Old Inverter Batteries

donP

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Dec 14, 2008
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Reliable Sun?

... we run our diesel genertor here on cloudy days for a few hours to top up.

Same here.
We still have our almost new 16 kW diesel generator from the bad old days.
Now we only run it to lubricate the engine every 2 months.

I even thought about selling it... but then the sun may not rise tomorrow.... :rolleyes:


donP
 

windeguy

Platinum
Jul 10, 2004
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Same here.
We still have our almost new 16 kW diesel generator from the bad old days.
Now we only run it to lubricate the engine every 2 months.

I even thought about selling it... but then the sun may not rise tomorrow.... :rolleyes:


donP

Don't sell. You will probably be there for a very long time.
 

jd426

Gold
Dec 12, 2009
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Blue Collar Town in New Jersey
I recently bought a Military 15KW Gen ( mep 004a), diesel on a monster trailer. its an absolute beast. it potentially will put out 15kw 24/7 for weeks without complaining.
.. runs 50hz or 60hz. single or 3 phase..but only 208 volts at single phase unless I modify it to get 240v which i need to do ... its a work in progress.. but will be Fun to play with and fire up ..
again, NOT practical ,but good to know in a real emerg it will power up the whole house without any issue whatsoever, also got 500 gal diesel tank and 2 275's if ever needed . The newer 802 803 are much more fuel efficient though ( also diesel) ..but probably still not practical for a Backup generator for a home.
I would think 10 KW is more than enough for any house ,imo.
 

donP

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Dec 14, 2008
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2 Gallons for the Beast?

I would think 10 KW is more than enough for any house ,imo.

Not really if you have a large battery bank to charge and at the same time want to run a deep well pump and pool pumps, too.
Then, 15/16 kW is a good size.
Also, you would want to run your generator only at 70% output anyway....

What is the hourly consumption of your 'beast'?
A bit more than 2 gallons, I'd guess.

Also nice: The Deuce 2-71

[video=youtube;W6DuFlnIFKA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6DuFlnIFKA[/video]

donP
 

jd426

Gold
Dec 12, 2009
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Blue Collar Town in New Jersey
Yes, over 2 gph..

I agree with everything you say.. except the 70% part... Military generators are MADE to run at 100% of power 24/7, that is the whole point, to run flawlessly in an Emergency situation.
.. short duration they can run at 120 % .. they are way under rated.. Yes , fuel consumption is over 2 gph.. esp at 60 hz which is the higher RPM range , at 50 hz it would be a little less as it simply runs at lower RPM, from what i understand. ( 1800 vs 1500 rpm)

1 gal per Hour ?? ( that Emerson Gen Set) , sure SOUNDS a LOT better. I guess thats at the 1200 RPM range ? . but according to my buds on Smokstak.com.. there is probably more to the story, and its not all good the first thing is Fuel consumption under LOAD may be more like 1.75 gal/ hr not the claimed 1 gph . also, they are extremely LOUD .
These units are probably also military surplus Rebuilds, purchased for Scrap Prices.. Note how he brags about having " thousands" of spare parts in Stock.. I wonder where those are from ?

here is exactly what my unit looks like , only better condition with less hours
( NOT my picture, this is just some guy who sells them online also)
MEP-004A DIESEL 15 kW GENERATOR
 

donP

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Dec 14, 2008
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The Deuce 2-71

I like your beast, really looks great! :bunny:
With only 2,500 hrs. it's a reliable machine.

The Deuce 2-71 was used for decades in railroad refrigerator cars.
{Lots of info/videos on google.}
They run at 800 rpm and 1,200 rpm at 50/60Hz.

There is a guy in FL who offers them for 4,500USD, I do not know in what (true) condition though.
I think they have a warehouse in SD.


donP
 

donP

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Dec 14, 2008
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Specifically Designed for the DR

.

On the new batteries I saw this:


97a14572-489a-41d5-ac28-1a46e7f8a014_zpskwmauer4.jpg



Considering, that a lot of crap is exported to the DR, is this a good or bad sign???? :cheeky:


donP
 

windeguy

Platinum
Jul 10, 2004
44,809
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.

On the new batteries I saw this:


97a14572-489a-41d5-ac28-1a46e7f8a014_zpskwmauer4.jpg



Considering, that a lot of crap is exported to the DR, is this a good or bad sign???? :cheeky:


donP

One conversation I had back before Xantrex purchased TRACE, the sales manager told me that the DR was the Viet Nam of inverter and battery testing. If their products could work well here, they could work well anywhere.

Hopefully your new batteries are genuine and will live long and prosper. It would be good to know what capacity they have to set the inverter properly for them.
 

donP

Newbie
Dec 14, 2008
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245 with 208 Ah

Hopefully your new batteries are genuine and will live long and prosper. It would be good to know what capacity they have to set the inverter properly for them.

I believe with good reason that are genuine (made in the US).
They most likely have 208 Ah and I set the inverters accordingly.
Naming them "245" shows that they are a DR model.... :pirate:

But then, how do we know how many Ah's the T-105 (sold here) have?? :rolleyes:
The label says 225 Ah...

donP
 

windeguy

Platinum
Jul 10, 2004
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I believe with good reason that are genuine (made in the US).
They most likely have 208 Ah and I set the inverters accordingly.
Naming them "245" shows that they are a DR model.... :pirate:

But then, how do we know how many Ah's the T-105 (sold here) have?? :rolleyes:
The label says 225 Ah...

donP

Be careful. Olly and/or the team might give you a presumptive dislike.

Regarding the US 245 being 208 AH, that makes perfect sense. Less room for lead and more room for acid, hence more applicable to use in the DR because of our warm temperatures all year.
 

william webster

Rest In Peace WW
Jan 16, 2009
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I think Olly hands out the 'likes' and the Team does the 'dislikes'......

keeps Olly's hands cleaner...... hahaha
 

donP

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Dec 14, 2008
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Weight Difference

Regarding the US 245 being 208 AH, that makes perfect sense. Less room for lead and more room for acid, hence more applicable to use in the DR because of our warm temperatures all year.

From websites:
US 1800 (= US 245) weighs 55 lbs.
Trojan T-105 is 62 lbs. (less the DR model???)

I see, lead is heavier than acid... :disappoin :pirate:

donP
 

windeguy

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Jul 10, 2004
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From websites:
US 1800 (= US 245) weighs 55 lbs.
Trojan T-105 is 62 lbs. (less the DR model???)

I see, lead is heavier than acid... :disappoin :pirate:

donP

The equal weight is certainly a strong clue that the US 245 could be a US 1800.
The US 2200 is also 62 lbs., which matches the Trojan T105 in weight.

I don't have a Trojan T-105 that I can weigh at the moment and you just sold yours.
 

donP

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Dec 14, 2008
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Weights and Opinion

The equal weight is certainly a strong clue that the US 245 could be a US 1800.
The US 2200 is also 62 lbs., which matches the Trojan T105 in weight.
Just to avoid a misunderstanding:
I took those weights from websites. I myself have never weighed a battery.

I don't have a Trojan T-105 that I can weigh at the moment and you just sold yours.

Not sold yet, I still have them.

donP

_____________________________________

BTW, I invited George Stratis, US Battery Regional Sales Manager Caribbean, to read this thread and give me his opinion... :classic:
 

windeguy

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Jul 10, 2004
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George Stratis should be able to state without a doubt if the US 245 is a re-labeled US 1800.

As for the Trojan battery, weigh one up if possible and see if it is 62 lbs.
 

donP

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Dec 14, 2008
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The Mystery Persists

As for the Trojan battery, weigh one up if possible and see if it is 62 lbs.

Done.
Although my scales may not be very precise:
The T-105 has 59.9 lbs, fluid level OK.

Now, did I have a genuine US Trojan battery or a DR version????? :rolleyes: :bunny: :cool:


donP
 

windeguy

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Jul 10, 2004
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Done.
Although my scales may not be very precise:
The T-105 has 59.9 lbs, fluid level OK.

Now, did I have a genuine US Trojan battery or a DR version????? :rolleyes: :bunny: :cool:


donP

With a 2 lb difference, that makes it a bit hard to tell. I don't have any information that would make a used battery weigh less than a new one, so that 2 lbs of difference is a mystery.

Is the scale accurate?
 

windeguy

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Jul 10, 2004
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Here is some good information in GEL batteries, in case people consider them. They must be charged more slowly than deep cycle lead acid batteries or they will outgas and be damaged. The outgassing happens on deep cycle wet cell lead acid batteries, but you add distilled water to them to take care of that.

This is from a battery FAQ at: Support - FAQs | OPTIMABATTERIES

15. What is a Gel Cell Battery?

A gel battery design is typically a modification of the standard lead acid automotive or marine battery. A gelling agent is added to the electrolyte to reduce movement inside the battery case.

Many gel batteries also use one way valves in place of open vents, this helps the normal internal gasses to recombine back into water in the battery, reducing gassing.

Now to answer your question about outgassing:

Normally, if you charge them at the specified rate, they should NOT outgas. The gasses in theory should be reabsorbed. However, they WILL outgas IF you charge them at too high of a rate. In that case, the one way valve will let the gas escape for safety, but if you are generating gas you're damaging the battery.

"Smart chargers" (like those supplied with the contest) are SUPPOSED to charge them at a low enough rate that will NOT cause them to outgas. (That's why they take so long to recharge.)
However, I have NOT personally run any tests on the supplied chargers, and as rookies we haven't experienced any battery failures to date so we have no data on their lifespan. I just have to assume FIRST insured the selected chargers are designed correctly for the supplied batteries. :)

BTW... If you look up the battery specs, you see you can VASTLY improve the total number of cycles on the batteries by keeping them fully charged and NOT deep cycling them. These are NOT NiCds. You shorten their lives by something like a factor of 10 or more by running them into the ground before recharging them. You should always recharge them fully after each use. So make it a habit that EVERY time you use a battery, even for a short test cycle, you put it back on the charger overnight afterwards.

The batteries also lose a small amount of charge per month to internal discharge resistance. Therefore, to keep them in best shape, you should try to stick each of your batteries on the smart charger overnight at least once a month to keep them "topped off". The charger shuts itself off when the battery is fully charged, so you won't harm them even if they seem fully charged when you put them on it (or if you forget and leave one on it for a week or two :) ).

We serial number our batteries, and keep a "battery log" posted on the wall in our storage room by the charging station so we know the charge history of each one, and keep one on the charger at all times in a rotating fashion.