Problems with Vaccines.. past and present.

OwnRules

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For the 'vaccine hesitant' folks on here, swollen testicles (blue balls?) are not a side effect of the vaccines - if that's the case might want to get an STD test instead.

Trinidad health minister is furious he had to waste time fact-checking Nicki Minaj's swollen testicles tweet

Trinidad's health minister isn't happy that officials had to waste "so much time" fact-checking a tweet from rapper Nicki Minaj about swollen testicles.

Terrence Deyalsingh, the health minister of Trinidad and Tobago, on Wednesday dismissed Minaj's claim that COVID-19 vaccines can cause impotence, The Hill reports. On Twitter, the rapper insisted earlier this week that "my cousin in Trinidad" has a friend who "became impotent" and whose "testicles became swollen" after he got vaccinated.

"There is absolutely no reported such side effect or adverse event of testicular swelling in Trinidad, or, I dare say … anywhere else in the world," Deyalsingh said.

Deyalsingh also appeared quite annoyed that he actually had to clarify this, explaining that "one of the reasons we could not respond" to the tweet earlier was that "we had to check and make sure" there was no truth to the claim...


Roughly 30 years ago, when I first got on the internet, I thought it would become the best source of instant knowledge humans had ever seen - the world's biggest library at our fingertips.

I was about as wrong as wrong can be - in fact, I was three towns past Wrong. See above for latest example.
 

cavok

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I'm not sure turning every cell in your body into spike protein nano-factories is a good idea(?). Are there ever any manufacturing defects?
 

cavok

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Agreed. But still faster and easier than developing your own. If it were not easier/faster to steal it, none of this likely would have taken place;
That pretty much goes without saying, doesn't it? Thieves steal things because it's easier and quicker than working and earning the money to buy them.

If they do develop (not steal) an mRNA vaccine, I certainly hope it has better results than the placebo-like Si-No Vac. For awhile they head-faked lots of countries............who are just now finally awakening.
You won't take any of the vaccines. Why are you so obsessed with Sinovac? You seem to have made it your mission in life to take every opportunity to post here and bash Sinovac without ever offering any factual basis for your claim that it is "placebo-like".
 
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chico bill

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China steals is a forgone conclusion. Case closed on that. And Dominicans are targeted by their stolen (and inferior) copies. And the price is the hook.

Look at the copy of the Yamaha Crypton being cloned by Tauro called "Fenix". Exact copy but inferior and half price.

So yes the Chinese will rebadge a mRna vaccine I'm sure - and the DR will distribute it gladly. Will it be inferior too? Will your health be risked?
 
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Jan 9, 2004
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That pretty much goes without saying, doesn't it? Thieves steal things because it's easier and quicker than working and earning the money to buy them.
Yes it does...........and China is perhaps the biggest thief of all.

You won't take any of the vaccines.
I never said that...........but surely I would not take Si No Vac. Perhaps many here did, thus the need to defend it.........and that is ok too.
Why are you so obsessed with Sinovac? You seem to have made it your mission in life to take every opportunity to post here and bash Sinovac without ever offering any factual basis for your claim that it is "placebo-like".

The initial claims (put out by the Chinese funded studies) of efficacy turned out to be untrue, so untrue that countries that once hailed it are now pivoting away from it. Why?

Has it worked for some........probably.............

Has it given a placebo like effect to others........probably.........

At the end of the day, you ask yourself............Am I going to inject a vaccine offered by those considered thieves and liars..........and then you make your decision.

Wondering out loud how many who took Si No Vac twice have or are now considering not taking a third dose of it and Why?

Your body body..............your choice................and I respect that opinion. Just don't expect everyone to believe what you believe.


Respectfully,
Playacaribe2
 

bob saunders

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Yes it does...........and China is perhaps the biggest thief of all.


I never said that...........but surely I would not take Si No Vac. Perhaps many here did, thus the need to defend it.........and that is ok too.


The initial claims (put out by the Chinese funded studies) of efficacy turned out to be untrue, so untrue that countries that once hailed it are now pivoting away from it. Why?

Has it worked for some........probably.............

Has it given a placebo like effect to others........probably.........

At the end of the day, you ask yourself............Am I going to inject a vaccine offered by those considered thieves and liars..........and then you make your decision.

Wondering out loud how many who took Si No Vac twice have or are now considering not taking a third dose of it and Why?

Your body body..............your choice................and I respect that opinion. Just don't expect everyone to believe what you believe.


Respectfully,
Playacaribe2
Virologist Gary Grohmann, who consults for the WHO, says the data deficit for the Chinese vaccines (as well as both the misinformation and propaganda swirling around them) make their performance hard to assess, but he expects they will prove about 50 per cent effective. As with other vaccines such as AstraZeneca and Pfizer, however, both Sinovac and Sinopharm still have a very high chance of stopping you from dying of COVID, the key measure of any vaccine’s success. (And, while monitoring for side-effects after vaccination is considered less thorough in both China and Russia, Toole says no safety concerns have been flagged.)
 

chico bill

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Virologist Gary Grohmann, who consults for the WHO, says the data deficit for the Chinese vaccines (as well as both the misinformation and propaganda swirling around them) make their performance hard to assess, but he expects they will prove about 50 per cent effective. As with other vaccines such as AstraZeneca and Pfizer, however, both Sinovac and Sinopharm still have a very high chance of stopping you from dying of COVID, the key measure of any vaccine’s success. (And, while monitoring for side-effects after vaccination is considered less thorough in both China and Russia, Toole says no safety concerns have been flagged.)
Good for we here DR - because most of us who got vaccinated early had no other vaccine choice.
Time will tell how many vaccinated later die of the Wuhan flu or variants and which vaccine is ineffective, but I doubt deaths after which vaccine is even tracked.
 

cavok

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Yes it does...........and China is perhaps the biggest thief of all.


I never said that...........but surely I would not take Si No Vac. Perhaps many here did, thus the need to defend it.........and that is ok too.
Maybe not exactly. You said you won't take any of the vaccines until you know what the long term affects are. You still haven't take one, right?
The initial claims (put out by the Chinese funded studies) of efficacy turned out to be untrue, so untrue that countries that once hailed it are now pivoting away from it. Why?
I have never seen any info that the studies by those countries were untrue(link?) and I've never seen any proof that they funded the studies - link? All countries want to get the best possible vaccine when available. I've also read that these third world countires are getting a discount and can buy Pfizer and others for less than Sinovac.
Has it worked for some........probably.............

Has it given a placebo like effect to others........probably.........
All of these vaccines have had a placebo-like effect in that many have died from covid despite being vaccinated.
At the end of the day, you ask yourself............Am I going to inject a vaccine offered by those considered thieves and liars..........and then you make your decision.
The fact that the Chinese lie and steal in order to gain technology in areas they don't has nothing to do with producing a vaccine(old technology - inactivated virus). Vaccine efficacy is dependent on dosage. I think they wanted to err on the safe side rather than having a lot of adverse reactions.
Wondering out loud how many who took Si No Vac twice have or are now considering not taking a third dose of it and Why?
I am definitely considering a Sinovac booster shot, but I haven't seen it recommended nor offered. I prefer inactivated virus vaccines = tried and proven over many decades with almost no adverse side effects - way fewer than any of the new vaccines.
Your body body..............your choice................and I respect that opinion. Just don't expect everyone to believe what you believe.
That would also be my advice to you. It doesn't matter to me what people believe about these vaccines, nor whether or not they they should get them.
 
Jan 9, 2004
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Maybe not exactly. You said you won't take any of the vaccines until you know what the long term affects are. You still haven't take one, right?

I thought my post was clear on the subject. I said I absolutely will not take Si No Vac. As to the others I had ranked them in order of my preference at that time. No, I have not taken one and will not until I determine a risk/reward I deem satisfactory.
I have never seen any info that the studies by those countries were untrue(link?) and I've never seen any proof that they funded the studies - link? All countries want to get the best possible vaccine when available. I've also read that these third world countires are getting a discount and can buy Pfizer and others for less than Sinovac.
You must be kidding. The Brazil study in Serrana touted 95% efficacy..............and who was the Brazilian Butantan Institutes "partner" in that study...................... why Si No Vac. There are more.............lots more. Country after country has abandoned Si No Vac....................particularly when they have better options. Why?
https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202106/1225031.shtml And note that the Global Times is a Chinese SOE.

All of these vaccines have had a placebo-like effect in that many have died from covid despite being vaccinated.

I think you are misconstruing what a placebo like effect is.
The fact that the Chinese lie and steal in order to gain technology in areas they don't has nothing to do with producing a vaccine(old technology - inactivated virus). Vaccine efficacy is dependent on dosage. I think they wanted to err on the safe side rather than having a lot of adverse reactions.
Au contraire.......the fact they lie and steal has everything to do with perceived trust and confidence. Not the kind of people one regularly wants to trust.

I am definitely considering a Sinovac booster shot, but I haven't seen it recommended nor offered. I prefer inactivated virus vaccines = tried and proven over many decades with almost no adverse side effects - way fewer than any of the new vaccines.
At this point it would appear that option (Si No Vac booster) is one of an outlier...............but as I said, people are free to make their own decisions to inject Si No Vac 3,4,5 times.............if it helps in furtherance of the placebo like effect on those individuals.

That would also be my advice to you. It doesn't matter to me what people believe about these vaccines, nor whether or not they they should get them.
Thank You. I hope the placebo like Si No Vac convinces people.......and it seems to have worked for some people..............the placebo like effect that is.

But with myriads of conflicting data.................I remain unconvinced



Respectfully,
Playacaribe2
 

cavok

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I thought my post was clear on the subject. I said I absolutely will not take Si No Vac. As to the others I had ranked them in order of my preference at that time. No, I have not taken one and will not until I determine a risk/reward I deem satisfactory.
I never saw you say you wouldn't take Sinovac(?). No need to - it's abundantly clear from your posts that you won't. If you want to quibble over whether you won't take it until long term effects are known vs risk/reward ratio - so be it.
You must be kidding. The Brazil study in Serrana touted 95% efficacy..............and who was the Brazilian Butantan Institutes "partner" in that study...................... why Si No Vac. There are more.............lots more. Country after country has abandoned Si No Vac....................particularly when they have better options. Why?
https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202106/1225031.shtml And note that the Global Times is a Chinese SOE.
Please review the terms "efficacy" and "Phase I trial", and read the link you posted again. First of all, the results in Serrano don't prove much other than efficacy is highly dependent on which variants are in circulation where the trial is being done - and many other factors. Trials were done in Sao Paulo and 11 other cities. Phase III trials resulted in an efficacy of 50.7%.

The "efficacy" quoted in the article is for the prevention of death only. Vaccine efficacy includes anyone with symptoms, those hospitalized(severe and non-severe cases), and death. Death is always a very small percentage of them.

The trail in Serrano was a Phase 1 trial. For safety reasons, only younger, healthy adults' are used, so, no surprise there was a better result there. I'm still waiting for you to back up your claim that the Chinese funded the clinical trials(?).
I think you are misconstruing what a placebo like effect is.
Not at all. The result for some people would have been the same if they had taken a placebo vs the vaccine. The very definition of a placebo.
Au contraire.......the fact they lie and steal has everything to do with perceived trust and confidence. Not the kind of people one regularly wants to trust.
Your trying to deduce apples from oranges. It's an affirmative consequence deduction fallacy.
At this point it would appear that option (Si No Vac booster) is one of an outlier...............but as I said, people are free to make their own decisions to inject Si No Vac 3,4,5 times.............if it helps in furtherance of the placebo like effect on those individuals.
You can repeat your, so far, totally baseless narrative as many times as you wish, but it will only be reality in your mind.
 
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SKY

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Why waste time with arguing with a "Broken Record"? Anyone living here knows the difference a year ago with no Sinovac and NOW after Sinovac rolled out in the Dominican Republic. If you don't know you are not here or dumb, deaf, and blind..........................
 

chico bill

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What seems apparent is that vaccines have very short-lived success (maybe 6-8 weeks) and they seem to be spawning mutations. Israel is the most vaccinated (probably over-vaccinated) country and they are now crashing from variants.
There maybe genetic markers or environmental factors as to why some countries do better (Sweden) and others worse (Israel) but vaccines may be not have been much more than placebos, particularly for the compromised vulnerable breakthrough patients.


Natural immunity from a populous that was unvaccinated maybe the best outcome we could have had and something now we can never know. (except perhaps Africa)

It is best to have on hand some ivermectin and doxycycline and take them in the proper dosages (there are varying recommendations) at the first sign of symptoms.

You can pooh pooh it but there are enough studies (including from doctors in DR) that show your chances of recovery are much greater if using these two drugs in combo as an early first response.
 
Jan 9, 2004
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I never saw you say you wouldn't take Sinovac(?). No need to - it's abundantly clear from your posts that you won't. If you want to quibble over whether you won't take it until long term effects are known vs risk/reward ratio - so be it.

I will let your statement "You won't take any of the vaccines" stand or fall on its own merit.........
Please review the terms "efficacy" and "Phase I trial", and read the link you posted again. First of all, the results in Serrano don't prove much other than efficacy is highly dependent on which variants are in circulation where the trial is being done - and many other factors. Trials were done in Sao Paulo and 11 other cities. Phase III trials resulted in an efficacy of 50.7%.

The "efficacy" quoted in the article is for the prevention of death only. Vaccine efficacy includes anyone with symptoms, those hospitalized(severe and non-severe cases), and death. Death is always a very small percentage of them.

The trail in Serrano was a Phase 1 trial. For safety reasons, only younger, healthy adults' are used, so, no surprise there was a better result there. I'm still waiting for you to back up your claim that the Chinese funded the clinical trials(?).

Exactly. That study and all the other studies did not prove much............but it did make for wonderful publicity............and it did convince many to take Si No Vac..........well before even the WHO approved Si No Vac for Emergency Use Authorization only. Which, of course begs the question, why so many blindly were willing to take it.

I guess you will have to define "partner" as the Chinese understand its meaning. What outcome did you expect after the Chinese were willing to provide the means necessary for Si No Vac to be tested.
Not at all. The result for some people would have been the same if they had taken a placebo vs the vaccine. The very definition of a placebo.

Your trying to deduce apples from oranges. It's an affirmative consequence deduction fallacy.

Call it what you will. I happen to not trust liars/thieves..........perhaps that is an affirmative consequence deduction fallacy...........or perhaps common sense.
You can repeat your, so far, totally baseless narrative as many times as you wish, but it will only be reality in your mind.
That narrative is that the Chinese are not to be trusted. That they have lied/covered up/silenced those who dared to offer evidence about the origins of Si No Vac and have funded dubious studies touting its prowess.

But as to it being baseless, the evidence is out there...........for those who choose to see it.

Why is Si No Vac still not accepted as a legitimate vaccine for entry into many countries?

And I fully understand the need for some to defend it and who took Si No Vac before sufficient testing and well before Emergency Use approval.

I am just not prone to believe liars/thieves.....................but it appears some do.

There body their choice...............and I respect that.


Respectfully,
Playacaribe2
 

Squat

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Jan 1, 2002
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Sinovac can't be that bad, because covid is almost gone from the DR. Which is not the case in those other countries with fancier vaccines.
 
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bob saunders

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I will let your statement "You won't take any of the vaccines" stand or fall on its own merit.........


Exactly. That study and all the other studies did not prove much............but it did make for wonderful publicity............and it did convince many to take Si No Vac..........well before even the WHO approved Si No Vac for Emergency Use Authorization only. Which, of course begs the question, why so many blindly were willing to take it.

I guess you will have to define "partner" as the Chinese understand its meaning. What outcome did you expect after the Chinese were willing to provide the means necessary for Si No Vac to be tested.




Call it what you will. I happen to not trust liars/thieves..........perhaps that is an affirmative consequence deduction fallacy...........or perhaps common sense.

That narrative is that the Chinese are not to be trusted. That they have lied/covered up/silenced those who dared to offer evidence about the origins of Si No Vac and have funded dubious studies touting its prowess.

But as to it being baseless, the evidence is out there...........for those who choose to see it.

Why is Si No Vac still not accepted as a legitimate vaccine for entry into many countries?

And I fully understand the need for some to defend it and who took Si No Vac before sufficient testing and well before Emergency Use approval.

I am just not prone to believe liars/thieves.....................but it appears some do.

There body their choice...............and I respect that.


Respectfully,
Playacaribe2
The WHO approved it before it arrived in the DR.
 

lifeisgreat

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May 7, 2016
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What seems apparent is that vaccines have very short-lived success (maybe 6-8 weeks) and they seem to be spawning mutations. Israel is the most vaccinated (probably over-vaccinated) country and they are now crashing from variants.
There maybe genetic markers or environmental factors as to why some countries do better (Sweden) and others worse (Israel) but vaccines may be not have been much more than placebos, particularly for the compromised vulnerable breakthrough patients.


Natural immunity from a populous that was unvaccinated maybe the best outcome we could have had and something now we can never know. (except perhaps Africa)

It is best to have on hand some ivermectin and doxycycline and take them in the proper dosages (there are varying recommendations) at the first sign of symptoms.

You can pooh pooh it but there are enough studies (including from doctors in DR) that show your chances of recovery are much greater if using these two drugs in combo as an early first response.
They started the strongest but failed to get enough vaxed only 58% of eligible people vaccinated..that’s why there scrambling get more vaxed :(
 
Jan 9, 2004
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The WHO approved it before it arrived in the DR.

The WHO approved it for Emergency Use on June 1, 2021.

There are posts here referencing receiving the Sinovac jab in the DR in April…….well before its Emergency Use Authorization.

Respectfully,
Playacaribe2
 

SKY

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Apr 11, 2004
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Sinovac can't be that bad, because covid is almost gone from the DR. Which is not the case in those other countries with fancier vaccines.
Why let FACTS get in the way with a good argument on a Dominican Forum among "Experts" that know NOTHING.................