News from the Border

mountainannie

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I don't know many who have actually visited the border "regions" of the DR.. Some, perhaps. have been to Pedernales to see Bahia des Agiles? Maybe to the beach at Monte Christi? I quite adored the border areas but it is still the most neglected region of the DR. There was an initiative under Leonel to reward industries that moved there.. But - from this article, it seems none have done so.. There is enormous farming done in the valley near San Juan De Maguana... an overproduction of beans that go to waste since there are no packing sort of plants..

Since the border trade into Haiti has perhaps ground to a halt .. these regions are going to be more and more devastated... Dajabon was reasonably prosperous..
but ?

 
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johne

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I don't know many who have actually visited the border "regions" of the DR.. Some, perhaps. have been to Pedernales to see Bahia des Agiles? Maybe to the beach at Monte Christi? I quite adored the border areas but it is still the most neglected region of the DR. There was an initiative under Leonel to reward industries that moved there.. But - from this article, it seems none have done so.. There is enormous farming done in the valley near San Juan De Maguana... an overproduction of beans that go to waste since there are no packing sort of plants..

Since the border trade into Haiti has perhaps ground to a halt .. these regions are going to be more and more devastated... Dajabon was reasonably prosperous..
but ?

In regards to the 5 senators that have a forward thinking idea as to solve "the problem"....are they not forgeting that big fat elephant in the room. As a reminder, he is the guy in the black hat (so appropriate for a bad guy) with several weapons hanging from his dirty neck that is holding amrican and canadian citizens?? How quickly ones forget that the "the devil is in the details". Ole school adage but still very true. IMO
 

mountainannie

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In regards to the 5 senators that have a forward thinking idea as to solve "the problem"....are they not forgeting that big fat elephant in the room. As a reminder, he is the guy in the black hat (so appropriate for a bad guy) with several weapons hanging from his dirty neck that is holding amrican and canadian citizens?? How quickly ones forget that the "the devil is in the details". Ole school adage but still very true. IMO
I am not quite sure exactly what you mean. It is difficult to communicate over print. I am not sure if you are referring to the leaser of 400 Mawazo? Etc? Or perhaps Baron Samedi? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baron_Samedi?

I believe that what the Senators from the border are suggesting is if THEIR side of the border was more productive, had more industry, and thus more $$ and traffic and connection with the rest of the Dominican Republic, they would not be so vulnerable as they are now to be overrun by Haitians.

The border is 224 miles long. It is really only geared at the three entry points- Dajabon, Elias Pina and Pedernales.

So the Senators are proposing putting in businesses.

There is one plant that Groupo M built in what is technically Haitian soil but has its entry in Dajabon.


I believe that there is certainly an opportunity for Famosa to set up such an operation in Belledairse/Elias Pina for canning the beans that are being grown near San Juan de Maguana.

in-peravia-to-coronavirus-unemployed/
 

johne

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Ah, sorry for the confusion. I should have been clearer. The elephant in the room, or the elepant that now dominates the border is the gang of 400.I'm confused in a sense that they are talking about plans for building and trading at the same border that harbors murderers and kidnappers.What talks are being had that address "the problem" which is as I recall 16 Americans that are groveling in that shyte hole with no hope in sight?
Unless the elimination of the gangs and prisoners takes place I don't see any reason for talking about the future.
Now, I'm sure there are those that will say about the innocents? Good question. Maybe the popualtion that will starve to death will see a way for civil disorder to vaporize the gang of 400?
My point is simple. Lets take care of business first. The business of the release of the 16 people.
 

mountainannie

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Well - I am sure that the Senators from the border provinces of the Dominican Republic are far more concerned for the Dominican citizens who live in fairly impoverished circumstances (compared to the rest of the DR) rather than the fate of 15 American missionaries who decided to stay in a country that was already at a level 3 danger advisory from their own State Department. As I have read the information, one or perhaps two of the captives only arrived in Haiti a few days before the kidnapping when the threat level was at 4.

One assumes that the Dominican Senators, who certainly know their land and their people, and their neighbors better than anyone, would be the ones in a position to know what would be best for the interests of the Dominican Republic in order to best secure its own border.
 
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mountainannie

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I omitted the mention of Jimani - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimaní. THAT Wiki is utterly out to date. There is no open air market to speak of/. Tourists do not go to visit. There is (was) substantial export traffic from the DR to Haiti via truck when I started to visit c.2008. The road was flooded more than once and the customs office on the Haitian side had to be moved to higher ground. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_Enriquillo
 

johne

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Well - I am sure that the Senators from the border provinces of the Dominican Republic are far more concerned for the Dominican citizens who live in fairly impoverished circumstances (compared to the rest of the DR) rather than the fate of 15 American missionaries who decided to stay in a country that was already at a level 3 danger advisory from their own State Department. As I have read the information, one or perhaps two of the captives only arrived in Haiti a few days before the kidnapping when the threat level was at 4.

One assumes that the Dominican Senators, who certainly know their land and their people, and their neighbors better than anyone, would be the ones in a position to know what would be best for the interests of the Dominican Republic in order to best secure its own border.
Fair enough response. Might I add, it just so happens they were american and canadian citizens....so there is no degree of concern on this side of the border? There will be I suppose, managers, office help, many people daily having money in their pockets. Would there be any threat to them?
IDK.
 

mountainannie

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Ah, sorry for the confusion. I should have been clearer. The elephant in the room, or the elepant that now dominates the border is the gang of 400.I'm confused in a sense that they are talking about plans for building and trading at the same border that harbors murderers and kidnappers.What talks are being had that address "the problem" which is as I recall 16 Americans that are groveling in that shyte hole with no hope in sight?
Unless the elimination of the gangs and prisoners takes place I don't see any reason for talking about the future.
Now, I'm sure there are those that will say about the innocents? Good question. Maybe the popualtion that will starve to death will see a way for civil disorder to vaporize the gang of 400?
My point is simple. Lets take care of business first. The business of the release of the 16 people.
Aside from the crossing at Jimani, I doubt the gang activity is anywhere near the border. I doubt that there is gang activity in Belladaire https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belladère
which is in the mountains - as a friend of mine posted a picture of a recent outdoor concert put on by the band https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RAM_(band). in Hinche which is 2.5 hours away.

There certainly have been "reports" that "gangs" control -- well - between 30-70% of the "territory" or "land" - but I have not heard confirmation of the spread of that activity outside P-au- P. I have a good friend who reports that his family in Jacmel are safe and secure.

And am awaiting news from others who work for NGOs in Haiti but have currently withdrawn.
 

mountainannie

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Fair enough response. Might I add, it just so happens they were american and canadian citizens....so there is no degree of concern on this side of the border? There will be I suppose, managers, office help, many people daily having money in their pockets. Would there be any threat to them?
IDK.
There is a threat to ANYONE now in PauP and the outlying regions... some say even as far north as St. Marc... But that is a long way from the border.

And "Dèyè mòn gen mòn," meaning "beyond mountains there are mountains.

The Dominican police force, Army, and special border control guards are - I believe- completely capable of preventing the spread of the gang violence that is occurring now in Haiti. They are well trained - perhaps - certainly - not paid as much as they should be. But they are a very well organized force and obedient to civil authority.

I would not worry about the violence of the 400 making it into Sto. Dom or ANYWHERE in the DR.

Dominicans are perfectly able to protect their nation and all the foreigners within it -- except - well - the burglaries and such... but..

The only actual "kidnapping" that I heard of in the DR was a group of US missionaires who essentially kidnapped a group of Haitian children and took them across the border to the Dominican border after the earthquake in 2010. They were most certainly stopped - although I do not know what happened to the children or if the missionaries had to face Dominican justice charges...
 
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mountainannie

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Fair enough response. Might I add, it just so happens they were american and canadian citizens....so there is no degree of concern on this side of the border? There will be I suppose, managers, office help, many people daily having money in their pockets. Would there be any threat to them?
IDK.
But reading your post more completely - NO - I doubt that Dominicans living on the border are in fear. They do not pay much attention to the Haitians who come across to buy and sell at the markets... really small traders who do not pose any sort of threat.

The Dominican government has already sent more armed forces up to the border at Dajabon which is the richest one on the Dominican side - with 4 banks.

I assume that they have also fortified the other official border crossings. I would not worry about the gang invasions for my personal safety were I still in the DR.

I AM concerned for the Dominican economy for small producers - but the exports have been declining over the most recent years so most likely the Dominicans have pivoted -- they are very quick and clever. https://tradingeconomics.com/dominican-republic/exports/haiti
 

mountainannie

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But - to continue that thought - the decline on the EXPORTS to Haiti may have - perhaps - impoverished the border region more?? IDK. Certainly Dajabon did a LOT of selling to Haitians but I think I read that the border markets are still open?? And no visiting Elias Pina would mistake it for a prosperous town.
 

DBL J

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I was in Dajabon with Haitian friends renewing visas on the 27th of Nov. Very heavy military presence and only a few vendor stands on the Dominican side.... was walking across the bridge to accompany my friends (one was in a wheelchair) when the Dominican officer asked me what i was doing....i explained accompanying my friends and he said no, no, no, i needed to wait right there ...... so as i waited for the next 20 minutes i watched at least half a dozen people from Haiti pushing wheelbarrows of scrap metal into D.R. some just little kids barely able to move them.
 

mountainannie

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I was in Dajabon with Haitian friends renewing visas on the 27th of Nov. Very heavy military presence and only a few vendor stands on the Dominican side.... was walking across the bridge to accompany my friends (one was in a wheelchair) when the Dominican officer asked me what i was doing....i explained accompanying my friends and he said no, no, no, i needed to wait right there ...... so as i waited for the next 20 minutes i watched at least half a dozen people from Haiti pushing wheelbarrows of scrap metal into D.R. some just little kids barely able to move them.
so - from what you are saying there was no street market open? But were you there on a Market Day? Used to be twice a week that the Haitians were allowed to cross over en masse and trade. They would set up in the streets of Dajabon selling used clothing, discontinued items that are shipped over by Goodwill - etc.. manufacturers closeouts.. sold lots of new clothes as weed and kitchen items and Barbancourt, perfume, stuff like that .. And they'd buy pasta, and styrofoam containers and eggs and canned food to take back.

It would be great, Nan - if you went up to Dajabon and checked on a market day?!?!

Few Dominican journalists ever actually leave the Capitol.
 

mountainannie

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After reading this thread, I need to find an excuse to go back to Dajabon. I'm very curious myself.
Actually, Nan- if you have not been to Elias Pina and San Juan de Maguana? I would certainly recommend a trip up there. San Juan de Maguana is a lovely town - in a high mountain valley.--- I suspect almost WINTER up there now! And then the crossing into Belladaire - I think I had a car that time? although certainly I traveled a lot on the back of conchos.

Belladaire is a quite beautiful old city - it used to be Haiti's "front door" - and is honestly lovely and charming. I walked around the market there with a Haitian translator (helped that he was a strapping 30yr old! But had to keep reminding HIM that I was the ONE that was In Charge...since I was paying HIM - which seemed a concept hard for him...)

There was a lovely hotel on the road there that had a swimming pool... quite charming... I used to go up for vacations.

Wonderful clear country air.

 
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