Problems with Vaccines.. past and present.

NanSanPedro

Nickel with tin plating
Apr 12, 2019
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Jan 9, 2004
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The Soviet Produced Polio vaccines were 100% effective with no deaths or active infections.
They were based on the American developer’s own formula but with a different approach to the medium.

The western developed nations opted for the US manufactured shots, based on geopolitics.
Much like today with Sputnik V, the safest shot after millions meted out.

Politics at its worst face.
In the DR we received the Russian shots at the time, nobody complained.
So why is there so much reluctance by the Russian citizenry to take their own vaccine?



Respectfully,
Playacaribe2
 

PICHARDO

One Dominican at a time, please!
May 15, 2003
13,004
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Santiago de Los 30 Caballeros
Meanwhile
 

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Jan 9, 2004
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Because the western media campaign in discrediting it has been non-stop since day 1.
And is not Russia a country that heavily censors social media and the press..........much like China, North Korea, Iran etc. '

Of course, that is a rhetorical question,

But playing out your hand a little, if it is in fact western media as you suggest............then how little faith the citizens of Russia have in their own media or government or both........speaks volumes.


Respectfully,
Playacaribe2
 

SKY

Gold
Apr 11, 2004
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So you have a ONE in 100,000 chance of having a severe adverse effect by being vaccinated with Sinovac according to the chart posted above. But still better to wait a few years and take your chances in the street...................
 

jd426

Gold
Dec 12, 2009
8,171
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So you have a ONE in 100,000 chance of having a severe adverse effect by being vaccinated with Sinovac according to the chart posted above. But still better to wait a few years and take your chances in the street...................
You should take 2 Vaccines ... this way you have a One in 200,000.....
 

mobrouser

Bronze
Jan 1, 2002
2,293
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My point has always been couched in the reality that the vaccines are not 100% effective in preventing infections. Infected people can and do pass the virus on to others. For me, it's all about lowering the risk of getting a serious illness requiring hospitalization for myself and my loved one's that I come in contact with the most. The rest of the time I try very hard to stay away from other people whenever possible.

From your link: "Odds are far better for fully vaccinated people than for people who opt out..."
Which I think is the primary point for choosing to be vaccinated. Even if that means getting a vaccine that doesn't have the highest efficacy rate. It's not like they are handing you a vaccine menu to choose from when you go to a clinic in this country, or most countries for that matter. You get what they have on that day at that time. Getting something should be several degrees better than getting nothing in my estimation.
Just to be clear my link was to refute Cavok's claim that "So far, all of the vaccines have been 100% effective in preventing hospitalization and death." which is simply untrue.
My first comment was to temper your "potential spreader" statement. We are all potential spreaders, vaccinated or not.
 

cavok

Silver
Jun 16, 2014
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Just to be clear my link was to refute Cavok's claim that "So far, all of the vaccines have been 100% effective in preventing hospitalization and death." which is simply untrue.
My first comment was to temper your "potential spreader" statement. We are all potential spreaders, vaccinated or not.
A friend of mine got covid. He was hospitalized. For observation. Released the next day.

Did the three who died die "from" the vaccine, or "with" the vaccine?
 

XTraveller

Active member
Aug 21, 2010
286
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No first hand or direct report of anyone getting serious bad side effects or covid after getting the chinese vaccine here in the DR.
This is what I will use to determine if I take the vaccine here when my turn comes.
 

PICHARDO

One Dominican at a time, please!
May 15, 2003
13,004
663
113
Santiago de Los 30 Caballeros
And is not Russia a country that heavily censors social media and the press..........much like China, North Korea, Iran etc. '

Of course, that is a rhetorical question,

But playing out your hand a little, if it is in fact western media as you suggest............then how little faith the citizens of Russia have in their own media or government or both........speaks volumes.


Respectfully,
Playacaribe2


Not a bit. There’s very little censorship in Russia online. There’s no active filtering of news.
The low rate of vaccination in Russia has more to do with the old people mentality there. They reject anything they think they can avoid by keeping certain distance from Moscow.
Russians are very mindful of Moscow’s centrist policies. The people living in the outskirts of the city, see no reason to get vaccinated. The rates of infection outside of Moscow are practically very low.

I’ve been to Russia many times and can tell you they trust very little anything the central government says or does, because of the corruption in all levels.

They don’t even like talking politics, it’s a taboo subject with friends. Only families talk about it and most are always divided on their opinions.

The old reminisced about Soviet times, the young ones are Euro centric, but don’t trust them as well.

Unlike many believe in the West, most Russians are ok with Putin in power. They think he’s more harsh on the corruption than any other President.

Media in Russia is divided between Oligarchs. Each side supports their own interests.
People tend to read it or watch news and treat it like the Sun Mirror or National enquirer, foxnews...

If you want to test the waters of how open the online experience is in Russia, take a moment and use Yandex . ru to get a glimpse of how crazy 😜 it is there.

There’s no Millenium censorship in Russia’s online access.

The big news told on western media about a new internet firewall being put up in Russia, is grossly misleading and misrepresented.
They are creating a firewall to stop any attempts to shut down or redirect online traffic in the country from the outside.
Think banks, shopping, emergency, schooling, state sites, etc...
They have created a server that records most accessed international online sites and put that traffic in a up to the minute cache around two to three days old. If there are attacks or interruptions, online users in Russia would get a response from that cache of sites when the firewall is active, thus keeping a somewhat active experience.

The reason behind that, is to allow their techs to detect and identify the attacks or reroute traffic to other nodes in a more plausible time frame.

Far from the great firewall used in China and their censorship. The state must ask the content providers directly to remove stuff they deem violates any rules of their gov.

Take Navalny, I know first hand his popularity in Russia is null, only Moscow or St Petersburg can he find 14% or less in support from the population come the ballots.
His reputation in Russia is not any better than corrupted Oligarchs. He is deemed a white nationalist and racist by a many there.

I don’t understand how the West can even consider he has any chance at becoming a president there. It’s like electing the KKK chief or the DR nationalist party to power.

The only group that supports him on a national level is a doctor’s group he has been funding there. Everybody discards their news and public statements because of that. More corrupted people.

Most people would believe all the garbage put out in western media about Russia. I recommend you take a trip there to see it first hand and then form a personal opinion.
 

PICHARDO

One Dominican at a time, please!
May 15, 2003
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Santiago de Los 30 Caballeros

Official: Chinese vaccines' effectiveness low​




Once against western media’s misrepresentation of what he actually was referring to.
He was stating that vaccines needed to be addressed to improve their effectiveness versus the mutating virus. That as such the vaccines were not as effective if they didn’t addressed that.

Western media needs to be more truthful of their actions. It’s a sad example of how it manipulates the sources to present what they want to push.

Not as effective and not effective, are not one and the same.
 
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Jan 9, 2004
9,469
727
113
Not a bit. There’s very little censorship in Russia online. There’s no active filtering of news.
The low rate of vaccination in Russia has more to do with the old people mentality there. They reject anything they think they can avoid by keeping certain distance from Moscow.
Russians are very mindful of Moscow’s centrist policies. The people living in the outskirts of the city, see no reason to get vaccinated. The rates of infection outside of Moscow are practically very low.

I’ve been to Russia many times and can tell you they trust very little anything the central government says or does, because of the corruption in all levels.

They don’t even like talking politics, it’s a taboo subject with friends. Only families talk about it and most are always divided on their opinions.

The old reminisced about Soviet times, the young ones are Euro centric, but don’t trust them as well.

Unlike many believe in the West, most Russians are ok with Putin in power. They think he’s more harsh on the corruption than any other President.

Media in Russia is divided between Oligarchs. Each side supports their own interests.
People tend to read it or watch news and treat it like the Sun Mirror or National enquirer, foxnews...

If you want to test the waters of how open the online experience is in Russia, take a moment and use Yandex . ru to get a glimpse of how crazy 😜 it is there.

There’s no Millenium censorship in Russia’s online access.

The big news told on western media about a new internet firewall being put up in Russia, is grossly misleading and misrepresented.
They are creating a firewall to stop any attempts to shut down or redirect online traffic in the country from the outside.
Think banks, shopping, emergency, schooling, state sites, etc...
They have created a server that records most accessed international online sites and put that traffic in a up to the minute cache around two to three days old. If there are attacks or interruptions, online users in Russia would get a response from that cache of sites when the firewall is active, thus keeping a somewhat active experience.

The reason behind that, is to allow their techs to detect and identify the attacks or reroute traffic to other nodes in a more plausible time frame.

Far from the great firewall used in China and their censorship. The state must ask the content providers directly to remove stuff they deem violates any rules of their gov.

Take Navalny, I know first hand his popularity in Russia is null, only Moscow or St Petersburg can he find 14% or less in support from the population come the ballots.
His reputation in Russia is not any better than corrupted Oligarchs. He is deemed a white nationalist and racist by a many there.

I don’t understand how the West can even consider he has any chance at becoming a president there. It’s like electing the KKK chief or the DR nationalist party to power.

The only group that supports him on a national level is a doctor’s group he has been funding there. Everybody discards their news and public statements because of that. More corrupted people.

Most people would believe all the garbage put out in western media about Russia. I recommend you take a trip there to see it first hand and then form a personal opinion.



And yes my opinion is personal....and no I do not need to take anymore trips there....as I have first hand accounts from relatives.....and none of them would even consider the Sputnik vaccine.

Respectfully,
Playacaribe2
 

melphis

Living my Dream
Apr 18, 2013
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Today the top officials from China have said that Sinovac has low effectiveness (50.4%) on the first does. This is not new news. Brazil reported this in January. What is new is that China is finally agreeing to the results the rest of the world knows.

The second shot has seen effectiveness up to 83% with the second shot taken minimum 2 weeks later. Most countries are giving the second shot 28 days after the first. Some scientists say this could bring the effectiveness even higher.

All agree that people that have taken Sinovac and still caught the virus have NOT had severe symptoms and none needed hospitalization.

The WHO is still expected to add Sinovac to the approved list of emergency vaccines by the end of April.

Again all we have is the media trying to create hysteria. Old news. Let's move on.
 
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Cdn_Gringo

Gold
Apr 29, 2014
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Sinovac - perfect? no it is not. Safe to get for most people? It seems so based on currently available info/data. Better than nothing? Apparently even if only to mitigate the severity of any subsequent infection. Some on this forum should stop trying so hard to convince others to adopt a different set of geopolitical beliefs and attitudes towards vaccination in general. I would without hesitation get the Sinovac vaccine when it is offered to me. I am a little more weary of the Pfizer or Moderna shots but if that is all that was available to me, then my decision is either yes/no based on my needs to do something to get as much protection from CV19 as I can at that time. Apparently the pathological need for some here to have their views adopted by the many is strong as evidenced by their repeated statements that offer no new evidence, just more distrust in Govts, countries and science in general. Interested in decent and accurate information, not so much in personal opinions or political slants.
 
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