what they are talking about, it is not a matter of different pronunciation or different word, it is a different language. Similarly, if a Jamaican speaks Patois an American or British would have no idea what their talking about. Donc, ce n'est plus du tout la meme langue.

Logically, Spanish in the DR may have had the same influences but it didn t evolve to the point of being a different language i.e. a native Spanish speaker would not have any problem communicating in the DR.

Now, if you take French from Canada, they do have a different accent, may use different words here and there, but I would understand perfectly. That is where the comparison between Spanish from Spain and from the DR can be made.


Also, French spoken in African country is indeed the same language, but has evolved very little because it is an only official language. It is not the language people use at home, so it is not the same dynamics.

 

[Africaida]

I don't believe you need to speak an of the native language in any country to enjoy it and love its culture and customs.

Sure you may still enjoy the culture and the customs, but you would be clueless about 75% of them- even though you think you are not.
Actually, you wouldn't realize how clueless you are because you don't know what is being said around you. May be better who knows ?

 

[JustmeJeff]

Sure you may still enjoy the culture and the customs, but you would be clueless about 75% of them- even though you think you are not.
Actually, you wouldn't realize how clueless you are because you don't know what is being said around you. May be better who knows ?

I can't comment on customs, you may be entirely correct. I would hazard to opine that language is much less important in that case then experience and simply time spent in a country.

But why would I surround myself amongst people that would talk badly about me in ANY language? Like I said, I can understand a majority of what is being said, and I have been in situations (taxis, waiting in a line) where I have caught on that the discussion concerns me.

I'm concerned that would would assume people would speak badly about a foreigner, in ANY country. Do you consider this the norm?

I was in a situation here where some white Americans thought I[ wasn't an English speaking person, and made comments (I have obviously stretched earlobe piercings), when I let them know I understood, they were shocked, but I think they learned.

It's sad that many people here seem to state you can't be friends with local Dominicans because all they want is your money. I continue to earn a median income Canadian salary and I've never been in a situation where money I have lent (never more then ~2000RD) hasn't been paid back in full (I've maybe done this around 10 times. Everyone I work with is aware I make a foreign income, but I haven't felt animosity about it. I am valued and respected in my workplace because of my performance, not my income. Again, why do people seem to surround, or have MANY experiences with these types of people? If they are your choice of companion, you shouldn't complain.

Ah, Mondays.... always good for some light discussion.

 

[Bronxboy]

I personally know many Dominicans from the DR and NY.

Almost all of them are hard working, great peeps.

Of course there are bad apples but you learn to deal with them at a distance.

All in all, Dominicans are no different than Puerto Ricans.

Latinos are latinos, in my opinion.:bunny:

 

[Marianopolita]

Oh yes there is a comparison...most definitely

I love your posts as I find them very informative, but I disagree with a couple things.

I don't think you can compare Spanish in the DR to the evolution of French in the Carribean. In Martinique, Guadeloupe or Haiti is not French, it is Creole. It is absolutely not the same language as French. The grammar, the words and more are totally different. Someone from Haiti can be talking next to me and I won't have a clue what they are talking about, it is not a matter of different pronunciation or different word, it is a different language. Similarly, if a Jamaican speaks Patois an American or British would have no idea what their talking about. Donc, ce n'est plus du tout la meme langue.

Logically, Spanish in the DR may have had the same influences but it didn t evolve to the point of being a different language i.e. a native Spanish speaker would not have any problem communicating in the DR.

Now, if you take French from Canada, they do have a different accent, may use different words here and there, but I would understand perfectly. That is where the comparison between Spanish from Spain and from the DR can be made.


Also, French spoken in African country is indeed the same language, but has evolved very little because it is an only official language. It is not the language people use at home, so it is not the same dynamics.

Africaida,

My post is too general as a result many details about language get left out. I think you have misunderstood my post. There are linguistic comparisons that can be made individually meaning Spanish-speaking countries, French-speaking countries, English-speaking countries and then a general comparison about the language dynamic in the Caribbean. There are definitely African influences on Spanish and French in Caribbean. This is the key point I was trying to get across.

Trust me on this my studies and research have been well done. Go to the drop down menu under my name and look at the threads I have started over the past five years.

I did not say Haiti was French-speaking, actually it's one of the Creoles to which I am referring but French is spoken in the Caribbean in those same countries you mentioned. Oh, I know all about French from Canada, look at my screen name. Guess what that means in Spanish.


I will leave it at that. Language posts can going for ever and believe me I do understand your point of view. I am just looking at language from a much deeper angle which includes syntax analysis.


-MP.

 

[jrhartley]

a case in point - you can speak the language but still manage to annoy people

 

[Africaida]

Africaida,

There are definitely African influences on Spanish and French in Caribbean. This is the key point I was trying to get across.

Sorry, you might be too deep for me

Kidding aside, there is no doubt about the influences. Although I was born and raised in France, I am of African descent. Since I speak an African language (Mandingo), I agree.

Cheers

 

[Africaida]

You are way off

I can't comment on customs, you may be entirely correct. I would hazard to opine that language is much less important in that case then experience and simply time spent in a country.

But why would I surround myself amongst people that would talk badly about me in ANY language? Like I said, I can understand a majority of what is being said, and I have been in situations (taxis, waiting in a line) where I have caught on that the discussion concerns me.

I'm concerned that would would assume people would speak badly about a foreigner, in ANY country. Do you consider this the norm?

I was in a situation here where some white Americans thought I[ wasn't an English speaking person, and made comments (I have obviously stretched earlobe piercings), when I let them know I understood, they were shocked, but I think they learned.

It's sad that many people here seem to state you can't be friends with local Dominicans because all they want is your money. I continue to earn a median income Canadian salary and I've never been in a situation where money I have lent (never more then ~2000RD) hasn't been paid back in full (I've maybe done this around 10 times. Everyone I work with is aware I make a foreign income, but I haven't felt animosity about it. I am valued and respected in my workplace because of my performance, not my income. Again, why do people seem to surround, or have MANY experiences with these types of people? If they are your choice of companion, you shouldn't complain.

Ah, Mondays.... always good for some light discussion.

You misunderstood me, I never meant that people talk bad about you. I meant, language was necessary to understand fully a culture. To understand a culture is also to understand what ordinary people around you talk -or even gossip- about.

Sorry to me language is as important as the time spent in the country,

I am not a part of the Dominican bashing crowd either.

 

[Africaida]

a case in point - you can speak the language but still manage to annoy people

Am I annoying you?
Last time I checked this was a Public forum. if we all agreed, it would be boring no?

 

[Chirimoya]

This is an interesting topic - let's try and keep the discussion harmonious and respectful.