Problems with Vaccines.. past and present.

Status
Not open for further replies.

chico bill

Explosives Demolition Specialist
May 6, 2016
8,311
2,264
113
I am not a vaccine denier. I got jabbed.
Anyone who makes a personal decision to not get jabbed, I don't fault them. I encourage them to get it but mandating it is an absurdity.
There body, there choice.
But we must never tell someone something "is settled science", because it is never is, other than the earth is round.
There have been thousands of adverse reactions, some very severe, and hundreds of deaths due to vaccines.

You know your own body, so you are the best one to make a decision what you allow into it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: CottageCountry

Ecoman1949

Born to Ride.
Oct 17, 2015
1,952
490
83
Interesting how times have changed. As babies we received as first vaccinations at public health clinics. As kids in school we received diphtheria, pneumonia, tetanus, tuberculosis, mumps and polio vaccinations. It was all part living in the 50’s, 60’s, and 70’s. Our biggest population growth, the baby boom, occurred partly because we enjoyed good health due to advances in medial science, particularly antiviral pharmaceuticals.

Our parents never questioned the science or the efficacy of the vaccines. They were relieved when the vaccines were available. Our information sources were radio and TV. The information provided by the networks and Public Health agencies was never questioned when it came to protecting our health.

Now that we are older and information overload is the societal norm, we’ve become instant experts and question everything, sometimes risking our lives and the lives of our children on false information. Where is the wisdom in that? Don’t we still owe ourselves and our children the same degree of protection our parents wisely gave us? Don’t we want to stay healthy and watch our children and grandchildren grow up and enjoy what life has to offer? I certainly do.

Apparently some parents don’t think so for political and social reasons beyond my comprehension. Put the foolishness aside and get vaccinated. Not just for you but also for your extended family.
 

bob saunders

Platinum
Jan 1, 2002
29,415
2,848
113
dr1.com
Interesting how times have changed. As babies we received as first vaccinations at public health clinics. As kids in school we received diphtheria, pneumonia, tetanus, tuberculosis, mumps and polio vaccinations. It was all part living in the 50’s, 60’s, and 70’s. Our biggest population growth, the baby boom, occurred partly because we enjoyed good health due to advances in medial science, particularly antiviral pharmaceuticals.

Our parents never questioned the science or the efficacy of the vaccines. They were relieved when the vaccines were available. Our information sources were radio and TV. The information provided by the networks and Public Health agencies was never questioned when it came to protecting our health.

Now that we are older and information overload is the societal norm, we’ve become instant experts and question everything, sometimes risking our lives and the lives of our children on false information. Where is the wisdom in that? Don’t we still owe ourselves and our children the same degree of protection our parents wisely gave us? Don’t we want to stay healthy and watch our children and grandchildren grow up and enjoy what life has to offer? I certainly do.

Apparently some parents don’t think so for political and social reasons beyond my comprehension. Put the foolishness aside and get vaccinated. Not just for you but also for your extended family.
I agree but tblind trust led to this. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/21507989/
 

chico bill

Explosives Demolition Specialist
May 6, 2016
8,311
2,264
113
Interesting how times have changed. As babies we received as first vaccinations at public health clinics. As kids in school we received diphtheria, pneumonia, tetanus, tuberculosis, mumps and polio vaccinations. It was all part living in the 50’s, 60’s, and 70’s. Our biggest population growth, the baby boom, occurred partly because we enjoyed good health due to advances in medial science, particularly antiviral pharmaceuticals.

Our parents never questioned the science or the efficacy of the vaccines. They were relieved when the vaccines were available. Our information sources were radio and TV. The information provided by the networks and Public Health agencies was never questioned when it came to protecting our health.

Now that we are older and information overload is the societal norm, we’ve become instant experts and question everything, sometimes risking our lives and the lives of our children on false information. Where is the wisdom in that? Don’t we still owe ourselves and our children the same degree of protection our parents wisely gave us? Don’t we want to stay healthy and watch our children and grandchildren grow up and enjoy what life has to offer? I certainly do.

Apparently some parents don’t think so for political and social reasons beyond my comprehension. Put the foolishness aside and get vaccinated. Not just for you but also for your extended family.
True most vaccines have few side long term effects.
The difference here is they were FDA approved, with longer term testing.
OK we were in a pandemic and the rush was to try and get it under control.

But with approved vaccines you can receive compensation for a serious injury as a result of the vaccine.
If you were to experience paralysis from Covid or some other severe injury you have severe restriction for compensation, as the pharmacological manufacturers were given a 'pass'.
A lifetime of hospital bills might be the slight risk you take.
I'm old but healthy and strong, so I wasn't worried about getting vaccinated.

But if you suffer from other auto-immune or viral caused diseases, like Crohn's, Epstein Barr, Guillian-Barre, Bell's Palsy or Lupus (as examples), I think you would want to consult your long term care provider for advice on which, if any, vaccine would be suitable for your compromised immune system.

Certainly there are some on this forum that have one of those or similar conditions and I would like to hear if they got the vaccine and was there any reaction.

 

AlterEgo

Administrator
Staff member
Jan 9, 2009
20,818
2,396
113
South Coast
True most vaccines have few side long term effects.
The difference here is they were FDA approved, with longer term testing.
OK we were in a pandemic and the rush was to try and get it under control.

But with approved vaccines you can receive compensation for a serious injury as a result of the vaccine.
If you were to experience paralysis from Covid or some other severe injury you have severe restriction for compensation, as the pharmacological manufacturers were given a 'pass'.
A lifetime of hospital bills might be the slight risk you take.
I'm old but healthy and strong, so I wasn't worried about getting vaccinated.

But if you suffer from other auto-immune or viral caused diseases, like Crohn's, Epstein Barr, Guillian-Barre, Bell's Palsy or Lupus (as examples), I think you would want to consult your long term care provider for advice on which, if any, vaccine would be suitable for your compromised immune system.

Certainly there are some on this forum that have one of those or similar conditions and I would like to hear if they got the vaccine and was there any reaction.

I have a couple of auto-immune conditions, I was vaccinated in Feb/March with Moderna. No issues.
Our son and his wife (a doctor) both vaccinated, and will vaccinate their kids when age available.
Our daughter and her husband and sons, not vaccinated, refuse to discuss it. Very touchy.
So now with Delta, we’re not allowed around son’s family unless we’ve not been around daughter’s family at least two weeks. Since she lives nearby and we help out with the boys, I guess we won’t be seeing son or other grandkids for a long time. ☹️
 
  • Sad
Reactions: NanSanPedro

chico bill

Explosives Demolition Specialist
May 6, 2016
8,311
2,264
113
I have a couple of auto-immune conditions, I was vaccinated in Feb/March with Moderna. No issues.
Our son and his wife (a doctor) both vaccinated, and will vaccinate their kids when age available.
Our daughter and her husband and sons, not vaccinated, refuse to discuss it. Very touchy.
So now with Delta, we’re not allowed around son’s family unless we’ve not been around daughter’s family at least two weeks. Since she lives nearby and we help out with the boys, I guess we won’t be seeing son or other grandkids for a long time. ☹️
Well it seems sad one part of the family would impose such harsh restrictions on you visiting your daughter's family.
Especially if the son's family is vaccinated.
But since they live nearby and I assume your son is farther away and your helping with her grandkids you will carry on as is.
 

cavok

Silver
Jun 16, 2014
6,239
1,558
113
We will agree to disagree on that point. I continue to believe Si No Vac is more placebo like. Those efficacy numbers that I "quibble" about were produced by studies funded by the vaccine manufacturer that were in turn selected by and funded by the Chinese government.
There are now 6 or 7 countries that have done clinical trials. Even if they were all funded by China, which I doubt, I think it's cynical to believe that all those governments would falsify the results and then approve it for their citizens.
And those tests, like all efficacy tests, are done under ideal circumstances and a controlled environment.............that hardly reflects how it may perform longer term in the real world...........something that is now being discovered..............
Not ideal or controlled at all, but by nature are limited in scope ,and any one trial cannot duplicate every geographic environment, ethnic makeup, nor the type and extent of virus in circulation at that time. It's impossible to compare the vaccines unless they are done head-to-head in the same trial.

Efficacy numbers are not that important, especially now with the Delta variant and vaccinated/unvaccinated people are carrying the same viral load. What matters most is that a vaccine prevents hospitalization and death - and all of the vaccines are doing that very well.
 

SKY

Gold
Apr 11, 2004
11,160
1,372
113
Fortunatl
Efficacy numbers are not that important, especially now with the Delta variant and vaccinated/unvaccinated people are carrying the same viral load. What matters most is that a vaccine prevents hospitalization and death - and all of the vaccines are doing that very well.

Unvaccinated people are more likely to die of COVID-19 because they are more vulnerable to infection and severe disease​


 
Jan 9, 2004
9,728
948
113
There are now 6 or 7 countries that have done clinical trials. Even if they were all funded by China, which I doubt, I think it's cynical to believe that all those governments would falsify the results and then approve it for their citizens.

I too do not believe they falsified results, but merely did studies that interpreted the data differently or in a different more positive light had there not been a financial incentive. Follow the money.

China reaches out to the Butantan Institute in Brazil and offers their vaccine and other help (financial) for trials AND then agrees to allow the Butantan Institute to have control over its manufacture and distribution in Brazil. Butantan is a major supplier of vaccines etc., to the Brazilian government. Butantan secures a contract to test, manufacture and provide those vaccines. They report 95% efficacy in their trials and the rest is history.


Not ideal or controlled at all, but by nature are limited in scope ,and any one trial cannot duplicate every geographic environment, ethnic makeup, nor the type and extent of virus in circulation at that time. It's impossible to compare the vaccines unless they are done head-to-head in the same trial.
"Efficacy is the degree to which a vaccine prevents disease, and possibly also transmission, under ideal and controlled circumstances – comparing a vaccinated group with a placebo group. Effectiveness meanwhile refers to how well it performs in the real world. Although a vaccine that has high efficacy – such as Moderna’s COVID-19 vaccine with 94.5% efficacy and Pfizer’s with 90% efficacy – would be expected to be highly effective in the real world, it is unlikely to translate into the same effectiveness in practice."




Efficacy numbers are not that important, especially now with the Delta variant and vaccinated/unvaccinated people are carrying the same viral load. What matters most is that a vaccine prevents hospitalization and death - and all of the vaccines are doing that very well.
I do not disagree, however, what was the single most important factor the public was using in deciding which vaccine to take? People were comparing various vaccines seemingly singularly based on efficacy alone.

Unfortunately many of the vaccines have also caused deaths and have not prevented hospitalizations in many cases, and as stated before, I personally do not see enough of a risk/reward ratio to inject a substance that has yet to receive full approval (Pfizer may be fully approved in the next month), and for which you currently have little recourse if/when problems should arise.

It is a personal decision unless and until the risk/reward changes............

Respectfully,
Playacaribe2
 
  • Like
Reactions: DR fan1990

Ecoman1949

Born to Ride.
Oct 17, 2015
1,952
490
83
I agree but tblind trust led to this. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/21507989/
I agree Bob. Thalidomide was a designer drug developed primarily for pregnant woman suffering from severe morning sickness, not the preservation of human life. The side effects to the fetus were horrific. The designer drug early birth control pills were responsible for cancer in women due to their high hormone levels. Viagra, another designer drug can kill users if not taken properly. Taking any drug has risks including side effects and death.

The difference is, when vaccines are needed to counter infection and death on a worldwide scale, historically the benefits have so far outweighed the risks. More to the point, It’s the only option we have in today’s global village.
 

chico bill

Explosives Demolition Specialist
May 6, 2016
8,311
2,264
113
So the COVID-19 was partially engineered by the CDC. Something is starting to smell really like rotten fish about this whole pandemic.
And Fauci is right in the middle of all of it. _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
:


Research began in 1999, funded by Fauci (actually the American taxpayers), at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill which led to the April 19, 2002 US Patent 7279327 to create a “infectious replication defective coronavirus” to “target the human lung epithelium.” That’s not a vaccine, that’s a patent on a virus.

“In other words, we made SARS,” Martin said. “And we patented it on April 19, 2002 before there was ever any alleged outbreak in Asia, which as you know, followed that by several months…. (It) was not only engineered but could be synthetically modified in the laboratory, using nothing more than gene sequencing technologies, taking computer code and turning it into a pathogen, or an intermediate of the pathogen, and that technology was funded exclusively in the early days, as a means by which we could actually harness coronavirus as a vector to distribute HIV vaccine.”

That 2002 patent, by the way, transferred from UNC Chapel Hill to the NIH in 2018 and in 2019 “UNC Chapel Hill, NIAID and Moderna began the sequencing of a spike protein vaccine, a month before an outbreak ever happened” for COVID-19, Martin said.

The CDC filed for US Patent 7220852 in April 2003 and a series of derivative patents, like 7776521, were filed not only covering the SARS coronavirus gene sequences but also the detection tools, and the CDC paid bribes to keep the research private according to Martin.

Moderna was given insider information, according to Martin, months before COVID-19 emerged as what happened in 2003 and Sequoia Pharmaceuticals, part of the holdings of Pfizer and Johnson & Johnson, which obtained patent 7151163 before a virus was known. Martin said: “It is not physically possible for you to patent a thing that treats a thing that had not been published, because CDC had paid to keep it secret.”

That’s just a sampling of the patents Martin has investigated, but the script for the tyranny we’re living under now began in 2004 and the NIH’s in the Global Preparedness Monitoring Board’s, which included Fauci and Dr. Chris Elias of the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation on that board, “SARS and Bioterrorism.” That’s when the phrase “new normal” was coined and “was about getting people to accept a universal pan-influenza, pan-coronavirus vaccine.”

 

NanSanPedro

Nickel with tin plating
Apr 12, 2019
3,422
2,797
113
So the COVID-19 was partially engineered by the CDC. Something is starting to smell really like rotten fish about this whole pandemic.
And Fauci is right in the middle of all of it. _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
:


Research began in 1999, funded by Fauci (actually the American taxpayers), at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill which led to the April 19, 2002 US Patent 7279327 to create a “infectious replication defective coronavirus” to “target the human lung epithelium.” That’s not a vaccine, that’s a patent on a virus.

...”


Thanks CB. Interesting reading!
 

SKY

Gold
Apr 11, 2004
11,160
1,372
113

This is where it came from. You can also buy sweatshirts there if you like. Great reputation for news and longevity. Online for 2 years...............Where do people dig this up from?
 

NanSanPedro

Nickel with tin plating
Apr 12, 2019
3,422
2,797
113

This is where it came from. You can also buy sweatshirts there if you like. Great reputation for news and longevity. Online for 2 years...............Where do people dig this up from?

So the article is too difficult for you to comprehend.

We understand.
 
  • Sad
Reactions: BillyBall

Ecoman1949

Born to Ride.
Oct 17, 2015
1,952
490
83
So Chapel Hill lab may have been the place where Covid-19 escaped? Many media outlets stated last year that Covid was in the US before it was in China.

And let’s not forget the two Chinese scientist who were dismissed from the virus research lab in Canada for smuggling samples prior to the pandemic.

Conspiracy theories anyone!
 
  • Sad
Reactions: CottageCountry

jd426

Gold
Dec 12, 2009
8,434
1,289
113
Fortunatl

Unvaccinated people are more likely to die of COVID-19 because they are more vulnerable to infection and severe disease​



MORE LIKELY THAN >>>> WHO<<<<<<<<< Exact;y ???????

The term "More Likely" is a STATISTICAL TERM comparing 2 things or " SETS". Where are the STATS to back this up ?

And the real problem is in What TIME Frame ? does only imminent death count .. what about Long term Death ?

Then there is the problem of CHANGING TREATMENTS ... We were told certain Treatments did not work,. So many people DIED for NO Reason in the beginning.
Are those Numbers backed out ?

If you had said .. " Vaccinated people USUALLY have better OUTCOMES" then it would be accurate . or at least LEGAL in Court .
which coincidentally if you LISTEN to Ads for Hospitals for Like Cancer Treatment , is the exact Verbiage they USE... Or they would get their ARSES SUED off by a team of Lawyers .. for Blatant False Advertising .. And Cancer Treatments actually CAN PROVE they SAVE Lives .. compared to not doing anything at all ..

These Vaccines Aint PROVED ISHT !!!
 
  • Like
Reactions: NanSanPedro
Status
Not open for further replies.